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Old 08-07-2017, 10:02 AM
 
Location: alexandria, VA
16,352 posts, read 8,088,686 times
Reputation: 9726

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Quote:
Originally Posted by revrandy View Post
Hillary wasn't against it as in cancel it. Hillary wanted to renegotiate the TPP - that is different than the outright cancellation that Trump has done.
More like trying to have it both ways. Appealing to Sanders supporters by playing the protectionist card without recanting her earlier support. If the TPP was the "gold standard of trade deals" what was there to "renegotiate"?
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Old 08-07-2017, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Old Mother Idaho
29,212 posts, read 22,344,773 times
Reputation: 23853
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
Japan and the EU just signed a trade deal.

China and Mexico are signing trade deals.

Seems that all around us nations are working together on trade.

It's just us and the Brits now.
Heck, yes, they are!

We Americans are inventive people. We live in a very fruitful spot in the world, where our climate is varied, our lands are huge and fertile, and this allows us to grow just about everything in the world that is food.

Put them together and Americans now feed the most people with the fewest farmers than anywhere else on the planet. 3% of our people grow enough food to keep the other 97% alive, and there is so much more left over the leftovers could keep about 1/16 of the rest of the world alive too.

In all of human history before America came around, the best a farmer could do was keep him and his family alive. If a farmer was really good, and living in a place as good as this, he could keep about 4 or 5 other people alive too. But that depended on a very smart, skillful farmer who had a family full of strong sons, and they all needed to be very smart.

Just 100 years ago- a wink of an eye- an American farmer could feed 300 people. That was remarkable, an achievement no other nation was able to approach or accomplish.

So every other country in the world wanted to learn how we did it, and we taught them. And sold them our inventions, and sold them our farming practices, and we grew all the richer and better at everything. Nowadays, a single farmer with a large farm feeds thousands, while the rest of the world is now feeding hundreds.

But the world is full of smart people, and they too want to feed thousands. They know how to do it. All they need is their government to help them get going, give them the same breaks our government gave our farmers, and they're on their way.

It began long ago, so the rest of the world is catching up to us real fast. Since we can grow almost everything people eat, the rest of the world takes from us what it needs to grow what it can, and puts it to use. They don't have to grow everything to make money. We do. Because we got so good at it.

So now, our tomato farmers are competing with countries that can grow tomatoes when we can't. The world will always have winter and summer, and nothing grows here in the winter. That means our tomato farmers had to find a way to sell their tomatoes in the winter by storing them in a way they wouldn't rot.

So we invented ways to keep tomatoes from rotting. And the rest of the world used those inventions, too. It has become a never ending race for more, because more people are living now, and people eat all the time to stay alive.

The only way America can ever compete with the conditions we created is to sell as much as we can abroad.

If we can't do that, American farms will have to shrink down in size to make shortage as the only way prices can rise enough to make a farmer a profit. Without profit, the farm will shrink anyway, as the equipment wears out and can't be replaced.

And when farmers quit farming, we all will pay a lot more for our food. We now pay less than 25% of what we earn on basic food. The rest of the world pays between 35% to 60% of what they earn for food. In the poorest countries, food can cost a family almost all it's income- as much as 80%.

Americans could find themselves paying those prices for food if trade barriers are thrown up. And once a farm goes back to weeds, it's hard to get it back into production again.

Don't expect an impulsive New York City billionaire who has never set foot in a wheat field to understand a single thing about this. You could grow hungry, but he never will, and he doesn't care if you do.
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Old 08-07-2017, 10:38 AM
 
Location: Victoria, BC.
33,521 posts, read 37,121,123 times
Reputation: 13998
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
Politico forgets to mention that part.

TPP died because it was a bad deal.
Bad deal? Great deal for Canada! Pulling out of TPP was one of the most bone headed things Trump has done to the USA......

Last edited by sanspeur; 08-07-2017 at 11:08 AM..
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Old 08-07-2017, 11:04 AM
 
Location: Canada
7,676 posts, read 5,521,274 times
Reputation: 8817
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
I feel nothing. They voted for him.
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
They pretty much all did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
Fresh out of pity for rural America. They voted for this and it's poetic that they will pay the price.
Quote:
Originally Posted by skins_fan82 View Post
They all voted for Trump, though. Too bad, so sad. No sympathy from me.
I found the article a very interesting read but I am puzzled by the claim by posters here that farmers all voted for Trump. From the article:

Quote:
But even as Iowa was voting for Trump by 51 percent-42 percent, its farmers were looking to Asia as their savior.
Do you hold the 42% of voters in Iowa who did NOT vote for Trump responsible for the the 51% who did? That seems totally unfair.

Edited to add: Yes, I agree. The U.S. pulling out of TPP was great for us here in Canada.
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Old 08-07-2017, 11:31 AM
 
36,495 posts, read 30,827,524 times
Reputation: 32753
Quote:
Originally Posted by banjomike View Post
Here in Idaho, more of our potatoes are going to China now than what are sold here, and the Chinese are willing to pay a higher price for our spuds than Americans.

Our potatoes are being shipped only to China, either. Those great Idaho bakers are being shipped to Brazil, Argentina, Japan, everywhere.
Where a person loves a french fry, they love our potatoes. Idaho's spuds make the best french fries. It's our climate and volcanic soil that makes the difference.

So you can bet folks are upset about Trump screwing up our trade deals. This state spends a lot of tax money establishing those trade deals and keeping them solid and stable in unstable times. Foreign trade is what is keeping Idahoans employed, the state economy stable and growing, and our lives happy.

And our potatoes are only part of what Idaho exports. The computers and all the computer stuff we manufacture here, our timber, our minerals, our heavy manufacturing products (Idaho manufactures some very good farm implements), are all exported, and every one of them depends on export to thrive.

Every heartland state does the same. Every heartland state IS the same. We make more of everything than we can sell here in the U.S. alone.

Killing our trade deals is nothing but a straight drop into poverty for millions of us, because we all produce so much.
Dose dropping the trade deal exclude the US from trading with these countries or was the benefit for the US just in lowered tarriffs? China is not a participant in the TPP is it?
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Old 08-07-2017, 11:39 AM
 
36,495 posts, read 30,827,524 times
Reputation: 32753
Quote:
Originally Posted by Seacove View Post
Fresh out of pity for rural America. They voted for this and it's poetic that they will pay the price.
It is not rural America. Its is a few big Ag exporters who might or might lose out on some projected, estimated $ from trade with particular countries. So rural America doesn't need your pity.
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Old 08-07-2017, 11:49 AM
 
52,433 posts, read 26,603,454 times
Reputation: 21097
Quote:
Originally Posted by sanspeur View Post
Bad deal? Great deal for Canada! Pulling out of TPP was one of the most bone headed things Trump has done to the USA......
What would you have said if Hillary did it..... (as noted above she was going to pull out too.)

I thought so.

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Old 08-07-2017, 12:17 PM
 
Location: Somewhere Out West
2,287 posts, read 2,586,879 times
Reputation: 1956
Quote:
Originally Posted by WaldoKitty View Post
What would you have said if Hillary did it..... (as noted above she was going to pull out too.)

I thought so.

As I stated above, she was NOT going to pull out, she was in favor of renegotiating it so the U.S. got "a better deal".
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Old 08-07-2017, 12:26 PM
 
51,651 posts, read 25,790,245 times
Reputation: 37884
Quote:
Originally Posted by revrandy View Post
As I stated above, she was NOT going to pull out, she was in favor of renegotiating it so the U.S. got "a better deal".
She supported all along but then disagreed with the final text of the bill and wanted to modify it.
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Old 08-07-2017, 01:00 PM
 
2,274 posts, read 1,337,787 times
Reputation: 3985
Rural America deserves to pay the price for voting for Trump. This is not the first nor will it be the last time that people in rural areas let their hatred of gays and minorities override their common sense. Trump worked the gays, God and guns strategy to perfection and the people that fell for the same old scam yet again don't deserve an ounce of sympathy. Take away their food stamps, take away their SSDI and let them eat cake or Oxy. I really don't care what happens to the rubes in flyover country that are too stupid to pay attention to anything more than the slogan on a bumper sticker.

Last edited by shorman; 08-07-2017 at 01:09 PM..
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