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so I guess you know more about economics than Bernanke?
and BTW- the whole nation had it's butt saved....
Disproportionately the Acela Belt and West Coast was saved. That's where the 7 figure jobs were saved from firms that were worthless at fair market value.
We did the right thing with Lehman. Not with the rest.
Disproportionately the Acela Belt and West Coast was saved. That's where the 7 figure jobs were saved from firms that were worthless at fair market value.
We did the right thing with Lehman. Not with the rest.
hate to break it to you, but if GS and MS went away too BOA and Citi (retail banks) were going to be next - I'll need hours to go over the effects that would have no the US, but needless to say that takes down middle America just as much as the coasts. Then credit in the US dries up for years. Houses and jobs are gone all over the US. Maybe credit comes back down the road, maybe it doesn't, but massive damage is done to the economy. You know what else happens, Wall Street as you know it is gone. I know everyone loves to bash on the coastal elites, but without NYC and Wall Street, the US economy is toast. Unless you and your manufacturing hero think you can just get by on bartering factory receivables?
so I guess you know more about economics than Bernanke?
and BTW- the whole nation had it's butt saved....
My Freshmen Economics teacher knows more about Economics than Bernanke.
Dude was the Captain of the Titanic. Iceberg was right in front of him....."no problem, our boat's unsinkable".
& Pockets of the nation (along with AIG, which was significantly owned by Goldman Sacs, BofA, Chase & others) had their "butt saved". At the expense of ALL Taxpayers.
Bush 2 & Obama were like two young Rappers at a Gentlemen's club. Complete economic neophytes with Billions of other people's money in their pockets.
are you talking about mortgage int deduction or state and local taxes at this point?
I confused the two. Yes, I know the property tax has nothing to do with the mortgage. (Been on two different threads this morning....one where mortgages were discussed.) I typed before I thought. Apologies.
hate to break it to you, but if GS and MS went away too BOA and Citi (retail banks) were going to be next - I'll need hours to go over the effects that would have no the US, but needless to say that takes down middle America just as much as the coasts. Then credit in the US dries up for years. Houses and jobs are gone all over the US. Maybe credit comes back down the road, maybe it doesn't, but massive damage is done to the economy. You know what else happens, Wall Street as you know it is gone. I know everyone loves to bash on the coastal elites, but without NYC and Wall Street, the US economy is toast. Unless you and your manufacturing hero think you can just get by on bartering factory receivables?
I know right?....that's what the Treasury Secretary Paulson (who made a couple of billion while CEO of Goldman's) told Bush 2.
Everyone at Goldman's (& AIG), BofA, Chase, Citi etc. got bonuses....while the taxpayers bent over without the benefit of lubrication. The only CEO who spoke the truth during that time was the dude at Wells Fargo (who now have different problems).
They (someone who actually cares about the country) could have done a bailout with 10% of the money. (& have a few hundred of those who colluded - love that word - do perp walks). Citi and Goldman's could have/should have been downsized....and you're right, it would take hours to discuss this properly.
I confused the two. Yes, I know the property tax has nothing to do with the mortgage. (Been on two different threads this morning....one where mortgages were discussed.) I typed before I thought. Apologies.
no worries....happens to the best of us!!! appreciate the clarification!
I know right?....that's what the Treasury Secretary Paulson (who made a couple of billion while CEO of Goldman's) told Bush 2.
Everyone at Goldman's (& AIG), BofA, Chase, Citi etc. got bonuses....while the taxpayers bent over without the benefit of lubrication. The only CEO who spoke the truth during that time was the dude at Wells Fargo (who now have different problems).
They (someone who actually cares about the country) could have done a bailout with 10% of the money. (& have a few hundred of those who colluded - love that word - do perp walks). Citi and Goldman's could have/should have been downsized....and you're right, it would take hours to discuss this properly.
the people committing mortgage fraud and those enabling them should definitely have been locked up. Banks were just doing what they were allowed to do, as deregulation allowed ramping up of risk and leverage. The problem was lack of regulation.
As someone who worked in this space during the crisis, there was no way to stabilize the markets on less considering the leverage involved. This was a liquidity crunch brought about by too much leverage. Only way to fix that is to take down the multiples.
Stumpf was full of it at Wells btw- they had a ton of crap on their books thanks to Golden West via Wachovia. All these banks would ahem gone belly up thanks to the massive warehouses they had of crap super senior tranches and subprime pipelines as well as npl's on supposed AAA paper.
the people committing mortgage fraud and those enabling them should definitely have been locked up. Banks were just doing what they were allowed to do, as deregulation allowed ramping up of risk and leverage. The problem was lack of regulation.
As someone who worked in this space during the crisis, there was no way to stabilize the markets on less considering the leverage involved. This was a liquidity crunch brought about by too much leverage. Only way to fix that is to take down the multiples.
Stumpf was full of it at Wells btw- they had a ton of crap on their books thanks to Golden West via Wachovia. All these banks would ahem gone belly up thanks to the massive warehouses they had of crap super senior tranches and subprime pipelines as well as npl's on supposed AAA paper.
Lots of good info. I wasn't directly in it but observed (with my head shaking) from the sidelines (was with a Credit Union & we couldn't believe what was going on).
I defer to your detailed knowledge on what caused the cluster**** (& I'm happy to see that you agree with me that there were lots of folks to blame)....& we'll have to agree to disagree on the degree of bailout needed.
I was "in it" during the S&L issues in Texas during the mid 80s (where there was no bailout....until after the fact), so my perspective is influenced by that interesting 3 year period (84-87). BTW....the worst thing that happened during that time period was when the Mets beat the Astros in 86.
hate to break it to you, but if GS and MS went away too BOA and Citi (retail banks) were going to be next - I'll need hours to go over the effects that would have no the US, but needless to say that takes down middle America just as much as the coasts. Then credit in the US dries up for years. Houses and jobs are gone all over the US. Maybe credit comes back down the road, maybe it doesn't, but massive damage is done to the economy. You know what else happens, Wall Street as you know it is gone. I know everyone loves to bash on the coastal elites, but without NYC and Wall Street, the US economy is toast. Unless you and your manufacturing hero think you can just get by on bartering factory receivables?
Wall St would have lost some, not all firms, survivors just like in banking, would scoop up bargains.
I know right?....that's what the Treasury Secretary Paulson (who made a couple of billion while CEO of Goldman's) told Bush 2.
Everyone at Goldman's (& AIG), BofA, Chase, Citi etc. got bonuses....while the taxpayers bent over without the benefit of lubrication. The only CEO who spoke the truth during that time was the dude at Wells Fargo (who now have different problems).
They (someone who actually cares about the country) could have done a bailout with 10% of the money. (& have a few hundred of those who colluded - love that word - do perp walks). Citi and Goldman's could have/should have been downsized....and you're right, it would take hours to discuss this properly.
I was delighted many AIG execs returned bonuses as their families, before they returned it, felt unsafe in their own communities. Was heart-warming hearing one tear up on a Ct station that his 10 year old girl could not attend after school activities and feel safe. Served the entire families right. Benedict Arnold was less treasonous to the nation.
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