Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Thanks to the world's greatest propaganda ministry, most Americans do not know what money is, who has the power to create it, nor who is obligated for the Federal Reserve Notes kited by Congress. Furthermore, most cannot accurately define the republican form of government, its source and origin, despite it being guaranteed to them.
On this, there has been no discovery that DNA has a hand in IQ/intelligence. There is no "intelligence gene" that has been identified and intelligence cannot be adequately or accurately defined. Not sure why you and others are so gung ho about IQ. I'd think that you'd understand that intelligence is different for all people and that it cannot be measured by a single test.
And please note, this is coming from someone who has been tested as having a high IQ. Funny, but Neil deGrasse Tyson has also noted that it is not intelligence that is a factor in ones academic life, it is determination and the willingness to learn what you want to learn to get where you want in life. I've read quite a few of his books and I'll reiterate he was not raised in poverty and you may not have said that he was in the OP (can't remember who the OP was) but I think that it is hilarious and sad that just because he is black people think he was raised in poverty.
Did you ask Neil what his IQ is?
Of course there are numerous factors. I was blessed to be able to view the world through a large number of lenses, so I think I have a "common sense" which far exceeds the norm. But I also have a high IQ (132), which - I assume - made me able to take those experiences and boil them down to basic conclusions about the way the world (and the USA) works.
IQ should be neither a God or a Devil. It is an indicator. You would have to be stupid to look for low IQ individuals to train for Geneticists, brain surgeons and Physicists. Steve Wozniak has a 170 IQ which is wh he was HE who developed the Apple Computer. Jobs probably is closer to 130, but had a number of other common sense and "feel" skills which allowed him to know what is right (marketing and design) and what is not.
The guy who designed the hardware for the Mac computer was living in a van parked near the Apple Campus - and then got a lowly job in repairing returned computers. But he was obviously a very IQ genius - never went to school for any of it (as a side-note, he eventually went Mad...).
Many IQ questions are "common sense" measurements. But I agree that it would take more than one test to determine whether one might be successful in life. However, if the IQ measures 70 the odds are against them..big time.
On this, there has been no discovery that DNA has a hand in IQ/intelligence. There is no "intelligence gene" that has been identified and intelligence cannot be adequately or accurately defined. Not sure why you and others are so gung ho about IQ. I'd think that you'd understand that intelligence is different for all people and that it cannot be measured by a single test.
residinghere2007 is denying science yet again.
Sorry, but science says:
-IQ is in part genetic
-Genetics plays a bigger impact on IQ as you age
-Genes correlated to IQ have been found
-They are on the X Chromosome
-Which is why boys have greater IQ variability
-High IQ brains are physically different during an autopsy (and therefore it is tangible)
You are a science denier and should be embarrassed at your "flat earth theories" that you argue for over and over again.
For michiganmoon, please refer to and read your link from "Wired."
In it, the person featured is trying to find a genetic link to intelligence - an "intelligence gene."
He is doing research on this because it has yet to be determined that intelligence is genetic.
So all your other information regarding this is false. You and others need to realize what I stated above - that thus far, there is no definitive relationship between genes and/or DNA and intelligence.
Also the definition of "intelligence" varies depending on the person and the culture/society of which they live. And in all cases intelligence will be influenced by environmental factors, especially biological environmental factors in relationship to toxins and nutrition of the individual and/or group of people/culture/society.
ResidentScienceDenier2007,
They have found genes correlated to IQ.
Just curious if you also deny that genetics plays a part in eye color, height, certain conditions like sickle cell, and even some personality traits? it is clear you deny the science of genetics, I am just trying figure out how bad you are on science.
People who pursue careers in trades such as plumbing, welding, bricklaying, electrical work, etc. are not less intelligent than people in white-collar jobs, they just have a different type of intelligence. They may not be able to summarize Proust (or even know who he was) or identify cuneiform writing, but they are not stupid. And they probably don't care about Proust or cuneiform writing anyway. Their intelligence takes a different form and their interests and talents are in different areas.
The point is you don't need college or even a high school diploma. My father quit school in the 8th grade to support his family. He ended up owning several mechanics shops and event taught at Lincoln Tech. I know many high school dropouts that went on to start their own businesses in the trades and ended up doing very well for themselves. Some of them were pretty damn dumb at the IQ level, but smart enough to read a tape measure and use power tools. Dumb people can operate a shovel or a rake, they can even be taught how to operate a backhoe, lay pipe, pull wire, etc. The bottom line is that college isn't a necessity and it is even a barrier a lot of times.
Just curious if you also deny that genetics plays a part in eye color, height, certain conditions like sickle cell, and even some personality traits? it is clear you deny the science of genetics, I am just trying figure out how bad you are on science.
I reviewed the study from King's College London that was cited in your link.
Our research shows that there are not genes for genius.
This was sentence #1 of paragraph #7 from the actual college that conducted the study.
Please note that as a liberal arts major, I was taught to research and to always review the sources of material that is posted, especially media sources as they always take a particular point of view for their particular audience. When you review the source, you get a better idea of what the article really was about.
As I stated earlier, there is no gene for intelligence that has been discovered.
There are genes for diseases (like sickle cell) and physical traits that have been identified. I also never said that there will never be a gene identified for intelligence, I'm actually sure that there will be at some point.
You should take your own words in regards to "science" and also learn, like a liberal arts major, to verify your sources and your articles. FWIW scientists do the same thing in regards to their experiments and results of said experiments/research.
LOL how am I a "science denier" when I told you a fact - that there has not been a gene identified regarding intelligence. Many of the links you pulled up are bogus and not from scientific organizations or are media articles that are not the actual studies. Also most of them are not about genes/DNA (note that brain growth and scans are not genes/DNA). I bet you don't even know what DNA stands for without googling lol.
FYI - anyone can find anything on the internet. Just because its there doesn't mean it is the truth. I'd ask as well, what is your profession that you claim to be some sort of science genius because you can use google to find stuff that fits your opinions.
The USA has poured many billions into fighting poverty and yet statistically things are no bad, whether it's the inner city or Appalachia. Much of the debt bankrupting our nation is related to anti poverty or safety net programs. I believe both people on the right and left have a problem: they can't acknowledge the overwhelming evidence in study after study that most poor people also have low IQs and the few success stories you hear about of people rising from poverty are those who were born poor but have high IQs. (examples include Neil Degrass Tyson, Sonya Sotomayor, etc)
People on the right believe poor people are smart enough to overcome their situation but are lazy. People on the left believe we need more programs to give people a leg up and that any inequality of any kind is the result of deliberate discrimination. The reality is people with low IQs are simply not capable of rising out of poverty in our complex society filled with fine print and lots of opportunities to derail your self through loan / credit debt, high insurance rates, etc. If you gave all poor American households $20k tomorrow but don't change anything else within a couple years there would be no improvement because the money would mostly be wasted on things like gambling, customizing low value automobiles, etc.
I believe the best approach is to decrease complexity by clamping down on industries that prey on low IQ people, like pay day loans, easy credit / loans, and unreasonable fine print. Heck, my IQ is 111 and I struggled to understand a FAFSA form! I've also gotten hosed by fine print in apartment leases. Such things are money transfers from the poor to the rich. For people who struggle to maintain the most basic employment we need govt jobs doing things like planting trees in parks, cleaning sidewalks, and the like. I think Universal Basic Income would prevent many people from engaging in illegal activities.
It's not just IQ that is far too simplistic. You also have to consider personality and aptitude which are distinct from IQ. Having a deficiency in any of those three can be a real problem. It is also true that a high IQ right-brained individual will have a lot harder time finding work in our society than a high IQ left-brain.
However I completely agree with your proposed solutions. You will get a lot more resistance from the "right" than the "left" on that though, because one of their tenets is that all regulation is bad. Your other flawed assumption is that those on the hard right actually give a crap about someone other than themselves.
This is not an issue about liberal arts majors v. STEM majors. The low-income population that suffers from limited cognitive ability can barely read. The question is not whether or not they can get a college degree. It is whether or not they can get a high school diploma. Many cannot, because their limited intellectual capacity, for whatever reason, keeps them from being able to acquire the skills and information necessary for that most basic of academic credentials.
In addition to not being able to read or do basic math, cognitively-impaired people often do not reason well and have poor executive functions dealing with planning and impulse control. Thus the focus is always living in a very brief present, with little or no planning for the future. Anyone who can get into a four-year college has skills far beyond those who literally cannot read.
Of course there are numerous factors. I was blessed to be able to view the world through a large number of lenses, so I think I have a "common sense" which far exceeds the norm. But I also have a high IQ (132), which - I assume - made me able to take those experiences and boil them down to basic conclusions about the way the world (and the USA) works.
IQ should be neither a God or a Devil. It is an indicator. You would have to be stupid to look for low IQ individuals to train for Geneticists, brain surgeons and Physicists. Steve Wozniak has a 170 IQ which is wh he was HE who developed the Apple Computer. Jobs probably is closer to 130, but had a number of other common sense and "feel" skills which allowed him to know what is right (marketing and design) and what is not.
The guy who designed the hardware for the Mac computer was living in a van parked near the Apple Campus - and then got a lowly job in repairing returned computers. But he was obviously a very IQ genius - never went to school for any of it (as a side-note, he eventually went Mad...).
Many IQ questions are "common sense" measurements. But I agree that it would take more than one test to determine whether one might be successful in life. However, if the IQ measures 70 the odds are against them..big time.
I don't know what Steve Wozniak's IQ is. I doubt you do either. I also don't know what Neil deGrasse Tyson's IQ is.
I don't really care about anyone's IQ.
IMO most people who care about it are people with low IQs lol.
"Common sense" is not "IQ." IQ stands for "intelligence quotient" which is a term that was made up, as was the test made up, to set a standard for what wealthy Frenchmen felt were factors related to their view of what "intelligence" was/is. The term has since morphed into what other wealthy/government officials deem to be important based on their version of "intelligence."
FWIW, I was tested as a child with an IQ of 150. As a teenager it was 135. I have a nephew with an IQ of 159. He doesn't have much common sense IMO as he makes a lot of silly decisions like most of the kids/adults I knew/know who are "super smart" do and most of them aren't doing all that well in life.
Those numbers have no bearing on my life. My drive and determination are more important than those numbers.
Also FWIW a man with one of the highest IQ ever scored in America of 190-210 grew up in poverty and has done nothing of note with his high IQ score.
IQs like Chris's exist among us at a rate of roughly one in one hundred million. In a world designed for average, folks like Chris don't always fit very well. Forty-two years old, he pulls down $6,000 a year. He lives in a tiny, cluttered one-room cabin overlooking a field of heavy machinery in Eastport, Long Island--a short drive from the tony Hamptons--which he shares with his cat, Ramona, and his 1985 shovelhead Harley-Davidson, parked near the sink in his kitchen.
If IQ were the primary measure of importance in someone's financial outcome in particular in life, or their contributions to society, then Chris Langan should be one of our supreme leaders along with the other man spoken about in the article with a 185 IQ who also has done nothing of note with his life and isn't a rich person.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
