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I guess. I posted the article about it myself. I'm not an expert in how these things work. I couldn't tell you if it applies to 2016 tax returns filed in 2017, or 2017 tax returns filed in 2018 (i.e. the order takes effect *starting* in 2017 but 2016 tax filing details are already decided), or both, or something in between, or nothing.
I was just answering the "2016 1040 form" question -- yes, the mandate tax penalty is on there.
You beat me to it re mentioning the executive order. in the first place.
My understanding is the same as madison999's (and was before finding the links below as well).
At least two media outlets....the Los Angeles Times, and RT....agree.....automatic rejection of leaving line 61 blank (known as 'silent returns') won't occur:
Everyone has to pay into healthcare for it to work for all. Insurance companies are out for themselves. They care nothing about us
Insurance isn't healthcare. Insurance is insurance. One example...if one lives in an area that has no providers that take your insurance, you aren't going to be guaranteed care beyond the minimum scope of current law. This has been discussed a number of times in P&OC. Either you have been unaware of past discussions, or willfully choose to ignore reality.
Still nobody has come up with a reason why we should not repeal the mandate in Obamacare, and leave the rest in place. The people who want to keep their Obamacare policies can, and those who want to choose something else can do that. And insurance companies can design new policies to try to attract more customers.
No solution is perfect, that that one would satisfy a lot more Americans than any other, by a wide margin.
The Mandate was in there per HC insurance lobbies, so that they could offset losses with many younger and relatively healthy enrollees. Obamacare plans are faltering all over, and one major reason is because of adverse selection. Too many medically risky patients enrolled. Losing the Mandate only makes this worse.
04-01-2017, 09:10 AM
i7pXFLbhE3gq
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboteer
It has never "pencilled out" with the mandate. So that makes no difference.
Leaving people free to chose what they want, is by far the best way to satisfy the maximum number of Americans. You can never satisfy 100% of them, that's never been possible in the history of mankind. But this will satisfy far more than any other plan that's been proposed.
No, it's the best way to blow up the healthcare system.
It makes exactly no fiscal sense to let people sign up for healthcare only when they're seriously ill.
While young people may now pay for insurance that they likely may not frequently need to use, will the situation not flip as they get old and their need for it greatly increases? Doesn't it all eventually even out?
Obamacare imposes penalties on anyone who doesn't sign up.
Why not just repeal that? And leave everything else in place. The mandate is the only part that the Supreme Court has found unconstitutional. So the Democrats started lying about it in court, claiming it was a tax, not a penalty... despite its clearly saying "penalty" in 18 different places in the law.
Remember that they had left it a "penalty" because a number of Democrat legislators had said they would not vote for it if it contained any new taxes. So those Democrats finally voted Yes, and it barely squeaked by. But those votes had barely been counted when the same Democrats started swearing in court that it was not a penalty, it was a tax.
So, why not repeal just that part? That way, people who like Obamacare (and the liberal fanatics swear there are huge numbers) lose nothing - they can keep their policies, unchanged. Just as everyone could when Obamacare was first passed. The Republicans aren't "taking anything away" from people who want Obamacare.
At the same time, insurance companies are free to put together new policies for people who decide to drop Obamacare. And those people are free to pick and choose what they want - they are no longer forced to choose only an Obamacare policy.
It's the best of all worlds. The people are finally free to choose whatever they want: an Obamacare policy, or a non-Obamacare policy, etc. And nobody gets anything taken away from them. They are simply free to drop their Obamacare policy if they want to, or to keep it if they want that.
Freedom of choice. What a great idea.
There are so many objections to big-govt plans from people all across the political and economic spectrum objecting to so many different features from either Obamacare or the ACHA, that this "freedom" novelty is the way to satisfy the maximum number of Americans.
Nothing will satisfy 100% of them, that's never been possible in the history of the nation. But this suggestion will please far more people that any big-govt policy possibly could, or has.
Why not simply repeal the mandate, and leave everything else in place?
The court found the mandate constitutional. It found forced Medicaid expansion unconstitutional.
They found it a tax because it fundamentally is a tax. The controversy was the fact that the court allowed a challenge to a tax before the tax was paid, which it cannot do. It therefore claimed that it was a penalty to hear the case, but was a tax in determining Congress' power was covered under its Spending Powers.
Yes, I believe this has been done. Although it was via executive order, so maybe the original poster was referring to something more permanent and maybe also serve as some sort of political message(the Senate backs the decision as well).
If you agree with removing the mandate, you might still oppose Trumps move because it was done by executive decision, instead of the legislative process. Not sure if this is what the original poster feels, but that is a possibility. Quite possible that he/she is unaware of the executive order as well. Lots of uniformed folks in both sides of this argument, kind of funny when you see it in person.
I thought he removed the penalty for not signing up but it appears that the XO just delays or broadens exceptions to the mandate. I don't quite understand how he can delay the mandate since it's already in place at least for this year. He also pulled the ads for the ACA, so he can't argue that it failed on it's own since he helped it along.
A rather large issue that I have not seen come up is the lawsuit by the 6 sates regarding cost-sharing subsidies. They won in court last spring and the White House appealed, they were about to make a decision but the states asked for more time since Trump won the election. If he drops the appeal then it will be a large loss in funding.
Last edited by Goodnight; 04-01-2017 at 09:33 AM..
04-01-2017, 09:24 AM
i7pXFLbhE3gq
n/a posts
Quote:
Originally Posted by MMS02760
While young people may now pay for insurance that they likely may not frequently need to use, will the situation not flip as they get old and their need for it greatly increases? Doesn't it all eventually even out?
Essentially yes. That's largely the point. At some point nearly everyone is going to need medical care. Most people are not going to have that kind of money all at once, so it makes sense to spread it out.
The OP is suggesting that we eliminate the "spread it out" bit which means insurance is basically pointless since it will need to charge premiums high enough to cover the cost of treatment in real time, knowing that people won't pay for coverage before or after they need it.
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