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Being in a state put's you under the jurisdiction of it's laws, that's the very nature of the state. The state just is, maaan. You must escape the state.
I knew I shouldn't have clicked because I'd just see the same old arguments....but here I am.
It comes down to this - if someone takes something that belongs to you without your consent, it's theft. So, the only way to argue that taxation isn't theft is to argue that everybody consents to it.
So....the problem is that every argument I see where people say "you consent to taxation" would NEVER be used for anyone but the government. Replace the government with anyone else and people would just laugh. Making a special moral exception for the government is called "special pleading" - a logical fallacy.
The only reasons to deny that it's theft are A) you haven't put much thought into it, or B) you're afraid of the implications of it, so your emotions cloud things. Objectively, it's theft, but that makes people uncomfortable...and I think it should.
Your Constitution gives the Federal Government the right to tax you.
The US is not a democracy. You get to elect people who decide,in theory, what's best for the country which may or may not be what you consider best for you.
We are all free to renounce our citizenships and seek freedom elsewhere.
I knew I shouldn't have clicked because I'd just see the same old arguments....but here I am.
It comes down to this - if someone takes something that belongs to you without your consent, it's theft. So, the only way to argue that taxation isn't theft is to argue that everybody consents to it.
So....the problem is that every argument I see where people say "you consent to taxation" would NEVER be used for anyone but the government. Replace the government with anyone else and people would just laugh. Making a special moral exception for the government is called "special pleading" - a logical fallacy.
The only reasons to deny that it's theft are A) you haven't put much thought into it, or B) you're afraid of the implications of it, so your emotions cloud things. Objectively, it's theft, but that makes people uncomfortable...and I think it should.
Being in a state put's you under the jurisdiction of it's laws, that's the very nature of the state. The state just is, maaan. You must escape the state.
I would say it's doing more to endanger my life than protect me but let's say you're right. The military is providing a service for me.
Again, logical consistency time.
I decide to shovel all the driveways on your street to make some money. Snows overnight, I clear your drive, knock on your door and say "I shoveled your drive so give me $20".
Do you pay me? I provided a service over a geographic area I decided to work in.
I never consented to your service.
Quote:
* Also, I have a gun and if you say no I may fine/cage/or kill you
Unless I consented, then you have no right to force me to provide funds. If I consented, then decide after that I don't want to pay you, you're within your rights to extract the payment.
That's a bad analogy anyways. A better one is a party with a cover charge of $50. If I enter your party and you then inform me that I must pay $50 to stay, then I have the choice to either leave or pay. Same as you and taxes, don't want to pay? Then leave.
That theft, man. That theft. I still think the only viable solution to stop the state from stealing from you is escaping the grasp of the state. That state, man. That state.
Unless I consented, then you have no right to force me to provide funds. If I consented, then decide after that I don't want to pay you, you're within your rights to extract the payment.
That's a bad analogy anyways. A better one is a party with a cover charge of $50. If I enter your party and you then inform me that I must pay $50 to stay, then I have the choice to either leave or pay. Same as you and taxes, don't want to pay? Then leave.
I never consented to the government's services either.
You can't leave the country without paying exit fees.
Sorry. Try again.
Also, private property is different. It is an extension of self-ownership. I'm on your property at the party. You can kick me out at any time.
Try again.
You'll find there's no way to be logically consistent unless you embrace the following two principles:
1. The non-aggression principle. Don't initiate force.
2. Respect for private property rights which is an extension of self-ownership and upholding principle #1 (NAP).
That theft, man. That theft. I still think the only viable solution to stop the state from stealing from you is escaping the grasp of the state. That state, man. That state.
Great response.
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