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I just hope Trump cuts funding to sanctuary cities
What does that have to do with the elimination of a particular scholarship program in California?
If you want to talk about Trump and sanctuary cities, that's fine, but that is a national political issue, and so you should start a thread in the Politics forum to discuss that.
But here we are talking about the possible elimination of a particular scholarship program in California, so let's stick to the topic at hand.
What does that have to do with the elimination of a particular scholarship program in California?
If you want to talk about Trump and sanctuary cities, that's fine, but that is a national political issue, and so you should start a thread in the Politics forum to discuss that.
But here we are talking about the possible elimination of a particular scholarship program in California, so let's stick to the topic at hand.
If sanctuary cities ended, and illegals deported, there would be no need to fund illegals in the schools.
If sanctuary cities ended, and illegals deported, there would be no need to fund illegals in the schools.
But the scholarship program under discussion would still be considered for elimination because undocumented students are not the reason it is being eliminated.
By the way, did you know that undocumented students make up less than 1% of students attending public colleges in California. In the UC and CSU systems, it's less than 1%. The only "funding" that these students all qualify for is in-state tuition. In the entire UC system, there are less than 1000 undocumented students receiving instate tuition.
A small percentage may also qualify for the Cal Grant if they have a 3.0 GPA in college prep classes, meet income requirements and have been approved for temporary residence under DACA (a Federal program). But, the Cal Grant is not automatically given to every undocumented student (or every U.S. citizen).
Nationally, about a fifth of undocumented students never graduate from high school, let alone attend college. Only about 5% of all undocumented students ever enroll in college --- less than 2% of all of the college students in the U.S. (That includes public and private colleges).
But, again, the scholarship program under discussion is not being ended because of undocumented students. So, sanctuary cities really aren't pertinent to this discussion. If folks want to discuss whether the middle class scholarship should be eliminated, let's do that. But, let's stick to the topic and not try to drag in other issues that are NOT the reason for the proposed elimination of this program from the state's budget.
I can certainly see how reading a headline like "Middle class scholarships being cut for illegal immigrants" could get some people upset.
But, let's take a deep breath and look at some of the facts behind what is actually being proposed:
First, if your child is already receiving the middle class scholarship, under Brown's proposal, they'll continue to receive it as long as your family is eligible under the current income restrictions.
Second, the middle class scholarship was awarded after all other need based aid was awarded, such as Federal student loans, grants, etc. Students will still be able to access those programs and they will still be eligible to apply for other scholarships offered by the UCs and Cal States.
Third, for "middle class families" earning $100,000 - $150,000, the "scholarship" was amount was very small - something like $300 a year if you're at the top of the cut off.
Fourth, since there was no minimum income requirement for the "middle class scholarship" a sizable portion of kids who received it were actually not middle class at all. They won't lose their money; it's just going to be reassigned. Those kids will still be eligible for Cal Grants.
Fifth, undocumented students do not receive "free" college education in California. They are eligible for in-state tuition if they have graduated from a California high school. They are not eligible for any Federal financial aid. If they have maintained a 3.0 UC GPA, have applied for DACA (a FEDERAL program), and their family meets the income restrictions for a Cal Grant, then they may receive a Cal Grant, just like other California students from low income families. But, the Cal Grant does not cover the full cost of attending a UC or Cal State.
By the way, California is not the only state that gives in-state tuition to undocumented students. 18 other states do too. And in California, the decision to do that was made LONG before Gov. Brown came into office. Blame it on Gray Davis if you want.
I certainly understand how families earning $100,000 - $150,000 will be disappointed that their children won't get an extra $300 - $500 a year once this program is eliminated.
But, their children will still be eligible for other UC and Cal State scholarships as well as need-based financial aid. And, if your main goal is to get a big scholarship for you child, this actually wasn't the best way to do so. The biggest scholarships are given out by private colleges, so if you want a big scholarship, you and your child should be looking at private colleges as well as the UCs and Cal States.
Again, I certainly understand how families earning above $100,000 will be disappointed to hear this news. Every little bit certainly helps when it comes to paying for college. And, in fairness, with the endless state budget situation here, there are probably many things our state could do to cut the cost of attending our public institutions. But, it's not just as simple as "don't let undocumented kids have instate tuition."
Their children can pay student loans like the tens of thousands of us who funded our own education here in CA.
I never qualified for financial aid, I had to pay for undergrad and graduate school. Most of my friends and family members who got an education are in the same boat.
Their children can pay student loans like the tens of thousands of us who funded our own education here in CA.
Undocumented students are not eligible for Federal student loans (or any other Federal financial aid programs). In my experience as a school counselor, many of the small number of undocumented students who go to college DO borrow to pay for it (using private loans and credit cards) to pay for college, just like everyone else.
But back to the middle class scholarship. Rosa, do your children currently attend college in California and do they receive the middle class scholarship?
If so, and it isn't too personal a question, can you give us a ballpark estimate of how much your family receives per student for this scholarship?
I would love to get a better idea of how this proposal might affect individual families in California.
Undocumented students are not eligible for Federal student loans (or any other Federal financial aid programs). In my experience as a school counselor, many of the small number of undocumented students who go to college DO borrow to pay for it (using private loans and credit cards) to pay for college, just like everyone else.
But back to the middle class scholarship. Rosa, do your children currently attend college in California and do they receive the middle class scholarship?
If so, and it isn't too personal a question, can you give us a ballpark estimate of how much your family receives per student for this scholarship?
I would love to get a better idea of how this proposal might affect individual families in California.
Oh, what I meant was, for those who wouldn't qualify for the middle class scholarship, they can take out student loans.
I do not have children yet, but when I went to college, I tried to be smart about it.
I tried to steer away from the pressure to go straight to university directly from high school to take advantage of the affordability of community college. I went to community college 2 years, then transfered to a UC school. I worked while in school and paid for most of my tuition. I then went to graduate school and deliberately chose a state school since it is cheaper. Here I did have to take out loans, I had to stop working to do research and internships.
I also stayed living at home to not have to rack up more debt. Because of these decisions, I kept my debt at about 17,000$ for two degrees.
Oh, what I meant was, for those who wouldn't qualify for the middle class scholarship, they can take out student loans.
I do not have children yet, but when I went to college, I tried to be smart about it.
I tried to steer away from the pressure to go straight to university directly from high school to take advantage of the affordability of community college. I went to community college 2 years, then transfered to a UC school. I worked while in school and paid for most of my tuition. I then went to graduate school and deliberately chose a state school since it is cheaper. Here I did have to take out loans, I had to stop working to do research and internships.
I also stayed living at home to not have to rack up more debt. Because of these decisions, I kept my debt at about 17,000$ for two degrees.
Wise course and why should the State help anyone who is here illegally at any rate, when what you did can be done as well by ... anyone?
Wise course and why should the State help anyone who is here illegally at any rate, when what you did can be done as well by ... anyone?
Well, truth be told, that's what most undocumented students in California who enroll in college are doing. Most don't go to UCs or Cal States, but to Community Colleges and aside from instate tuition, most don't get any state aid and none get Federal financial aid.
To pay for college, they work (under DACA they legally can), their parents/families contribute, they apply for the limited number of scholarships that they are eligible to apply for. Unlike Rosa, they're not eligible for Federal financial aid, so they cant take out low cost Federal student loans like she did, but many borrow the money for their college expenses using credit cards and bank loans.
But again, only a small percentage of undocumented students go to college at all and only 1% of students enrolled in public higher education in California are undocumented, so we're talking relatively small numbers being "helped" with instate tuition and an even smaller percentage who qualify for a Cal Grant.
Oh, what I meant was, for those who wouldn't qualify for the middle class scholarship, they can take out student loans.
I do not have children yet, but when I went to college, I tried to be smart about it.
I tried to steer away from the pressure to go straight to university directly from high school to take advantage of the affordability of community college. I went to community college 2 years, then transfered to a UC school. I worked while in school and paid for most of my tuition. I then went to graduate school and deliberately chose a state school since it is cheaper. Here I did have to take out loans, I had to stop working to do research and internships.
I also stayed living at home to not have to rack up more debt. Because of these decisions, I kept my debt at about 17,000$ for two degrees.
Rosa, I really like your comment because you are stressing personal responsibility for education. I guess that is why I am not too bothered by the idea that the "middle class" scholarship for families earning $100,000 - $150,000 might be ended. It's my understanding that that it amounts to about $300 a year for those families.
Now, everyone would like to have an extra $300 in their pocket, but I really wonder why most families making $150,000 a year couldn't easily come up with that amount if the scholarship is eliminated. Heck, a motivated college kid could make $300 in a couple of weekends over the summer babysitting, waiting on tables, etc.
One thing I learned very quickly as both a school counselor and a private college counselor is that a large number of families don't really save anything at all or have any plan for their kids' college expenses.
Yet, they get really upset when they discover that there is NO free ride for college for their kids (and that is true for undoc kids too). Even extremely wealthy families often don't feel they should have to pay anything for college.
Now, we all want deals in life, and we also all want the best for our children. But, I do agree with Rosa that at a certain point, one needs to take responsibility for paying for your child's education or for your own education. And, that goes for all parents and ALL students, citizens or not.
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