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Old 04-01-2017, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Eugene, Oregon
11,119 posts, read 5,586,777 times
Reputation: 16596

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Quote:
Originally Posted by skepticratic View Post
I tend to agree that we should use gender neutral terms at that scale. I can understand how a woman would feel slightly off put by using 'mankind' to refer to all people. It implies that the default for human is a man.

That said, the West (as with most societies) developed as a patriarchy. Language evolved to reflect that and the word mankind was used to refer to all people. To be docked points for using a word is kind of absurd. Point it out, request the student be more mindful, whatever. But taking points away is foolish. A paper should be graded on content, not use of words (unless the use is so poor that it completely perverts the argument of the paper).

English professors have an inclination for being pedantic about such things. I've always regarded the teaching of English, in an English-speaking society, as being useless. No teacher of any kind, taught me anything about how to use the language and so many people who have taken English classes, use atrocious spelling and grammar. I have a friend who was an English professor in college for a whole career and his online messages seem only semi-literate. You learn it by using it, not by having it imposed on you in a class. You can't learn to speak a foreign language in a class, either.
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Old 04-01-2017, 09:18 PM
 
18,561 posts, read 7,367,287 times
Reputation: 11375
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleinie View Post
https://www.campusreform.org/?ID=8986

A Northern Arizona University student lost credit on an English paper for using the word “mankind" instead of a gender-neutral alternative.
Mankind is gender-neutral.

Quote:
Actually, requesting gender-neutral terminology, including "humanity," is not unusual. I don't think I would consider it the mark of a crazy instructor.
"Humanity" has the same problem as "mankind" -- they both contain "man".

Last edited by hbdwihdh378y9; 04-01-2017 at 10:40 PM..
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Old 04-02-2017, 12:11 AM
 
983 posts, read 737,951 times
Reputation: 1595
I bet the professor spells woman as womyn! All of you saying "oh she just didn't do the guidelines" are missing the point. That being that crazy feminist professors are allowed to teach this kind of political/ideological garbage in the first place.
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Old 04-02-2017, 08:11 AM
 
6,292 posts, read 10,595,511 times
Reputation: 7505
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleinie View Post
I bet the professor spells woman as womyn! All of you saying "oh she just didn't do the guidelines" are missing the point. That being that crazy feminist professors are allowed to teach this kind of political/ideological garbage in the first place.
Teacher requires MLA format. MLA requires gender neutral terms. I'm not seeing the issue. People need to learn to follow the expectations.
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Old 04-02-2017, 08:50 AM
 
2,144 posts, read 1,878,349 times
Reputation: 10604
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marleinie View Post
All of you saying "oh she just didn't do the guidelines" are missing the point. That being that crazy feminist professors are allowed to teach this kind of political/ideological garbage in the first place.

Students turn into adults if they're not one already.

People should be exposed to many different political or ideological ideas and opinions. Then, they can actually use their brains and think if it's one they agree with, support, or not. This guy didn't agree, he decided to test the teacher's instructions about it, and "suffered" the consequences.

This is how growing up works. Exposure, thought, challenge, consequences, decision.

Are people really advocating for not letting adults or near-adults be exposed to different ways of thinking? We must shelter our poor, innocent lambs from a feminist professor?

If this kid gets a job and his boss tells him not to use a word in his reports, and he uses it anyway, there will be consequences. If his wife tells him, "Never call me Baby," and he does, consequences.

It blows my mind how some people think being exposed to less or being protected from other types or ways is in any way helpful to becoming a responsible adult. Also, how someone should get graded on principle rather than their work.
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Old 04-02-2017, 10:42 AM
 
73,004 posts, read 62,578,805 times
Reputation: 21906
We live in a land of intolerance. It comes from both liberals and conservatives. Disagree with one's political views/don't fall in line, you get your posterior handed to you. I am not surprised to see a liberal professor dock a student for not falling in line. I've also dealt with a conservative professor basically say things in class that showed his own intolerance for those not politically in line with him.
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Old 04-02-2017, 01:17 PM
 
Location: Florida
33,571 posts, read 18,152,594 times
Reputation: 15544
This PC GARBAGE has got to go. Another snowflake is offended.
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Old 04-02-2017, 07:36 PM
 
Location: Del Rio, TN
39,868 posts, read 26,495,821 times
Reputation: 25766
Quote:
Originally Posted by ottomobeale View Post
Dock her a salary for being very foolish. Profs are supposed to be wise not foolish.
Hate to say it, but where have you been the last 30 years?
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Old 04-02-2017, 08:27 PM
 
Location: Eugene, Oregon
11,119 posts, read 5,586,777 times
Reputation: 16596
Quote:
Originally Posted by TristramShandy View Post
If you think there is some "right" way of traditionally applying grammar rules, you're sorely mistaken. All of this stuff changes through out the ages.

As for the original question, if the rule was taught, the student should be following it. Using "humanity" for "mankind" is not anything new - - I was an undergraduate from 1989-1993, and that was a rule I was taught, along with using "she" for any theoretical job that could have a male or female performing that job (i.e. a theoretical student would be referred to as "he or she"), and using non-male specific job titles for jobs that could be for either gender ("police officer" for "policeman"; "fire fighter" for "fireman", etc.).

I started doing this with my choice of words, many years ago. But sometimes, it isn't possible and I may switch to using plurals, where using "they" and "them" make the issue moot. Obviously, English and many languages have missing non-gender pronouns in their vocabularies. Once, some people suggested that the pronoun, "jhe" should be used for gender-neutral purposes, but it seems to have never caught-on. Sperm-donors and egg-donors will not be subject to any such pronoun issue.

I never had any such conflict in class assignments when I was in school. But I wouldn't have taken kindly to being told how to express myself, in spoken or written words. If you ask someone to complete an assignment, you should expect it to be fulfilled with that person's own words, unless jhe is a speech-writer or ghost-author for other people.
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Old 04-02-2017, 08:49 PM
 
4,491 posts, read 2,224,975 times
Reputation: 1992
Quote:
Originally Posted by TristramShandy View Post
If you think there is some "right" way of traditionally applying grammar rules, you're sorely mistaken. All of this stuff changes through out the ages.

As for the original question, if the rule was taught, the student should be following it. Using "humanity" for "mankind" is not anything new - - I was an undergraduate from 1989-1993, and that was a rule I was taught, along with using "she" for any theoretical job that could have a male or female performing that job (i.e. a theoretical student would be referred to as "he or she"), and using non-male specific job titles for jobs that could be for either gender ("police officer" for "policeman"; "fire fighter" for "fireman", etc.).
This actually brings up a point that I hadn't considered which is the possibility that the student knew this could happen while writing the paper. It could feasibly be true that the use of non-gendered language was part of the assignment or a class rule that had been pre approved to be something that could be penalized upon violation. Is it a stupid rule? Maybe, but this does entirely change the situaiton. If the student knew this could happen, it's their own fault. They don't really have the option of saying they were having points taken off unjustly if they knew before hand that the points would be removed.
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