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Old 07-09-2017, 02:25 PM
 
Location: NJ
23,350 posts, read 17,028,821 times
Reputation: 17390

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Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
Trump and other climate change deniers, who never discuss clearly observed empirical impacts such as ocean acidification and ocean warming, now can ignore that the Great Barrier Reef has been declared dead, with a disastrous impact on marine life.

<<
Climate change and ocean acidification have killed off one of the most spectacular features on the planet.

>>

https://www.outsideonline.com/211208...illion-bc-2016
Great Barrier Reef dead at 25 million | New York Post

https://www.pmel.noaa.gov/co2/story/...idification%3F

The Koch brothers, their Republican puppets, Trump and his Trumpies all can take a bow.

Is it any wonder that most of the rest of the world now looks at the U.S. environmental policies with dismay, if not total disgust?

Global food security is at great risk if man-made climate change is not mitigated in the near future.

<<
The world’s population is expected to grow to almost 10 billion by 2050, an increase of around 30 per cent.
Almost half the world’s population relies on food from the ocean as the primary source of protein, and with this anticipated population growth seafood will continue to be in high demand.
For many decades scientists have studied the changing climate and now have clear evidence of impacts on the ocean.>>


https://blogs.csiro.au/ecos/fisherie...limate-change/

One example of what worries marine scientists:

<<Rising sea levels will cover wetlands and other low lying habitats where fish reproduce, and destroy mangroves, the nurseries for many commercially important fish species.>>

https://www.msc.org/healthy-oceans/t...climate-change
Soooo, all the federal regs and taxes over the last 8 years couldn't save the GBR?


You are not saying Trump killed the GBR, are you?


ever what happened to the environemt with all the modern ships that sunk along with all the WW1 and 2 ships, submarines and planes and russian nuclear subs that sank in the oceans along with refuse from the manhattan project. then china and third world countries, and the US, dumping battery acid, pesticides. Add to that the floods that ravaged the major rivers and coasts of the world washing chemicals and contaminants back into the ocean. Overfishing and killing no target fisheries. And all the head boats before self contained laws were passed.


Wonder if all that came into play or was it just the US pulling out of the Paris accord?
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:25 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,465,081 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
First of all, American wages would've still been much higher than in the developing world even without any environmental regulations whatsoever, so it's highly improbable that there would've been much if any difference in the decline of American manufacturing. Besides, automation is going to eliminate most manufacturing jobs regardless of where they're located. Second, when the EPA was born, rivers were on fire and deaths by pollution were in then tens of thousands every year. Why you think America would be better off going back to that is the definition of insanity, especially when there won't be any tangible gain in employment long-term. Do you simply not care about the health of your family and friends, let alone yourself?
Because if the EPA served a legitimate purpose they'd have the implements to clean the air and water not tax on carbon footprint for the sake of generating revenue for uncle Sam. Instead they pass that burden on and vicious cycle repeats raising the overhead of a company... even if everything was to be robotic, newsflash, robots will require maintenance so do you tell the skilled workers to maintain and repair automated production they're worth minimal wage because some tree hugging global warmist slapped them with harsher stringent emissions taxes/fines/penalties?

If EPA served a purpose, with that fine money, their purpose would be justified but they would lose relevance. So instead they need to cling to spin this fallacy to the environmentalist community and sabatoge current industries to implement "green industries"

That's not free market. Free market would be green energy being favored and implemented freely not because of a political or economic strong arm.

That's harsh to come in and tell an industry the game is up pay to remain in business here in the states because we say so based on carbon footprint or GTFO.
Again, why do you think China is gaining economic power? Wonder if money going to sweatshop factories has anything to do with it...
Granted Beijing is a smog pit, but they didn't just up and sprout cities out of nowhere...

Keep shipping and farming the jobs outside the USA see where that leads us. Right on the path of poverty. Pay attention to India too...

When you've outsourced all of your labor and production to make a buck, that is what will happen. Never mind quality control issues. Look purely at why corporations do it then ask yourself. What if the EPA had devices out cleaning the air and water and didn't financially cripple business...

Think the EPA only harmed production? Guess again. Contractors who owned diesel pickups and dump trucks losing their only vehicle that makes them money due to catastrophic failures caused by both a lack of engineering and directly related to emissions control devices. I made a ton of money fixing ford diesels thanks to the emissions control devices. I've also seen small business owners go bankrupt due to losing customers due to down time and sky high cost to repair.

It's not just production and manufacturing who took a hit.
Same with farmers who deal with failures on their tier 4 emissions controlled implements. Drop 250k on a John Deere and need a complete engine at only 2k hours
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:28 PM
 
Location: Minnesota
1,548 posts, read 907,102 times
Reputation: 1413
The Great Barrier Reef had a good run. It should be proud. So long, Great Barrier Reef!
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:31 PM
 
16,956 posts, read 16,681,292 times
Reputation: 10408
Op: but there is hope: Re-building one reef at a time...


Mote (Marine Laboratory and Aquarium) raises thousands of fragments of staghorn coral, a threatened species, and plants them into the wild in cooperation with the Florida Keys National Marine Sanctuary. Mote scientists are studying these coral fragments to find strains most likely to survive changing ocean conditions.

Mote scientists have also developed a breakthrough technique for quickly growing and restoring brain, boulder and star corals — crucial reef-building species. Mote’s technique allows for restoring large areas of reef-building corals in just one or two years instead of the hundreds of years that some slow-growing corals might need on their own.


https://mote.org/news/article/mote-s...ore-retirement


You know I saw this on TV just the other night, not sure which channel. They are rebuilding the coral reefs and saving marine life that depend on it.


I realize the GBR is in Australia but scientists are trying to rebuild starting in Florida.
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:36 PM
 
16,345 posts, read 17,965,546 times
Reputation: 7878
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
Because if the EPA served a legitimate purpose they'd have the implements to clean the air and water not tax on carbon footprint for the sake of generating revenue for uncle Sam. Instead they pass that burden on and vicious cycle repeats raising the overhead of a company... even if everything was to be robotic, newsflash, robots will require maintenance so do you tell the skilled workers to maintain and repair automated production they're worth minimal wage because some tree hugging global warmist slapped them with harsher stringent emissions taxes/fines/penalties?

If EPA served a purpose, with that fine money, their purpose would be justified but they would lose relevance. So instead they need to cling to spin this fallacy to the environmentalist community and sabatoge current industries to implement "green industries"

That's not free market. Free market would be green energy being favored and implemented freely not because of a political or economic strong arm.

That's harsh to come in and tell an industry the game is up pay to remain in business here in the states because we say so based on carbon footprint or GTFO.
Again, why do you think China is gaining economic power? Wonder if money going to sweatshop factories has anything to do with it...
Granted Beijing is a smog pit, but they didn't just up and sprout cities out of nowhere...

Keep shipping and farming the jobs outside the USA see where that leads us. Right on the path of poverty. Pay attention to India too...

When you've outsourced all of your labor and production to make a buck, that is what will happen. Never mind quality control issues. Look purely at why corporations do it then ask yourself. What if the EPA had devices out cleaning the air and water and didn't financially cripple business...

Think the EPA only harmed production? Guess again. Contractors who owned diesel pickups and dump trucks losing their only vehicle that makes them money due to catastrophic failures caused by both a lack of engineering and directly related to emissions control devices. I made a ton of money fixing ford diesels thanks to the emissions control devices. I've also seen small business owners go bankrupt due to losing customers due to down time and sky high cost to repair.

It's not just production and manufacturing who took a hit.
Same with farmers who deal with failures on their tier 4 emissions controlled implements. Drop 250k on a John Deere and need a complete engine at only 2k hours
You really have a fascinating view on reality... in that it has nothing to do with reality. Anyway, I guess the answer to the question was no, you don't care about the health of your family and friends. Figured as much.
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:41 PM
 
46,174 posts, read 26,880,522 times
Reputation: 11070
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
Trump and other climate change deniers, who never discuss clearly observed empirical impacts such as ocean acidification and ocean warming, now can ignore that the Great Barrier Reef has been declared dead, with a disastrous impact on marine life.

<<
Climate change and ocean acidification have killed off one of the most spectacular features on the planet.

>>

https://www.outsideonline.com/211208...illion-bc-2016
Great Barrier Reef dead at 25 million | New York Post

https://www.pmel.noaa.gov/co2/story/...idification%3F

The Koch brothers, their Republican puppets, Trump and his Trumpies all can take a bow.

Is it any wonder that most of the rest of the world now looks at the U.S. environmental policies with dismay, if not total disgust?

Global food security is at great risk if man-made climate change is not mitigated in the near future.

<<
The world’s population is expected to grow to almost 10 billion by 2050, an increase of around 30 per cent.
Almost half the world’s population relies on food from the ocean as the primary source of protein, and with this anticipated population growth seafood will continue to be in high demand.
For many decades scientists have studied the changing climate and now have clear evidence of impacts on the ocean.>>


https://blogs.csiro.au/ecos/fisherie...limate-change/

One example of what worries marine scientists:

<<Rising sea levels will cover wetlands and other low lying habitats where fish reproduce, and destroy mangroves, the nurseries for many commercially important fish species.>>

https://www.msc.org/healthy-oceans/t...climate-change
So, lets just give you the last 250 years....are you saying that in the last, our 0.00001% of that time frame, it was all because of trump?

Folks....you cannot make this crap up....
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:42 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,465,081 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
You really have a fascinating view on reality... in that it has nothing to do with reality. Anyway, I guess the answer to the question was no, you don't care about the health of your family and friends. Figured as much.
I do and did that's why I didn't vote for obama.

What's more harmful... a little c02 or an over priced health care plan with less coverage and high deductibles
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:44 PM
 
16,345 posts, read 17,965,546 times
Reputation: 7878
Quote:
Originally Posted by NY_refugee87 View Post
I do and did that's why I didn't vote for obama.

What's more harmful... a little c02 or an over priced health care plan with less coverage and high deductibles
They're both harmful. And they're both currently issues that Republicans can't seem to grasp.
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:48 PM
 
Location: PSL
8,224 posts, read 3,465,081 times
Reputation: 2963
Quote:
Originally Posted by jbcmh81 View Post
They're both harmful. And they're both currently issues that Republicans can't seem to grasp.
No wrong again, it's dems and rinos who want to make a name for themselves otherwise ACA would be repealled and we'd be moving on allready.

But good news for vegans!
https://www.nasa.gov/feature/goddard...greening-earth
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Old 07-09-2017, 02:50 PM
 
22,310 posts, read 11,811,079 times
Reputation: 20098
Quote:
Originally Posted by WRnative View Post
What a joke.

Democratic Senators voted overwhelmingly for comprehensive immigration reform, requiring use of the E-Verify system by all employers and robust enforcement procedures, likely halting illegal immigration in its tracks, much more so than any expensive Mexican border wall.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Border...on_Act_of_2013

House Republicans, champions of cheap labor demanded by their one-percenter bosses, refused to act on the Senate-passed bill, promising a better alternative (just as with healthcare). Trump also called for comprehensive immigration reform in his Presidential campaign. Where is the Republican immigration reform bill????

It's been four years since comprehensive immigration reform bill passed in the Senate, and still no action by Congressional Republicans.

Trumpies are such gullible people, seemingly devoted to their daily servings of snake oil.

I agree that immigration, especially of unskilled workers, to the U.S. needs to be severely restricted. Now if Trumpies would just demand action on this one issue by their Republican snake oil suppliers.
"Comprehensive immigration reform" is just a euphemism for amnesty---and you know it, too. The E-verify thing is a joke to the dems. It wouldn't have been in effect for 5 years if that disaster of a bill passed. You do know that when E-verify was created, Ted Kennedy only allowed it to come into existence if it wasn't used to weed out the 8 million no-match SSNs in the work force. You also know that GW Bush ordered the SSA to send out millions of no-match letters but the despicable ACLU sued to stop it. To be sure that they got their way, the went court shopping and picked the Ninth Circuit Court (surprise! surprise!/sarcasm).

Both sides of the aisle use illegal alien labor. The reason that the republicans didn't want it to pass was that their constituents jammed the phone lines on Capitol Hill letting them know that they were against it.

Republicans have tried to introduce bills to reduce the number of legal immigrants allowed into this country when Obama was in office but Harry Reid killed all of them. It was the democrats who didn't want to reduce legal immigration and refused to pass anything that dealt with getting rid of illegal immigration.

Besides, think about it, will you? How will amnestying illegals help the environment? Answer: It won't. That said, deporting illegals or making life so horrible for them here that they leave on their own accord would do wonders for the environment.

You can't demand amnesty for illegals yet wring your hands over the environment. If you do that, it just makes you a hypocrite.

We don't have unlimited buildable land or potable water. Illegals tend to leave large carbon footprints.

You must be too young to remember that liberals were once all about ZPG to the point where many of them didn't have children because they worried about the planet. At some point, liberals did a 180 on that issue.

You TDS sufferers are such gullible people.
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