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Old 04-23-2017, 06:05 AM
 
28,164 posts, read 25,287,627 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGeekGuest View Post
Apparently the only 'entity' that is allowed unlimited freedom is the completely unfettered Free Market.

Which will solve all problems, it's magical thinking at best.
Right on.

People are so afraid of making their government work for them and their interests, that they turn around to those of us who think the government should work that way and call us crazy, lazy, etc. Eh, let 'em think the Righteous Free Market will save their asses. One day they'll learn or die trying.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:05 AM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,161,983 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGeekGuest View Post
Both Parties have been hijacked by the Libertarian agenda. By all of the above & by the underlying & overriding notion that government has no role in regulating business (big or small) on behalf of the American people & the US.

Wells Fargo is a business like all others.
Hardly. They both support increased spying. They both supported the Patriot Act. Both parties support interventionist wars. Both parties supported huge socialist bail out programs for Wall Street.

They will sometimes argue Libertarian positions but never follow through with them.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:07 AM
 
28,164 posts, read 25,287,627 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Hardly. They both support increased spying. They both supported the Patriot Act. Both parties support interventionist wars. Both parties supported huge socialist bail out programs for Wall Street.

They will sometimes argue Libertarian positions but never follow through with them.
Yay!! Someone using the term socialist in the correct way.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:07 AM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,161,983 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
If the truth hurts...

The United States consistently ranks poorly in nearly all measures of quality education, healthcare, etc. among many other countries.
No we don't. Empty slogans are worthless. There are problems in our system, like access for the poor but people (that can afford it) don't come from all around the world for healthcare because our care is poor.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:11 AM
 
28,164 posts, read 25,287,627 times
Reputation: 16665
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
No we don't. Empty slogans are worthless. There are problems in our system, like access for the poor but people (that can afford it) don't come from all around the world for healthcare because our care is poor.
Yes, we absolutely do. Please check out studies by PISA and OECD. Show me a reputable study that places the US at or near the top in any of those measures and I'll buy you a steak dinner.

Our healthcare is excellent. Access to it? Not so much. And even when you have access to it, you are paying up to four times as much for the same service as you would get in another country with a national healthcare system.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:11 AM
 
24,385 posts, read 23,044,056 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Hardly. They both support increased spying. They both supported the Patriot Act. Both parties support interventionist wars. Both parties supported huge socialist bail out programs for Wall Street.

They will sometimes argue Libertarian positions but never follow through with them.
>>>> Well said.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:13 AM
 
Location: *
13,242 posts, read 4,919,031 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
Hardly. They both support increased spying. They both supported the Patriot Act. Both parties support interventionist wars. Both parties supported huge socialist bail out programs for Wall Street.

They will sometimes argue Libertarian positions but never follow through with them.
The present occupant of the White House, along with President Reagan & others, attempts to carry out the 1980 Libertarian agenda however does not follow through because of the protest by average Americans:

Quote:
(CNN)President Trump has thrown down a major challenge for the tea party and its congressional bloc, known as the Freedom Caucus. He is proposing to Congress a massive budget-busting plan that increases military spending by a whopping $54 billion, slashes domestic programs, and leaves Social Security and Medicare intact. And a significant tax cut will soon be on the way.

This presents a crucial test to the tea party movement that has reshaped American politics since 2008. The most obvious challenge is that Trump has chosen to leave Social Security and Medicare alone, two of the biggest components of the federal budget and two prime targets for conservatives like Speaker Paul Ryan.

Trump is going to assure Congress that the draconian cuts to domestic programs like the Environmental Protection Agency, reductions which tea party Republicans love, will balance out the huge increase in military spending. But the reality will be different.

President Ronald Reagan learned in the early 1980s that cutting government programs is extremely hard in practice. When Reagan slashed income taxes and boosted military spending, promising to balance the budget with domestic cuts, he failed. Reagan also backed away from cuts to Social Security and Medicare when he faced a political backlash for trying. ...
Trump throws down a huge challenge to the tea party

http://www.cnn.com/2017/02/28/opinio...tives-zelizer/
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:14 AM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,161,983 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by Magritte25 View Post
Yes, we absolutely do. Please check out studies by PISA and OECD. Show me a reputable study that places the US at or near the top in any of those measures and I'll buy you a steak dinner.

Our healthcare is excellent. Access to it? Not so much. And even when you have access to it, you are paying up to four times as much for the same service as you would get in another country with a national healthcare system.
Access to it for some is not so great. It's quite poor. I've been arguing that for years. It's why I supported Bernie.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:17 AM
 
79,913 posts, read 44,161,983 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChiGeekGuest View Post
The present occupant of the White House, along with President Reagan & others, attempts to carry out the 1980 Libertarian agenda however does not follow through because of the protest by average Americans:
There is absolutely nothing Libertarian about Massively increasing military funding. If they make cuts it won't be because of some Libertarian belief, it will be because they want it for other large investments.
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Old 04-23-2017, 06:17 AM
 
25,838 posts, read 16,513,155 times
Reputation: 16024
Quote:
Originally Posted by PCALMike View Post
Its called democracy with differences of opinion. You should look it up. I am sure you are fully behind both Trump and Lindsey Graham right?

Bernie has done more to offer real solutions and real policy proposals that galvanize the labor movement and the progressives than anyone else by far. Without Bernie, things would look much, much worse for labor and the 99%.
Bernie is someone I can respect because he's been exactly the person he portrays himself to be forever really. Unlike Hillary and these other sharks who have changed their position 180 degrees on every hot topic in the Democratic Party.
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