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Parents do not raise their children in a religion to harm them; they do so out of love and caring. I want my daughter to have as fulfilling a relationship with Christ as I do.
I plan to raise my daughter to respect others beliefs; but I am a Christian. I will not be teaching her that Allah or Buddha are substitutes for Christ; just as I do not expect Muslims or Buddhists to teach their children that Christ is a substitute for them. That's just the way it is. Everyone in America is free to worship as they please, or to not worship at all. Religion becomes a problem when you judge others and impose your views on them.
I submit that it is more harmful for adults to force children to believe in religious dogma than for adults to force children to have sex with adults.
Children can recover from sexual abuse. They can't recover from the loss of their power to reason.
If they're forced to believe that irrational "miracles" are true, before they have their rational faculties fully developed, the rational faculties will cease to develop as they should.
Children will remain convinced that there's a supernatural power that defies all that they are able to logically conclude through their own powers of reasoning, leaving them distrustful of their ability to think rationally and analyze their world critically, objectively and independently. They're lobotomized by the premature belief in irrational dogma, rendered virtual sheep to be sheered and ultimately consumed by the wolves in shephards' clothing.
The US Constitution's First Amendment says:
Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof; or abridging the freedom of speech, or of the press; or the right of the people peaceably to assemble, and to petition the Government for a redress of grievances.
That amendment does NOT prohibit Congress from prohibiting the involuntary exercise thereof. That is exactly what happens when a child whose reasoning abilities are not fully developed and is forced to believe in the irrational dogma of their parents' religions.
I'd prefer that the problem be addressed on the state level, but I'm sure even the zealots who practice Judaism and Christianity in this country would agree that the fanatical fringe of Islam consists of humans who were brainwashed by their adult parents, or adults in whose care their parents placed them.
The members of radical Islamic cults, from which terrorists and suicide bombers emerge, were indoctrinated into the irrational dogma of a "hate-based" religion when they were young children.
Perhaps our Judeo-Christian citizens will see the merits of protecting ALL children from exposure to even their own faiths, in order to keep the American Muslims from spawning home-grown terrorists.
If these J-C Americans really believe their faith is true, then they should expect their adult offspring will believe as they do, even if they're spared from any exposure to their faith for the "formative years" of childhood.
What would this crop of young Americans be like?
The J-C faiths include the same irraitional beliefs in "miracles" as do the Muslim faith, and the non-fanatical majority of all 3 faiths push such beliefs on their children as "proof" that their god exists and demands that all "his" children obey without question his laws, so they will curry his favor. This includes laws that require a love and care for others, as in their neighbors. Some faiths believe their god demands they love even their enemies.
Fanatical Muslims, like fanatical Jews and fanatical Christians, are created by the same early trauma to their rational thought development as the non-fanatical sects' members. The only difference is that the love-based "laws" are replaced by hate-based "laws."
Other religions with similar irrational dogmas, along with the Jews, Christians and Muslims who force their children to believe in irrational matters as true have one common end result.
Their children cannot fully reason, nor analyze their universe critically, objectively, independently.
Their children have lost most, if not all, of their natural curiosity. It's been replaced with a sheep-like attitude that they must "trust" in "God" and in all their leaders who merely say they're n "God's side," doing "God's will."
It explains why so many people think the rag-tag Muslims in mid-Eastern countries pose a serious threat to our incredibly sophisticated defenses, including Echelon and Carnivore. It's why so many people think Ron Paul's a nut, and why the babblings of all the other candidates "make sense" to them.
It explains why so many people cannot open their minds, shut tight by fears they can't even articulate, let alone defend as real. It explains why so many people cannot think outside their sheep-pens, and turn to major league sports, American Idol, soap operas and Fox news as the means by which they can pass their time between shifts running in place as the wheel turns profits faster and faster for their masters. I mean pastors.
The problem for theists in this general debate is that if you do not immerse a child in religious training at an early age and allow him or her to remain unindoctrinated until such time as they have developed and acquired the mental faculties and experience necessary to process matters and concepts related to religion on their own, the vast majority of them will end in being atheists.
If the default position is that no god or gods exist and one then waits for theists to provide legitimate convincing evidence of the contrary, the day of being legitimately convinced will never arrive...
Atheists never understand that "faith" as is stated here is excluded from the need for "providing convincing evidence".
I know the Atheist retort will be, "Oh how convenient to just say things and then use the 'faith' argument to say that no proof is required!!!!", but the point is that those who lack "faith" in any religion will not see it when proof IS offered anyway.
Did you ever wonder why it seems that those who convert to a religion (ANY religion) end up being the most devout??
It's because a lack of religion to many voids a life of having meaning. That is why they seek it out in the first place.
I can only feel sorry for those that constantly require empirical evidence to believe in anything.
I plan to raise my daughter to respect others beliefs; but I am a Christian. I will not be teaching her that Allah or Buddha are substitutes for Christ; .
Well, that's great, because Buddha isn't a deity. Not even Buddhists think he's god. So how about them apples?
I think you're whacked, comparing religion to sexual abuse.
Not only *that*, but also suggesting that sexual abuse is something that can be "gotten over", but religious education cannot? *shakes head*
This has absolutely NOTHING to do with the First Amendment to the US Constitution. The First Amendment covers only government action. If you have issues with religion in public schools or other public (government) settings, or government funding for religious private schools, then this is where you'd hang your hat. Otherwise, you're out of luck, First Amendment speaking.
Other than that, I *think* I can see where the OP may be coming from, even through this mess of a post. "Faith", by its very definition, is a *belief* in something. In the context of religion, it's a belief in doctrines set forth that don't have a basis in empirical truth. It gives people comfort and a sense of belonging. It also gives them, many times, a set of ethical and moral principles by which to conduct their lives.
The major problem comes in when people forget (or don't even learn) that there *is* a distinct difference between "faith" and "truth". When that difference isn't understood and accepted, tolerance for others simply goes out the window. How can you respect someone when you firmly believe that they are wrong?
I won't go so far as to say that religious education is tantamount to "child abuse", but I will say that an education that doesn't teach tolerance for others, on a VERY real level, just perpetuates the cycle of violence and hatred that has been going on for centuries.
The major problem comes in when people forget (or don't even learn) that there *is* a distinct difference between "faith" and "truth". When that difference isn't understood and accepted, tolerance for others simply goes out the window. How can you respect someone when you firmly believe that they are wrong?
I would suggest that the OP demonstrates a low tolerance, and he's clearly not a practicing Christian. Anyone can be intolerant, religious or not.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mishigas73
I won't go so far as to say that religious education is tantamount to "child abuse", but I will say that an education that doesn't teach tolerance for others, on a VERY real level, just perpetuates the cycle of violence and hatred that has been going on for centuries.
Why do you assume that religion does not include tolerance? Violence and hatred occur for many reasons, not just religion. Most religions today clearly speak against violence.
I would suggest that the OP demonstrates a low tolerance, and he's clearly not a practicing Christian. Anyone can be intolerant, religious or not.
Am I reading this wrong? Practicing Christians can't be intolerant?
There's a distinct difference between the ideals of a religion and the way that it can be practiced and taught. And, that's what I was getting at with what I've said here.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rggr
Why do you assume that religion does not include tolerance? Violence and hatred occur for many reasons, not just religion. Most religions today clearly speak against violence.
I assumed nothing of the sort. But, seriously, are you suggesting that religion isn't the cause of much violence over the course of history, and to this day? *That's* the phenomenon that I was addressing. Not the religion, as its own entity, but the way in which it can be, and is too often, practiced and taught.
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