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Thank you for posting some decently researched information. Unfortunately, if you are trying to conclude that marijuana is a 'gateway drug' this information does not back you up. It shows that opioid use is on the rise and that opioid deaths have increased dramatically (which is caused by both the increase in use and more importantly by fentanyl and carfentanyl being added to the opioid supply.
I don't think that anyone is arguing that opioids are generally a poor choice. There is no credible research to my knowledge indicating that marijuana use leads to opioid use. Correlation is not causation, and unfortunately, for those without a scientific background, these two concepts are often conflated. 100% of heroin users breathe air. Does that mean that air is a 'gateway drug'? Of course not. More than 99% of heroin users drink water. Also not a gateway drug. The term gateway drug implies causation - it makes you more likely to be a user of stronger drugs. The problem is that heroin users are often emotionally damaged and are seeking relief from the pain in their lives. They will seek this in many places, including marijuana. This is a correlation, but not a causation. Do you see where I'm going with this?
I take a keen interest in the real science involved. You can make a much better impact to change behaviour and help young people avoid poor choices by presenting real information. They have fairly decent BS detectors to catch half truths and complete lies. My generation was preached to by what was essentially misinformation about marijuana. Because we grew up thinking that authority figures lied to us about that the other things they said to us about truly dangerous things like drinking and driving and harder drugs were also lies. This led to a number of my generation to make some truly poor choices that have had extremely poor outcomes. I think we would do well to provide topical well researched information if we want to avoid the mistakes of the past. Many drug and alcohol education programs in schools are taking this approach and make a difference much like informative sex education programs in schools can make a difference.
Taking information out of the context it was presented in to prove a point that it doesn't really refer to is not a great way to influence anyone. As far as any current research I am aware of is concerned, marijuana is far less dangerous than alcohol, although chronic heavy use can cause some problems especially in those under 24 years of age (in this age group, heavy use can lower IQ by a few points). Other than that it is remarkably harmless, but just like nobody should drink a case of beer a day or 3 bottles of wine a day or a bottle of vodka a day, nobody should smoke pot all day - it's a very poor choice for most people. Low THC medical marijuana with high cannabidiol can be used more heavily by those requiring it for pain or other chronic disease management.
I have read the first 4 pages and the last few pages of this thread and found no information pointing out any evidence contrary to what I've posted here. I'll check the pages in between to see if there's any good anti-pot data there, but I doubt I'll find it based on past research that I've done on the topic.
Thank you for posting some decently researched information. Unfortunately, if you are trying to conclude that marijuana is a 'gateway drug' this information does not back you up. It shows that opioid use is on the rise and that opioid deaths have increased dramatically (which is caused by both the increase in use and more importantly by fentanyl and carfentanyl being added to the opioid supply.
I don't think that anyone is arguing that opioids are generally a poor choice. There is no credible research to my knowledge indicating that marijuana use leads to opioid use. Correlation is not causation, and unfortunately, for those without a scientific background, these two concepts are often conflated. 100% of heroin users breathe air. Does that mean that air is a 'gateway drug'? Of course not. More than 99% of heroin users drink water. Also not a gateway drug. The term gateway drug implies causation - it makes you more likely to be a user of stronger drugs. The problem is that heroin users are often emotionally damaged and are seeking relief from the pain in their lives. They will seek this in many places, including marijuana. This is a correlation, but not a causation. Do you see where I'm going with this?
I take a keen interest in the real science involved. You can make a much better impact to change behaviour and help young people avoid poor choices by presenting real information. They have fairly decent BS detectors to catch half truths and complete lies. My generation was preached to by what was essentially misinformation about marijuana. Because we grew up thinking that authority figures lied to us about that the other things they said to us about truly dangerous things like drinking and driving and harder drugs were also lies. This led to a number of my generation to make some truly poor choices that have had extremely poor outcomes. I think we would do well to provide topical well researched information if we want to avoid the mistakes of the past. Many drug and alcohol education programs in schools are taking this approach and make a difference much like informative sex education programs in schools can make a difference.
Taking information out of the context it was presented in to prove a point that it doesn't really refer to is not a great way to influence anyone. As far as any current research I am aware of is concerned, marijuana is far less dangerous than alcohol, although chronic heavy use can cause some problems especially in those under 24 years of age (in this age group, heavy use can lower IQ by a few points). Other than that it is remarkably harmless, but just like nobody should drink a case of beer a day or 3 bottles of wine a day or a bottle of vodka a day, nobody should smoke pot all day - it's a very poor choice for most people. Low THC medical marijuana with high cannabidiol can be used more heavily by those requiring it for pain or other chronic disease management.
I have read the first 4 pages and the last few pages of this thread and found no information pointing out any evidence contrary to what I've posted here. I'll check the pages in between to see if there's any good anti-pot data there, but I doubt I'll find it based on past research that I've done on the topic.
You are also to be thanked for a well thought out, informative post. I would like to direct your attention to more recent study in the area of marijuana use and brain changes. The earlier studies you mentioned were misinterpreted for the very same reason you point out: Correlation and causation. This study is exceptionally worthy of consideration, because not only was it conducted by The Journal of Neuroscience, but it also openly reveals who funded it (very important):
Some investigations, for example, found that marijuana use is linked to a decrease in the size of certain areas of the brain, whereas others concluded that marijuana is associated with an increase in volume of the same areas. While the studies were interesting, it’s important to note that, because of the way they were designed, it was not possible to establish cause and effect. Furthermore, the studies may not have adequately controlled for alcohol use, which is a particularly important issue given that it is well established that alcohol abuse can have a detrimental effect on brain structure as well as volume and mental ability.
In order to address this issue and hopefully provide some clarity, scientists designed a well-controlled study that set out to investigate the potential effects of daily marijuana use on both adults and adolescents.
Quote:
This work was supported by the National Institutes of Health through grants from the National Institute on Drug Abuse (K01-DA-031755 to B.J.W., and R01-DA-025074 to K.E.H.) and the National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism (R01-AA-012238 to K.E.H. and R01-AA-017390 to A.D.B.); and by a Brain and Behavior Foundation (NARSAD) Young Investigator Grant (to B.J.W.).
The authors declare no competing financial interests.
I KNEW IT
I provided scientific evidence and you turn a blind eye.
If you don't believe the sources I've sent you, you won't believe any other source.
Suit yourself.
Actually, if you read what he posted, he read it and decided that the information did not prove your thesis - and I would argue that he is correct in this. He also cast doubt on the source, which I think is a bit premature as there wasn't any actual propaganda presented, just facts. In the past, federal government sources have been guilty of highly distorted information on the topic, but this doesn't appear to be the case here, so again, thank you for providing what seems to be well researched information even if it doesn't back up your point.
The problem is that saying that alcoholics are 2x as likely to use heroin and that marijuana 'addicts' are 3x as likely to use heroin does not prove that these substances cause heroin use. It only proves that people who abuse these substances are more likely to use heroin. Less than 6% of alcoholics use heroin. Less than 9% of marijuana 'addicts' use heroin. I have no idea how a marijuana user becomes classified as an addict, but the fast majority of users are casual users just like the majority of alcohol users. There is nothing in either alcohol or marijuana that causes people to run out and use heroin.
The research on opioid pain killers shows much stronger evidence for a causation relationship with heroin use. A prescription opioid addict is likley to go to heroin if their prescription is cut off. There is a strong physical addiction involved with opioids, nicotine and to a lesser extent alcohol. There is no such physical addiction for marijuana. Interestingly, there is an addictive component to cheese - the fats (and possibly the casomorphins although the evidence is poor to date)
Addiction research tells us there are people with 'addictive personalities'. They are likely to abuse substances, be it alcohol, marijuana, heroin, crack or many other things.
You are also to be thanked for a well thought out, informative post. I would like to direct your attention to more recent study in the area of marijuana use and brain changes. The earlier studies you mentioned were misinterpreted for the very same reason you point out: Correlation and causation.
And thank you for the new information. I haven't looked at it in detail yet, but it certainly appears to contradict the earlier studies. It doesn't in and of itself prove the other studies wrong, but it certainly makes their conclusions far less reliable and open to a lot of doubt. This is one of the things I love about science. It is in the long run a self correcting process to help us find the truth. Sure, there are mistakes along the way or incomplete understandings that are eventually clarified, but it is better than any other process we have for determining the truth.
OMG. Get real is right. Another stereotype. This one is a bad one, because it's the one the Oklahoma Bureau of Narcotics uses as an excuse to keep it illegal with draconian punishment should you partake!
I use it every day, and I am going to repeat it until I am blue in the face: I use it for Focus (it works for that, research it), Creativity (it works for that, research it), and Energy (it works for that, research it). I do not use strains that you have so locked in your mind gets me "stoned". I would not get any work done if I did.
This is really getting tiresome. People with little or no experience thinking they know it all.
Threads like these are useful for showing the severity of mental impairment that can happen without drugs.
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Then I use a bit of the profits to promote issues I support. 
