If America was divided into two countries (Congress, legal, racism)
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Hypothetically, if America was divided into two countries--one that was far-left and the other far-right--what do you think those countries would look like? How would they operate? What would the people and culture be like?
To answer the question, we first need to understand that the real divide in this country, isn't between the states. It is, and always has been, a divide between the cities and the countryside. And this is true across the entire world.
The rural parts of England, hate London. And the rural parts of France, hate Paris. If you look at voting patterns in this country, and in other countries, you'll see that the cities vote "leftist" and the countryside votes "conservative". And this holds true going back to the English Civil War, with the parliament getting support from the cities, and the King getting support from the countryside. The same thing happened in the French Revolution, etc.
So instead of imagining a two-country split, let us simply imagine what would happen to Kansas if it became an independent nation.
Currently Kansas has almost no industry. It is an agricultural economy, which sells food and other commodities to the rest of the country, and then buys manufactured goods(IE tractors, electronics, automobiles, etc) with the money.
So why doesn't Kansas have much industry? That is simple, because it never needed it. Industry exists elsewhere in the country, and in more-advantageous locations(IE on the coasts), and because of basically "free trade" between the states, it was simpler for Kansas to just continue selling commodities for manufactured goods. And if it tried to establish its own industry, it would undermine industry elsewhere in the country, which wouldn't benefit the country as a whole.
To put it in simple terms, if Kansas was an independent country, it would have an incentive to become more self-sufficient. Otherwise it would become dependent on foreign countries for the goods it requires to function.
If Kansas became an independent country, the first thing it would do is begin to develop its industry, and to do that, it would need to also develop a financial industry. Just like in every other country, you would see a "stock exchange" in Kansas. You would see more investment in industry, and technology. It may even start building its own cars, and tractors, among other things.
As Kansas industrialized, you would see growing cities. And the proportion of urban inhabitants would soon far outnumber the rural inhabitants, and as a result, Kansas politics would move to "the left".
So what would happen to the rest of the country if Kansas, and other states, suddenly left the union? Well, as I said, each state would suddenly have an interest in becoming more self-sufficient. So the current industrial and technology states, who get most of their income from selling to the rest of the country, would suddenly see a massive drop in sales. And, as the massive American market began to dwindle, the power of the US dollar(or whatever would takes its place) would begin to collapse. And thus, the US dollar as the "world's reserve currency" would disappear. And without the Federal Reserve, the American states could not operate their global empire of hundreds of foreign military bases, and to maintain a $550 billion a year trade deficit.
Without the Federal Reserve, the massive real-estate and market bubbles, which drive the economies of New York and California and even Florida, would burst. And without "red state" money coming into California, its real-estate market and technology markets would further weaken.
Thus the actual net-effect of secession, would be to economically-strengthen but socially-liberalize red-states, and economically-destroy blue-states. But if you look at the larger picture, secession would weaken the position of all the American states. And would effectively give the world away to China or Russia. Similar in principle to what happened to the relative-strength of that other superpower, the Soviet Union, when it came apart.
Furthermore, the idea that you could carve America up into two countries is naive. America is far more than two countries. And the truth is, if even one state was allowed to leave, the whole house of cards would come crashing down. As states, and even parts of states, or just cities, would suddenly be demanding secession as well.
The only way we're getting out of this marriage, is Civil-War. And a Civil War would destroy the entire country.
Hypothetically, if America was divided into two countries--one that was far-left and the other far-right--what do you think those countries would look like? How would they operate? What would the people and culture be like?
There isn't enough geographic space dominated by far right or far left ideals for this to even be possible. A more likely scenario, in dealing with extremes, is Donald Trump actually becomes a full blown fascist (or some modern equivalent) which could inspire a leftist revolution. I feel either is unlikely.
If the US were to split, it would not be done politically as, in practice, left v right politics really doesn't exist. We'd see the different cultural spaces separate. It would look something like this:
There will be no divide as suggested, in any such split there will only be a winner or loser, the winner being those that have the support of the majority of the People and the loser would not be around to try again. Be careful what you wish for, it is far easier to learn to get along better with each other than to kill each other because with the later it is not just the radicals that get killed most casualties would be the innocent.
One of the halves would certainly be a Christian Right theocracy.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NLVgal
Doubtful. The blue country would be run by agnostics and atheists as it should be. Religion is personal and has no place in politics. Pretty much all lefties agree on that.
All governments, even so-called theocracies, function as secular governments. And are generally ruled by atheists, even if they pretend they aren't. Jesus could never run a government.
As Machiavelli said... "I desire to go to Hell and not to Heaven. In the former I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks and apostles."
Ironically, the original recipe for American government was a two-tiered system.
No one cares. The idea that individuals were ever sovereign in the United States is a delusion.
Quote:
Originally Posted by NLVgal
The red states would be happy at first until they realized that the likes of the Koch brothers had turned their religion and fealty into pseudo slavery and returned them to the times of " the company store" and robber barons.
You obviously have no idea how the world works. Go read about Keynesian economics and the Federal Reserve, and then get back to me.
Last edited by Redshadowz; 05-11-2017 at 09:49 AM..
It would be like Canada/Germany on the one side and then on the other there would be some Anglo version of Mexico. Oligarchy, massive inequality, social problems etc.
There will be no divide as suggested, in any such split there will only be a winner or loser, the winner being those that have the support of the majority of the People and the loser would not be around to try again. Be careful what you wish for, it is far easier to learn to get along better with each other than to kill each other because with the later it is not just the radicals that get killed most casualties would be the innocent.
I would rather die than be ruled over by idiots and scoundrels. There are worse things in life than death.
"It is easier to find men who will volunteer to die, than to find those who are willing to endure pain with patience." - Julius Caesar
That may be so, many feel that way, just remember that we are not only talking about you or I we must also consider the lives of our families, are you ready to sacrifice them also. Don't like the system then work within the system to improve it, war is the last resort for those that have given up on discussion. or have no skill at it.
All governments, even so-called theocracies, function as secular governments. And are generally ruled by atheists, even if they pretend they aren't. Jesus could never run a government.
As Machiavelli said... "I desire to go to Hell and not to Heaven. In the former I shall enjoy the company of popes, kings and princes, while in the latter are only beggars, monks and apostles."
True. But so what?
A theocracy is bad not because the rulers believes in God. The problem is that believe in God is usually demanded of it's citizenry AND power is established through God. This makes it so that questioning power is the same as questioning God.
As I said, you're right, and might actually agree with me. A theocracy is a problem regardless.
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