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Old 05-23-2017, 07:03 AM
 
7,185 posts, read 3,699,096 times
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Well, maybe the voters of MS will take that into their own hands and "lynch" this GOP guy's political career? hen, he - and the other two who "liked" his post - can just try lynching others as private citizens. Or, not. We really don't know if the citizens of MS think he has a good idea...

"a Republican member of the Mississippi House of Representatives apologized Monday for calling for the lynching of anyone who removes a Confederate monument, including lawmakers in a neighboring state."

They should be LYNCHED!” Oliver wrote in comments posted on his Facebook page.
The message drew “likes” from two of Oliver’s fellow Republican lawmakers, state Rep. John Read and state Rep. Doug McLeod, the Jackson Free Press reported.


https://www.yahoo.com/news/gop-lawma...042217294.html
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Old 05-23-2017, 09:23 AM
 
4,491 posts, read 2,225,152 times
Reputation: 1992
I agree with him on the books, I guess. Not the statues or... lynching. I know he's exaggerating, but a man in his position should probably exaggerate smarter than that.

Books shouldn't be burned because knowing history is important, even the bad parts of history. And the confederacy is a bad part of history. It was a rebel state that left a nation for threatening to take away their slaves. I'm not saying every person depicted in these confederate statues is the embodiment of evil; but they were not fighting the good fight. Leave them in the books; history is important. But knowing your history and celebrating it are two very different things, and I'd like to think a state legislator is smart enough to understand that.

I'll just point out, how many statues of Hitler are there currently in Germany?
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Old 05-23-2017, 03:57 PM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,218 posts, read 22,357,274 times
Reputation: 23853
Meh.
I think the only proper place for statues of the confederate military is the cemeteries where the dead from that war are buried. Or on the battlefields of that war. That also applies to the union statuary as well.
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Old 05-24-2017, 06:43 AM
 
4,120 posts, read 6,607,512 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
Meh.
I think the only proper place for statues of the confederate military is the cemeteries where the dead from that war are buried. Or on the battlefields of that war. That also applies to the union statuary as well.
The issue is the union states don't glamorize the war or anything like that. Southern states have used the war to divide their communities on racism.

I grew up in the midwest & nobody ever talks about it. Living in the south, someone will bring it up 2 to 3X a week.

The only memorial I ever saw in a prominent place was in Cleveland where they have a statue honoring the dead.
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Old 05-24-2017, 08:37 AM
 
Location: OH->FL->NJ
17,003 posts, read 12,588,356 times
Reputation: 8921
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
Meh.
I think the only proper place for statues of the confederate military is the cemeteries where the dead from that war are buried. Or on the battlefields of that war. That also applies to the union statuary as well.
The monuments were not destroyed.
EXCELLENT idea above for their disposition of these monuments.

Majority black cities should not have to house these monuments that are offensive to most of their residents... except at Confederate Cemeteries.
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Old 05-25-2017, 11:14 AM
 
12,003 posts, read 11,894,188 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bellhead View Post
The issue is the union states don't glamorize the war or anything like that. Southern states have used the war to divide their communities on racism.

I grew up in the midwest & nobody ever talks about it. Living in the south, someone will bring it up 2 to 3X a week.

The only memorial I ever saw in a prominent place was in Cleveland where they have a statue honoring the dead.
One reason that the legends of the Lost Cause live on in the South is because most of the battles of the Civil War were fought there - Gettysburg being the obvious exception. And Southerners being Southerners - people noted for their storytelling and pride in family lore - stories of g-g-granddaddy's valour live on.

In my own family, which has roots in Virginia and Arkansas, stories of this kind persist. I have long generations in one particular branch, plus ancestors who wrote things down.

So our family knows about the bushwhackers who invaded our ancestors' rural home, the skirmish which was fought a mile away, our g-grandmother's nursing of the wounded after that battle, two young g-uncles, who had helped bury the dead and evacuate the wounded from that same battle, later having to hunt small game to put food on their family's table after commissaries from both sides had taken their corn, wheat, livestock and the contents of the smokehouse.

We know that this same branch of our family, along with other families from their area, eventually were forced to refugee to safer (Union) territory several states away, during the last winter of the war (1864-65), and that they returned home only to learn later that an enlisted son had died of disease the same day Lincoln had been assassinated. He was nineteen, and had worn the blue. His brother, in his mid-twenties, survived the war - he had worn the gray.

My family lost two other children during the war - a daughter in her early twenties died during a measles epidemic around 1862, and a baby boy died in 1864 - probably of summer complaint complicated by malnutrition due to food shortages- before he was a year old. He was the only baby this large family lost, and had it not been for the war, it's likely he would have survived.

Am I to term one great uncle a hero, while calling his brother a traitor?

Both fought for what they believed.

This branch of my family were not slaveholders. But they were Southerners.

On the other side of my family, a g-g-grandfather was in Pickett's Charge at Gettysburg. When my father was a young boy, he asked the Major what it was like: "It was all a big mistake", was the only answer. Yet the Major served his state legislature after the war, was instrumental in raising funds for the huge Virginia Monument at Gettysburg, and also attended the big fiftieth reunion at Gettysburg, from which film still exists of the old Johnny Rebs and Yankees laughing together and firmly shaking hands across the stone wall which was the High Water Mark of the Confederacy (no sign of my ancestor in that film, unfortunately, but I know he was there or nearby). But he never wavered in saying "It was all a big mistake"...

So many stories...it wasn't so long ago, after all, if you count the generations rather than the years. And because of that enduring immediacy, Civil War monuments may be viewed quite differently in the South than in other areas of the country where such stories do not resonate.

So tell those stories. Remind people that those who fought, and those who survived at home during the tragic war years were mainly just people doing the best they could, trying to follow their consciences, and survive. Of course, part of that tragedy is that firm belief in a cause that was so clearly wrong drove this country to such an extreme as to create scenarios such as happened in my own family...
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Old 05-25-2017, 02:22 PM
 
Location: Cape Cod
24,484 posts, read 17,220,223 times
Reputation: 35777
Quote:
Originally Posted by ottomobeale View Post

Majority black cities should not have to house these monuments that are offensive to most of their residents... except at Confederate Cemeteries.

I have a feeling if the residents of that city were asked who those statues honored most would have no clue beyond some white guy on a horse.

I still think the statues should have been used as teaching tools to young and old and yes the past would be talked about but not to highlight slavery but to promote how far black people have come.




What Karl Oliver said was stupid, he should apologize but not step down. He could also tell the people of his state why the statues are important.
It is all about education.

The last thing we all need is for some idiot to take Oliver at his word and act on it.
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Old 05-26-2017, 02:35 AM
 
Location: Ohio
13,933 posts, read 12,893,585 times
Reputation: 7399
Historically, the winners don't celebrate the losers of a war. Only in the case of the American Civil War has there been an exception made to that rule for some reason.

These monuments should never have been erected in the first place. Doing so is almost a treasonous act.

Why don't we just build monuments honoring the Japanese pilots who flew their planes in to warships and killed Americans at Pearl Harbor?

The South has been permitted to live in an alternate universe and pretend like it won the war for far too long already. This removal was long overdue.
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Old 05-26-2017, 11:50 PM
 
8,886 posts, read 4,578,846 times
Reputation: 16242
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
Historically, the winners don't celebrate the losers of a war. Only in the case of the American Civil War has there been an exception made to that rule for some reason.

These monuments should never have been erected in the first place. Doing so is almost a treasonous act.

Why don't we just build monuments honoring the Japanese pilots who flew their planes in to warships and killed Americans at Pearl Harbor?

The South has been permitted to live in an alternate universe and pretend like it won the war for far too long already. This removal was long overdue.
QFT
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Old 05-27-2017, 10:49 PM
 
Location: Midwest
4,666 posts, read 5,091,366 times
Reputation: 6829
Quote:
Originally Posted by WhipperSnapper 88 View Post
Historically, the winners don't celebrate the losers of a war. Only in the case of the American Civil War has there been an exception made to that rule for some reason.

These monuments should never have been erected in the first place. Doing so is almost a treasonous act.

Why don't we just build monuments honoring the Japanese pilots who flew their planes in to warships and killed Americans at Pearl Harbor?

The South has been permitted to live in an alternate universe and pretend like it won the war for far too long already. This removal was long overdue.
Pretty much this.
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