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We are obviously in different places here. You seem to be focused on benefits.
2/3 of health care is covered... thank you for confirming that we are not in a free market system.
The only other thing I agree with is that you don't get it. When you make statements that people are repeating corporate owned think tanks, it shows you don't get it. Maybe that's what you do ... repeat think tanks ... I don't do that.
You have no way of knowing whether you are doing it or not.
As a simple matter, countries with universal care have lower costs and cover everyone.
We have higher costs and don't.
This is what is called "a no brainer"....
I just today had a perfect example of "capitalistic medicine". A friend works for a medical research company that has a mind boggling new product. This product COULD be hanging in your local CVS and you could do the test and send it in. Or, it could easily be at your GP office....but it's not.
When I asked him why not he said "The specialty that handles this type of disease is highly protective of their money and will freak out if we don't shunt all customers to them".
And so, it probably would cost $1,000 plus - and even worse it won't get done in many cases - and more people will suffer and die.
The problem isn't that I disagree with the "free market" (China is about the only real example of this among big and more modern countries). It's just that they got there from the ground up - whereas we already have decades of payoffs, lobbying, systems, etc.
If we go to "Joe Specialist" and say "Hey, Joe - for the good of the USA we have to make these tests more available and therefore you must be happy with 300K per year as opposed to 500K per year"....old Joe is going to quickly get on the phone with his trade group and squash any such efforts.
In other words, we have met the enemy and he is US.
Based on this, there is no solution up the path you are looking unless we have nuclear war and then start from scratch. There is no precedent in history for systems of this size pivoting.
And so - what you see as my (and others) preference for Universal Care is because that is all that is possible in the next decade or so.
I'm all for a true competitive system. But when there is one top hospital within 2 hours of millions of people it's sorta hard to have "competition". The capital cost of a place like Mass General (to make another one like it) would be in the 100's of billions PLUS the human capital, systems and training. Do you have any private companies ready to do this everywhere in the USA ?
A "free market" healthcare system isn't working. People don't price shop like they do when buying furniture. Many people done have multiple options. The government could do a better job regulating prices, but they don't. It's bloated and inefficient. We already pay for health care for all, and pay for it all over again out of pocket.
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But we don't have a "free market" health insurance system.
It's subsidized.
Free market is NO insurance and you pay out of pocket.
That's what we used to have.
Insurance was only used for hospital stays and even then only payed 80%.
Something has to give, and surely we will end up with a single payer system in some fashion. It cannot be 100% paid however in that we all need to have some skin in the game. If it costs nothing then many will over-use the system and demand more and more services. I saw this with my mother-in-law in her latter years. Going to the doctor became entertainment for her. When she'd get bored she start making doctor's appts for things that could not be fixed or cured, but they were glad to have her as each visit was a billing event. The visits would often be "How are you doing Mrs. L", "Great", "That's good to hear, see you again in 3 months". When My father-in-law was in the nursing home, his primary care doctor would come by, stick his head in the room, say "How are you doing Mr. L" (who had dementia) and then without much of a response, if any, the doctor would move on to the next room , billing each of them for office visits. My in-laws share of office visits was $5 if I recall so essentially they had no skin in the game and didn't think about the waste.
My SIL runs to the doctor at the drop of a hat for any ailment she has.
Says it only cost $15 so why not go to the doctor all the time.
From the OP's article: >> In fact, there are no OECD countries where the government picks up the entire health care tab. In Canada, government spending accounts for 70% of health costs, in Germany, 85%, in Sweden it’s 83.9%, and in the U.K. it’s under 80%, according to OECD data.<<
This is misleading garbage. It's a preview of the torrent of misinformation, lies and distortions that will come out if there's a serious push for Medicare For All.
Medicare does not and will not pick up "the entire health care tab." Medicare is basic coverage. As every senior knows, you need to buy supplemental insurance in order to get decent coverage. If you consider a supplemental plan might cost $300 per month and the value of Medicare might be $1,000 per month, then that implies about 75% coverage, in line with the OECD countries and Canada, which are cited above.
There is nothing radical about the Medicare For All proposal -- nothing! It already exists for seniors age 65 and over. Dropping the eligibility age from 65 to a younger age isn't radical, it's an expansion of an existing program.
Bernie came out with his proposal yesterday. It's not medicare. No out of pocket for anything and everything is covered including dental and vision. But he hasn't come out with his funding proposal yet.
Bernie came out with his proposal yesterday. It's not medicare. No out of pocket for anything and everything is covered including dental and vision. But he hasn't come out with his funding proposal yet.
No one has came out with a way to fund the wars yet either but that hasn't stopped us.
Sander's plan isn't radical at all. Single payer or Medicare for all is nothing more than public insurance, the actual healthcare is delivered by private doctors and hospitals.
The National Health Service of the UK is much more radical, where government not only pays for your care but also directly employs the doctors and nurses and owns all the hospitals.
Who knew the UK our closest, greatest ally in the world is a commie socialist country! The horror!
Bernie came out with his proposal yesterday. It's not medicare. No out of pocket for anything and everything is covered including dental and vision. But he hasn't come out with his funding proposal yet.
I'm glad that I was born with a basic understanding of math.
Single Payer won't cost more and could cost less. We've been through this a thousand times. We cover everyone (in one way or another) anyway. We all pay the costs.
A universal system roughly equiv. to the existing would cost the same - it's just a shell game and we pay the money to the "government exchange" or to "appointed insurance companies" instead of as-is.
Once we do move to such a system, we can then work on cost savings...which should be quite easy.
Note - a savings of 20% or so would come just from admin...medicare costs much less to admin than what insurance companies need.
Bernie came out with his proposal yesterday. It's not medicare. No out of pocket for anything and everything is covered including dental and vision. But he hasn't come out with his funding proposal yet.
He is going to sell unicorns and rainbows to pay for it
Where I'm at, you get coverage for all medically necessary treatment. You get no dental, no optometry, and no medical hardware like crutches or walking casts, you have to pay for that. An ambulance ride is about $90 which you also pay for. The insurance companies in the US are here, too, but their plans are limited to "supplemental" coverage which covers those extras.
Nice biased source, OP. Wake me up when the CBO scores it.
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