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Democrats have also failed miserably with Obamacare, our premiums go up every year. This partisan crap ain't gonna get anything fixed anyhow. What is really going on here? No one wants to ask why an MRI cost double in the USA than it does in other nations. Why is our healthcare so expensive compared to every other nation on earth? Whether the plan is market based or socialist is not the big issue, both models could be made to work if competent people crafted the plan. The problem is corruption, drug companies bilking the people, lawyers feeding off the system through malpractice laws etc. politicians of both parties are largely lawyers by trade, they are personally invested in drug companies, law firms, and insurance companies. They are corrupt and interested in thier own enrichment, both parties. They are all fine with average Americans being uninsured and broke from high cost as long as it benifits them.
What should be done is a panel of experts from inside and outside our nation should independently create options that would include reforming Obamacare, single payer, capitalist market driven etc. These options could be released and publically debated. At that point the options could be submitted for congressional approval. The politicians are not qualified to create the plans, nor are they capable. An independent body of industry and health experts would do a far better job. I am disgusted with the results both parties have put forth.
First you blame Democrats and then you blame partisanship. I didn't bother to read sentence 3 through 1000.
Yes, clearly the GOP has nothing but crap after 7 whole years of promises and complaining. Obamacare has lots of problems, but instead of bragging about how big their collective old white penis is, the republicans need to pull up their pants and sit down and work with the democrats to fix and revise Obamacare. Clearly they can't come up with a better one so they need to work with the one we have and make it better, and the only way is bipartisanship and compromise. These old white men in the GOP really need to grow up and do what's right.
The snowflake dems are in no position to call out the republicans on this as the colossal failure called Obamacare unravels by the day. Actually I'm very sick of both parties and have no faith in them. Personally I am conservative, but I see no real progress happening from the politicians that supposedly support conservative views. I would like to see a good market based system....however that will not happen as long as cost of health services remain as they are. The problem is cost, but as I stated before the politicians won't deal with those issues because IMO they are personally benefiting from the corruption in our healthcare system. If you deal with the cost issues then you could make either a market based or a socialist system work. With cost of health services what they are now neither market based or socialist medicine will work, that is why Obamacare is failing like it is, and it's why the old system was failing too. BTY what's your beef with "old white men"? Like it or not old white men created this nation and even considering its current divisions and problems it is one of the best places on earth to be. Also I'm a white man, and I'm dang near being called old as well so I do take issue with that. I do agree with you that dems and reps should be able to work together but today's divided environment makes that impossible. Do you think all those brick throwing "not my president" types want thier left wing reps talking to the "old white guys". I think you know the answer to that. Nor do us conservatives want our reps working with the snowflakes. Sadly the days of moderation and compromise seem to be over. One day this nations issues may be resolved in a less than democratic and peaceful way, but that is a whole different thread.
Democrats have also failed miserably with Obamacare, our premiums go up every year. This partisan crap ain't gonna get anything fixed anyhow. What is really going on here? No one wants to ask why an MRI cost double in the USA than it does in other nations. Why is our healthcare so expensive compared to every other nation on earth? Whether the plan is market based or socialist is not the big issue, both models could be made to work if competent people crafted the plan. The problem is corruption, drug companies bilking the people, lawyers feeding off the system through malpractice laws etc. politicians of both parties are largely lawyers by trade, they are personally invested in drug companies, law firms, and insurance companies. They are corrupt and interested in thier own enrichment, both parties. They are all fine with average Americans being uninsured and broke from high cost as long as it benifits them.
What should be done is a panel of experts from inside and outside our nation should independently create options that would include reforming Obamacare, single payer, capitalist market driven etc. These options could be released and publically debated. At that point the options could be submitted for congressional approval. The politicians are not qualified to create the plans, nor are they capable. An independent body of industry and health experts would do a far better job. I am disgusted with the results both parties have put forth.
Sure - the ACA did not do anything to control costs (this has been its biggest failing, in my opinion). And none of the Republican-backed plans to replace the ACA do so, either.
Until we get serious about controlling HC costs, we'll never get a good handle on offering affordable HC.
Sure - the ACA did not do anything to control costs (this has been its biggest failing, in my opinion). And none of the Republican-backed plans to replace the ACA do so, either.
Until we get serious about controlling HC costs, we'll never get a good handle on offering affordable HC.
We agree on this but the question becomes how do we control these cost? Most of us, myself included are ignorant of how all this is happening. That is why I would like to see a panel of independent healthcare experts come up with options for us. We cannot trust the politicians alone to do it. This panel could deal with cost, deal with the different choices regarding to single payer or market based. I think we would be better off with doctors, insurance experts, representatives from other nations with successful systems to sit down and hash out the best approach. Of course the politicians would have to approve a new plan, but at least they would not be creating one themselves. The partisanship obviously is making all this worse, and all of us are partisan, we all have our bias. Another reason an independent group is the way to go
We agree on this but the question becomes how do we control these cost? Most of us, myself included are ignorant of how all this is happening. That is why I would like to see a panel of independent healthcare experts come up with options for us. We cannot trust the politicians alone to do it. This panel could deal with cost, deal with the different choices regarding to single payer or market based. I think we would be better off with doctors, insurance experts, representatives from other nations with successful systems to sit down and hash out the best approach. Of course the politicians would have to approve a new plan, but at least they would not be creating one themselves. The partisanship obviously is making all this worse, and all of us are partisan, we all have our bias. Another reason an independent group is the way to go
I agree, politicians (who have no real intimate understanding of the nuances and details of HC costs), should not be involved.
A non-partisan and independent group of medical care experts is certainly needed. But I don't know where to start on that.
The snowflake dems are in no position to call out the republicans on this as the colossal failure called Obamacare unravels by the day. Actually I'm very sick of both parties and have no faith in them. Personally I am conservative, but I see no real progress happening from the politicians that supposedly support conservative views. I would like to see a good market based system....however that will not happen as long as cost of health services remain as they are. The problem is cost, but as I stated before the politicians won't deal with those issues because IMO they are personally benefiting from the corruption in our healthcare system. If you deal with the cost issues then you could make either a market based or a socialist system work. With cost of health services what they are now neither market based or socialist medicine will work, that is why Obamacare is failing like it is, and it's why the old system was failing too. BTY what's your beef with "old white men"? Like it or not old white men created this nation and even considering its current divisions and problems it is one of the best places on earth to be. Also I'm a white man, and I'm dang near being called old as well so I do take issue with that. I do agree with you that dems and reps should be able to work together but today's divided environment makes that impossible. Do you think all those brick throwing "not my president" types want thier left wing reps talking to the "old white guys". I think you know the answer to that. Nor do us conservatives want our reps working with the snowflakes. Sadly the days of moderation and compromise seem to be over. One day this nations issues may be resolved in a less than democratic and peaceful way, but that is a whole different thread.
I guess the country will go down the crappy with your attitude about snowflakes. The old men are the entrenched politicians who will not place the good of the country before their part loyalty. As for your worship of free market, dream on. Free market healthcare will only mean even more profit for big pharma and hugely inequity in healthcare for the masses.
Old men need to move to the country and let the younger generation move the country forward.
Democrats have also failed miserably with Obamacare, our premiums go up every year. This partisan crap ain't gonna get anything fixed anyhow. What is really going on here? No one wants to ask why an MRI cost double in the USA than it does in other nations. Why is our healthcare so expensive compared to every other nation on earth? Whether the plan is market based or socialist is not the big issue, both models could be made to work if competent people crafted the plan. The problem is corruption, drug companies bilking the people, lawyers feeding off the system through malpractice laws etc. politicians of both parties are largely lawyers by trade, they are personally invested in drug companies, law firms, and insurance companies. They are corrupt and interested in thier own enrichment, both parties. They are all fine with average Americans being uninsured and broke from high cost as long as it benifits them.
What should be done is a panel of experts from inside and outside our nation should independently create options that would include reforming Obamacare, single payer, capitalist market driven etc. These options could be released and publically debated. At that point the options could be submitted for congressional approval. The politicians are not qualified to create the plans, nor are they capable. An independent body of industry and health experts would do a far better job. I am disgusted with the results both parties have put forth.
you are conflating two issues.
1 cost of the sevices and drugs etc.
2 public , private or mixed.
ACA is 100% the answer that solves most every problem and maintains a private system as GOP wants. they just have to get over themselves and fix it instead of purposely breaking it and scaring up prices.
the first issue "costs" gets resolved by a whole slew of things that can be done regardless of ACA or other solution.
this nonsense of claiming "BOTH PARTIES" is the mantra coming from the right now that they are FINALLY figuring out the GOP and Trump do not have their interest at heart.
Understand this danielj72, The DEMS would have gone for a consumer focused universal healthcare system if they thought there was the slightest chance in hell that it would not have resulted in GOP members grabbing guns and shooting people. If they thought they could have gotten that for you and me that is exactly what they would have gotten. But they knew it would be ripped apart by the GOP the second they had the power.
so instead they took the seends of a GOP plan and crafted a middle road with the intent of tweaking it, fixing it as they went. But sadly shortly after getting it through congress they got kicked out of office and the GOP spent 6 years attacking ACA, undermining it, blocking 100% of fixes for 6 years.
every flaw found it ACA (obamacare) that Obama tried to correct they blocked to ensure the program would break.
Yet ACA still managed to work, just not very well in many states (ie red states where funding was refused)
YOUR pretense that "both parties" are the problem is BS. THE dem were willing ot work on fixing ACA for over 7 years now. The GOP would not allow any changes, any fixes anything that might have made ACA too good to destroy. After all ACA has been the stick to beat the dems with for 7 years, it is how the GOP got power it is how they held power. The real disaster for the GOP was winning the POTUS ! Because now they have no excuse, they hold all power and can bring in any new system they want without one single Dem vote.
All of the ACA problems are do to the GOP refusing any fixes for 7 years, and it turns out they never had an alternative worth talking about. THe GOP has lied ,lied and lied to you about Obamacare to make political gains
The solution now is for the GOP to swallow its pride and come up with a workable fix for Obamacare and the dems will give them as many votes as they need to pass it. between moderate and reasonable GOP members and the dems there are enough votes to Fix ACA into a great plan that works to make healthcare affordable and available to all.
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