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Old 05-31-2017, 03:21 PM
 
22,768 posts, read 30,670,896 times
Reputation: 14737

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Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel View Post
No, you claimed this was a specific socioeconomic class. Now tell us all, which one is it?
Whichever one you complainers are in, where y'all raise children who fail to leave home.

Quote:
If you want actual facts, about a third of adult Millennials are still living at home. This is higher than seen in the last 130 years.
For First Time in Modern Era, Living With Parents Edges Out Other Living Arrangements for 18- to 34-Year-Olds | Pew Research Center
No, it's actually lower than it was in 1940, which was 77 years ago. I don't know if you can read the chart or not.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:26 PM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,478 posts, read 59,660,138 times
Reputation: 24860
I am the Baby Boomer you complain about. I effectively went to work at my alcoholic step father's amusement park home made amusement park obsession at about 7 years old. I joined the Navy for some cash. After a year on the Mekong River I realized they could not pay me enough to stay there. I returned home to a very depressed upstate NY but was lucky enough to move to a place with good jobs and a family that financed part of a college education. After many diversions we wound up retiring after our condo was paid off (never had enough money for a free standing house) and am having a decent retirement. As I get older the insanity is beginning to return. Thankfully I am getting some help with a very bad temper from some of my 'Nam experiences.


I was not one of the "baby boomers" that were given 10 million bucks to play with and became fabulously wealthy while cheating banks and countless small contractors. When the Western banks gave up on this guy he apparently turned to borrowing form the Russian Mob. We are starting to pay off that debt. That man is the "baby boomer" that ripped off the rest of us.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:26 PM
 
11,523 posts, read 14,611,972 times
Reputation: 16821
Quote:
Originally Posted by ExNooYawk2 View Post
I sympathize with the OP. It must be so frustrating to graduate from college with debt, high housing costs and no health insurance. Things have definitely changed since the post-war economy in the 1950s.

But.

I would ask the OP to take a look at what the tax rates were back then. The super wealthy paid super taxes. The top tax rate was 91%. The corporate rate, without all the loopholes, was 52%. There was more money to be spent by the government on citizens and circulate in the economy.

As fewer people accumulated more wealth and kept it away from taxation, the country took a nosedive since the 1970s. There was less money in circulation among the middle class and more held by the supremely wealthy in overseas banks, expensive properties and treasury bills.

Think about how all this adds up to what millennials face today. Boomers didn't seize wealth, it was gradually taken away from our children's generation.
This.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:30 PM
 
Location: Meggett, SC
11,011 posts, read 10,996,345 times
Reputation: 6191
Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
Whichever one you complainers are in.

No, it's actually lower than it was in 1940, which was 77 years ago. I don't know if you can read the chart or not.
You're the one who made the claim. Back it up. Which socioeconomic group were you referring to? See. You have no idea what I or the other poster make and that's why you won't give an answer. So come on now, tell us all what socioeconomic group were you referring to in your claim.

As to the article, that 130 year figure was in reading the article but yes, it peaked in 1940 when it was only slightly higher for adults 18-34 to live at home than it is today (35 to 32 percent respectively). Doesn't change the fundamental fact that more adult Millennials are living at home than in 77 years then instead of 130 as the article misstated. 77 years, that's still now good you know.

ETA: I'm not worried about my kid. Oh and nice effort at trying to make a dig at my parenting skill there. Too bad it was a fail. She's not living at home. But I can and do recognize the issue nonetheless.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:33 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,482,550 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by UbbyJuice View Post
The OP is correct, much to the chagrin of the detractors and older people in this thread.
Here is why:

Average babyboomer - usually independent fresh out of high school, no welfare needed, "launches" right away

Walks out of high school STRAIGHT into a living wage or higher career that lasts 10-20 years or more (didn't even need "college degrees" to get good jobs back then), few if any layoffs or worrying about job insecurity due to the strong economy. The stability provided by "being in the right place, at the right time" in 1950-1970 era America and such good wages and steady work allowed the rising boomer to quickly attract a young wife and buy a house while very young. By the way, houses were dirt-cheap as the boomers were coming up, $20k-$60k for a decent house was not unheard of. The ones who got in real early managed to snag $15k houses. As time went by these boomers rode on the "wave" of inflation with ever increasing equity in their houses (sometimes in the 6-figures of free money) and rising wages/regular promotions at work, they were on "the receiving end" of the American economy.

Average millennial circa 2010's - can't afford independence until late 20's/early 30's, needs welfare, uses roommates, lives at home, etc

Walks out of high school and can't find any living wage jobs at all. Has to go to "college", using 5-figure (or more) student loans to do so, to even be considered for entry level jobs. Sometimes 2 or 3 degrees are needed due to the market being oversaturated with college degree holders. When he gets out of college, he struggles to find work and the competition for the few remaining "good" jobs is fierce. He might go a year or two before actually landing a job in his field of study. When he finally does land a decent entry-level job, he is CONSTANTLY worried about the economy and the threat of sudden layoffs. As women are mainly attracted to money and stability in a man, he might go a decade or more before he makes enough to attract a mate. In the meantime, he will be stuck renting and paying off his student debts for years, forget qualifying for a mortgage as his debt-to-income ratio makes him ineligible. And when he finally does get into a position to buy a property? He finds houses are now ASTRONOMICALLY expensive compared to the $20k-$60k his father paid decades ago. As time goes on millennials are drowned by the "wave" of inflation as rents, property values, cost of living, etc are constantly going up, while wages stay flat at work, they are on "the losing end" of the American economy.

Maybe a little over-simplistic, but what I wrote is true in a "general" sense; the boomers had life "on easy mode" compared to millennials, and this is not really up for debate.
And who's choice was it to attend these colleges blindly without researching, these as you admit, over saturated job/career markets?

Can't blame boomers for that...

I promise you 10,000 in 100 dollar bills, you force an entire generation the ones that are within 5 years of college age, to stay home and work for 2-5 years in skilled trades before going to college... you will see colleges implode on tuition prices!!! Supply and demand.

Don't follow along like blind sheep thinking or being trained to think you need a college degree to make a good living. Alot of what happens to folks of my generation, that hasn't been mentioned yet, going off to school, take courses, find out that career path ain't all its cracked up to be... drop out, wind up slinging drinks or waiting tables. That's OK mommy and daddy think your special, so special you be moved back in and free rent and still have chores LOL.

My generation will only fail if that's what they accept at their own peril. It won't be because they changed the game or tried to and failed, it will be due to accepting defeat and tapping out, taking pee down their backs and told it's rain. Not because they applied themselves and stood up for themselves or realised they were chasing a pipe dream for a career while it's being outsourced...

There are many opportunities out there. If you don't try you won't know. I keep hearing comparisons of Appalachia and Detroit when I do talk about this...


You can't excuse someone from not seeing the writing on the wall and being naive to believe their comfortable career wasn't on the chopping block... If I were working in GM putting chevys together, and watched the news about public announcements of factories closing, I'd have my house on the market or be looking for a relative area to apply my skillswithin a 50 mile radius. Ride it til the wheels fall off, what do you expect to happen?

If I were digging coal and constructing mine shafts, guess where I'd be? Looking in areas relative to constructing under ground or operating heavy equipment. I met a guy from coal country, he worked in NYC with subway maintenance and inspecting tunnels... he was one of the smart ones that got out... not jump on the dole... or cry foul even rightfully so for having their product demonized by environmentalists...
He chose to take the risk. He rides the train from Hudson down to NYC. Settled in the Catskills reminded him of home with all of the mountains. It was either starve and let his kids go without and maintain the close friendships and family ties, or go stone cold throw emotion to the side and do what's in his and his family's best interest.

To lay down and take it and say well that's all folks, I tried, now where's my participation trophy? and to have others excuse it? Come on give me a break.
Everything I've endured has been a challenge and I embrace it. I wouldn't have it any other way. If I did take the easy way out, I'd have inherited my father's businesses and been tied down in NY still, while he retired to florida and I cut the checks for him to do so... Nah. Went my own way. Made it my mission in life never to be confused with someone born with the silver spoon. Go from riches to rags, back to riches. Have nobody to blame, let alone an entire generation at that, for my successes and failures. And it's not from a lack of trying, or simply by showing up...

I won't see things from that perspective that boomers or anyone had it easier.

Simple question which is completely relevant yes or no.
Are there opportunities to succeed in this country both back then and now? Yes or no?

I don't want to hear there were more opportunities back then, because there are markets that exist today that didn't back then, and markets that existed back then that don't exist today.

I don't care if it's 1950 or 2050. Your pipes are going to clog, and in colder climates are going to freeze and burst.
Your mode of transportation, regardless how simple or complex are still going to need maintenance and repairs.
Still going to need human hands to climb bridges and weld.
Still going to need someone to drive big rigs.
Still going to need doctors nurses and pharmacists.
Still going to need someone to get up and fix a leaking or damaged roof.
Still going to need someone to grow and harvest your food even with heavy equipment.
Still going to need someone to patrol your neighborhoods to ensure its safe.
Still going to need someone to come put that fire out.
Still going to need someone to scrape you off the floor and load you into the meat wagon.
Still going to need someone to fly your plane when you travel.
Still going to need someone to fix and maintain the automated machines that assemble goods...
Still going to need to talk to a salesman of some sort to acquire a mode of transportation, or dwelling...
Still going to need someone to file your taxes to ensure you aren't being taken for a ride or make an error on your behalf that winds up with that tax man knocking on the front door.
Elevators that need fixing.

I can go on...

Roll your sleeves up, get your thumb out of your mouth, set your alarm clock for 5am, lace up your boots. There's roads needing fixing, houses crumbling, a wall needing building, and beer to drink after 5.
I can't help you if you refuse to help yourself...
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:33 PM
 
Location: Londonderry, NH
41,478 posts, read 59,660,138 times
Reputation: 24860
Ex NY 2 - clearly explained what happened. The tax laws changed and a few wealthy stole all the profits from everyone else. Why do you think the billionaires bought both political parties for the last 50 years?


I believe we need to reinstate the tax rates of the 1950's. We could start with counting all income, including calculated, but not taken, capital gains, inheritance, criminal sales, as taxable income and then deducting an amount equal to the 90th percentile so the top 10% pay all the federal taxes.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:37 PM
 
22,768 posts, read 30,670,896 times
Reputation: 14737
Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel View Post
You're the one who made the claim. Back it up. Which socioeconomic group were you referring to?
Whichever one y'all are in where all these problems exist.

Quote:
See. You have no idea what I or the other poster make
oh, it's not about money

if the people around you are that bad at raising children, that's a socioeconomic problem.

Quote:
As to the article, that 130 year figure was in reading the article
well it was wrong. incorrect. made up.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:37 PM
 
19,491 posts, read 12,122,052 times
Reputation: 26263
Quote:
Originally Posted by southbel View Post
No, you claimed this was a specific socioeconomic class. Now tell us all, which one is it?

If you want actual facts, about a third of adult Millennials are still living at home. This is higher than seen in the last 130 years.
For First Time in Modern Era, Living With Parents Edges Out Other Living Arrangements for 18- to 34-Year-Olds | Pew Research Center
I had said working/middle class where I live so that poster probably decided it was a trash area of morons or something.

In reality of course a lot of rich spoiled trust fund kids do nothing all their lives, it has just extended to middle classes whereas previously this was not acceptable. Everyone worked, and people who were not trust fund wealthy simply had to work, particularly young healthy people. It was an exciting time to look toward your future. The waste of potential is sad in these kids (some even gifted) with no ambition or desire to discover their skills and talents, instead taking advantage of those who love them the most.

I would say that poster does know of people in this situation, just may not be aware. Parents cover for them.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:39 PM
 
Location: On the Chesapeake
45,113 posts, read 60,214,676 times
Reputation: 60714
Quote:
Originally Posted by le roi View Post
It's not my job to provide statistics to support other peoples' anecdotal claims about the people they know.

I called people out for being innummerate and not having the capacity to look at or understand data, since we'd gone about a dozen pages with nothing but idiotic anecdotes about so-and-so's sister's daughter's friends' work ethic. I was told to "provide something." I provided something and now y'all are too lazy to even read it, claiming that reading an article you asked for is too much work for you.



What claim did I make? That y'all are innumerate? I'm not sure that can be proven.



What is, the article you said you didn't read?



Example of what, precisely?

What in gods green earth are you babbling about?
Are you hitting the pipe? Short term memory loss maybe? Examples of profligacy, for one. You know, you made the claim. You do remember don't you?

Like I said, you make tons of claims but never have examples.

Another one is the one you always make is the one about how Boomers had an easy job market to enter in the 1950s. When they were in elementary school. Or diapers.
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Old 05-31-2017, 03:41 PM
 
Location: Suburb of Chicago
31,848 posts, read 17,543,036 times
Reputation: 29384
Every generation has its share of cats and dogs. The dogs are jumping up and down, excited and enthusiastic and raring to get going and the cats are lying around in the sun.

The Millennials have a higher percentage of cats than previous generations, but most of them are dogs.

You can tell who the cats and dogs are here by their posts.
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