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Old 03-16-2008, 06:25 AM
 
3,631 posts, read 10,254,415 times
Reputation: 2039

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Briolat21 View Post
If you live in the city and are only "commuting" 2 miles to work (or less) as everyone is advocating - why the heck are you MOD CUT about GAS prices?? WALK. Or Take the Bus. Or METRO. Or RIDE a BIKE!
I'm not complaining about the gas prices - in fact i think it's hilarious that they keep going up. I have a train two blocks away from me. I'm not saying everyone should live in the city either - but why drive 20+ miles to work unless you HAVE to? I used to HAVE to drive 35+ miles to work every day and I wanted to slit my wrists every day when I got home from work.

My real problem is when suburbanites have access to public transit and don't bother using it for whatever reason, usually stereotypes that can't generally be backed up (smelly, loud, poor people - but, honestly, the commuter rail in Chicago is significantly nicer than the run of the mill CTA, and that's what the suburbanites would be taking). They don't use it and actively advocate against it, using the argument "well i have to pay for MY car, and MY gas so why can't transit riders pay the FULL BURDEN of riding the train or the bus," and they always FORGET that the roads they drive on are subsidized WAY more than transit ever will be.

Then there are those that are just outside the realm of having transit access that don't seem to understand that if everyone that DOES use it just decided to hop in a car tomorrow, they'd have more delays than they were counting on during rush hour. I understand the whole "density" thing, but if you look at old photos of Chicago, for instance, those rail lines were built LONG before the density cropped up around it. No one wants to give it a chance.

My other MAJOR problem with SPRAWL, and i actually mean SPRAWL is the horrible, haphazard planning going on with several small towns that all of a sudden find themselves brimming with transplants (I am particularly talking about Spring Hill, TN). I'm not saying build a bunch of high rises with commercial ground floors, but the fact that they now have a HOME DEPOT as their "town center" is disgusting and in no way looking forward to a future as a well-planned and organized city that could have, maybe someday been more of a neighborhood community rather than a place where you get in your car to go to the good ol' Home Depot, then get back in the car and drive 500 feet away to the Super Target (because god knows you wouldn't want to walk across that four lane highway - no one does that around there.)

Last edited by NewToCA; 03-16-2008 at 11:35 AM..
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Old 03-16-2008, 07:28 AM
 
Location: Foot of the Rockies
90,296 posts, read 121,054,432 times
Reputation: 35920
Why is Home Depot "disgusting"? If you own a home, you have to manitain it. Some store like it would be somewhere in the area. I don't think a home-improvement stores lends itself well to a downtown area b/c you have to have a loading dock, etc.
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Old 03-16-2008, 07:39 AM
 
20,186 posts, read 23,911,482 times
Reputation: 9284
Public transit is just that... an OPTION... why should you be FORCED to use public transport just because it is close to your home? Thats a load of B.S., last time I check I wasn't obliged to do anything I don't want to. Gas prices rising, isn't because everyone drives an SUV... when gas prices rose from $1 to almost $4, do you honestly think 1 billion people just bought an SUV... you might want to check the war in Iraq, greedy OPEC, and stock prices on oil commodities... I hate it when attribute the last several years of increasing gas prices to SUV... I guess its better to use rhetoric than actual thought...
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Old 03-16-2008, 10:43 AM
 
48,502 posts, read 97,051,418 times
Reputation: 18310
Thye main reason people live in the burbs is because they like the lifestyle. The citeis have become too expensive;the crime a problem in many's view. It will pay for alot of gas for the difference between cost.There is a trend to provide transit from the burbs to the city work place as well as work places moving away from the city closer to the burbs.In the future we may be talking about how city dwellers are going to get to work with the long distanmces. They also maybe traveling long distances to get to many newer stores.The burbs have grown for years and are becoming more popular and things move with them..
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Old 03-16-2008, 11:01 AM
 
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
5,224 posts, read 5,026,299 times
Reputation: 908
Quote:
Originally Posted by bchris02 View Post
I believe that our current gasoline situation could be easily fixed without people having to make too many changes to their way of life if they would just make two simple changes.

#1. Live within a reasonable distance from their workplace
#2. Trade the Hummers and Excursions for hybrids.

Unfortunately as Americans people WILL NOT make these changes on their own. In fact, most are probably too busy watching American Idol in their McMansions to even realize that their lifestyle is getting ready to cause complete societal collapse in the near future if something doesn't change.

First, I think the government should provide a tax incentive to encourage people to live within a certain distance of their workplace. Second, I think the government should pass a MPG regulation on consumer vehicles, one strict enough to knock out the Hummer, Excursion, and the likes. They should have a special license for low MPG vehicles because some people need them.

This is just NOT a very reasonable thing.. first of all.. what do you do about places like NYC that are already overcrowded and because of demand are extremely high priced. The further you go from an urban situation the better quality of life.. and even that is questionable (in places like LI that are way overpriced and that surround places like NYC). Most people choose where they live on several criteria.. one being how far they are willing to drive to and from work. What about the midwest.. we'd have lots of empty land followed by complete sprawl and unused land.

The problem is this is a free country and many people would see these acts as infringing on their rights. Is there any way to do this in a free country? If not, is there any way to fix this problem before it causes societal collapse?
While i do believe we have some issues.. it's not all doom and gloom. Yes.. we need to , as a society work toward being "greener" . In Levittown, they are taking those steps.. Levittown's goal is to become the first suburban "green" neighborhood (but.. it's not as easy as it sounds.. for one, i can't spend nor have the money to convert all I need to convert to be "green". And in this market investing more into 'improvement" is sinking money into a sinking ship. .but tha'ts for another thread).

The best thing you can do is educate.. then give people options that are within their budgets (I'm talkign about "greener" cars).. and also better and affordable choices for heating, etc.
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Old 03-16-2008, 11:05 AM
 
Location: Pennsylvania, USA
5,224 posts, read 5,026,299 times
Reputation: 908
Quote:
Originally Posted by supernerdgirl View Post
I'm not complaining about the gas prices - in fact i think it's hilarious that they keep going up. I have a train two blocks away from me. I'm not saying everyone should live in the city either - but why drive 20+ miles to work unless you HAVE to? I used to HAVE to drive 35+ miles to work every day and I wanted to slit my wrists every day when I got home from work.

My real problem is when suburbanites have access to public transit and don't bother using it for whatever reason, usually stereotypes that can't generally be backed up (smelly, loud, poor people - but, honestly, the commuter rail in Chicago is significantly nicer than the run of the mill CTA, and that's what the suburbanites would be taking). They don't use it and actively advocate against it, using the argument "well i have to pay for MY car, and MY gas so why can't transit riders pay the FULL BURDEN of riding the train or the bus," and they always FORGET that the roads they drive on are subsidized WAY more than transit ever will be.

Then there are those that are just outside the realm of having transit access that don't seem to understand that if everyone that DOES use it just decided to hop in a car tomorrow, they'd have more delays than they were counting on during rush hour. I understand the whole "density" thing, but if you look at old photos of Chicago, for instance, those rail lines were built LONG before the density cropped up around it. No one wants to give it a chance.

My other MAJOR problem with SPRAWL, and i actually mean SPRAWL is the horrible, haphazard planning going on with several small towns that all of a sudden find themselves brimming with transplants (I am particularly talking about Spring Hill, TN). I'm not saying build a bunch of high rises with commercial ground floors, but the fact that they now have a HOME DEPOT as their "town center" is disgusting and in no way looking forward to a future as a well-planned and organized city that could have, maybe someday been more of a neighborhood community rather than a place where you get in your car to go to the good ol' Home Depot, then get back in the car and drive 500 feet away to the Super Target (because god knows you wouldn't want to walk across that four lane highway - no one does that around there.)
Where I live, those that commute to the city DO use LIRR. But...if you have ever been on a commuter train..you'd see how FULL it really is.. so that means that those that are driving in are doing those taking a train into the city a HUGE favor.. because if everyone got on the train.. well. you can only imagine..

OH.. and that goes for Subways too in NYC>. I remember days having to wait while 4 trains would pass by before i could actually get in one to get home because the trains were so crowded you couldn't jam a pinky finger in there let a lone another human being (talk about smooshed..LOL). and talk about wanting to shoot yourself in the head..LOL.. if you weren't posted near the door.. good luck trying to squeeze OUT of that subway car before the doors closed on you.. because that subway door is pretty dang quick..LOL
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Old 03-16-2008, 11:19 AM
 
Location: America
6,993 posts, read 17,398,489 times
Reputation: 2093
Quote:
Originally Posted by supernerdgirl View Post
I'm not complaining about the gas prices - in fact i think it's hilarious that they keep going up. I have a train two blocks away from me. I'm not saying everyone should live in the city either - but why drive 20+ miles to work unless you HAVE to? I used to HAVE to drive 35+ miles to work every day and I wanted to slit my wrists every day when I got home from work.

My real problem is when suburbanites have access to public transit and don't bother using it for whatever reason, usually stereotypes that can't generally be backed up (smelly, loud, poor people - but, honestly, the commuter rail in Chicago is significantly nicer than the run of the mill CTA, and that's what the suburbanites would be taking). They don't use it and actively advocate against it, using the argument "well i have to pay for MY car, and MY gas so why can't transit riders pay the FULL BURDEN of riding the train or the bus," and they always FORGET that the roads they drive on are subsidized WAY more than transit ever will be.

Then there are those that are just outside the realm of having transit access that don't seem to understand that if everyone that DOES use it just decided to hop in a car tomorrow, they'd have more delays than they were counting on during rush hour. I understand the whole "density" thing, but if you look at old photos of Chicago, for instance, those rail lines were built LONG before the density cropped up around it. No one wants to give it a chance.

My other MAJOR problem with SPRAWL, and i actually mean SPRAWL is the horrible, haphazard planning going on with several small towns that all of a sudden find themselves brimming with transplants (I am particularly talking about Spring Hill, TN). I'm not saying build a bunch of high rises with commercial ground floors, but the fact that they now have a HOME DEPOT as their "town center" is disgusting and in no way looking forward to a future as a well-planned and organized city that could have, maybe someday been more of a neighborhood community rather than a place where you get in your car to go to the good ol' Home Depot, then get back in the car and drive 500 feet away to the Super Target (because god knows you wouldn't want to walk across that four lane highway - no one does that around there.)
co-signed! excellent post my man! I couldn't agree with you more! Only thing I wanted to point out is, while you are not paying for gas at the pump, you are paying for it at the super market via higher food prices. I read this report where NYC and Chicago are looking into making urban farms where you will have farms with in the city limits so transportation cost will be lower. I am all for new urbanism as well as living closer to city centers. These places that have poor urban planning will have to play catch up in the long run. That or become ghost towns.
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Old 03-16-2008, 03:53 PM
 
Location: Central CT, sometimes FL and NH.
4,546 posts, read 6,831,481 times
Reputation: 5990
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Why is Home Depot "disgusting"? If you own a home, you have to manitain it. Some store like it would be somewhere in the area. I don't think a home-improvement stores lends itself well to a downtown area b/c you have to have a loading dock, etc.
I like Home Depot too but when you have several towns within the same geographic area competing for their presence do you really need 10 Home Depots and 4 Lowes within a 10 mile radius? One opens in the next town and all of a sudden the crowd moves from one to another.

Too many of these buildings end up becoming large vacant tracts of land. The new ones that pop up down the street end up destroying raw land and creating new traffic congestion in areas whose infrastructure wasn't designed for such a large build out.

After the infrastructure comes too often the developers move somewhere else to create something "new" while yesterday's development suffers.
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Old 03-16-2008, 04:57 PM
 
3,631 posts, read 10,254,415 times
Reputation: 2039
Quote:
Originally Posted by Katiana View Post
Why is Home Depot "disgusting"? If you own a home, you have to manitain it. Some store like it would be somewhere in the area. I don't think a home-improvement stores lends itself well to a downtown area b/c you have to have a loading dock, etc.
I didn't say Home Depot as a business entity is disgusting. I mean the exact placement of the one in Spring Hill, TN absolutely disgusts me. If you've never been there, you don't know what I mean, but instead of trying to have a WELL-PLANNED southern town with a little bit of charm (like Franklin, TN, which has a charming downtown with most of its big commercial buildings on the outskirts), they just plopped a several thousand square foot orange and tan building in the geographic center of their town. The thing actually dwarfs their city hall. The city actually had almost a clean slate to begin with (20-ish years ago they had MAYBE a population of 1,000). THAT'S what I mean. I don't exactly have anything against Home Depot itself (although I actually like Lowe's better).


And everyone else, yes public transit is an option, and I'm not forcing anyone to take it. I just would rather use it than drive, and I would much rather pay $75 a month for it than have a car because I don't particularly like driving. It's a little iffy on its timing but, really, when someone flips their car or a semi jackknifes you're still going to be late for work. What bothers me is that some people, whether they use it or not, can't understand that in places where it would be feasible - or is already feasible - it should get billing ALONG WITH highway funding. Because perhaps if mass transit was given more equal treatment with the highway system, more trains and buses could run, and be less crowded and so on. A lot of people can't see past the "i'm not using it so why do i have to pay for it?!?!?!?!?" part, however. (Hey, I don't have any kids, so why are my tax dollars going to schools????? )
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