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Old 09-22-2017, 09:16 PM
 
716 posts, read 393,312 times
Reputation: 1045

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Quote:
Originally Posted by JAMS14 View Post
...The way I see it they have one more opportunity to avert disaster and that would be to pass some kind of single payer. The Democrats would support that, and as a Democrat I would give them kudos if they did. And the majority of Americans would applaud them for being so bold as to bring this country into the 21st century at last.

But I honestly don't think they're smart enough to figure that out.
I agree with most of what you say including that most Dems would support a single payer system that every other civilized country enjoys. After all it reduces costs and increases coverage.

But I can assure you that the Republicans will NEVER, EVER be so bold or smart to propose one. Did I mention ever? And I believe it's a big mistake for the Dems to go down that path, as a country, we're just not ready for it. If they did, I think they would give the Republicans a big advantage.

The trend is clear, looking back there's been a slow but steady increase for the idea, but currently "...independent voters are split on the idea, with 42 percent in favor and 33 percent opposed..." We need a clear majority of those independents before the Dems make an all out attempt. That's why I think Sanders is doing the Dems no favors by pushing it too soon. As of now, it's just a bridge too far.

I only hope it doesn't take too many years before Americans see the light or things could get really bad, or maybe that's what it'll take...

 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:19 PM
 
8,135 posts, read 3,674,077 times
Reputation: 2718
So, let's sum up. ACA/Obamacare was essentially Heritage foundation plan (yes, mandate and everything). However GOP was hell bent on making Obama one term president, so they were against it. While imperfect it was way better than the ridiculous individual market at that time (with basically 3 choices: relatively cheap policy that covers nothing, an extremely expensive policy that covers something but no preexisting, or the person is as insurable as a barrier island property, so no insurance).
Did it control the cost? Not very much, since the main mechanism, public option, never had the votes.

Now after all these years of pointless voting, GOP has the majority, and they come with this piece of ...
 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:20 PM
 
32,062 posts, read 15,058,461 times
Reputation: 13685
Quote:
Originally Posted by sd-bound View Post
I agree with most of what you say including that most Dems would support a single payer system that every other civilized country enjoys. After all it reduces costs and increases coverage.

But I can assure you that the Republicans will NEVER, EVER be so bold or smart to propose one. Did I mention ever? And I believe it's a big mistake for the Dems to go down that path, as a country, we're just not ready for it. If they did, I think they would give the Republicans a big advantage.

The trend is clear, looking back there's been a slow but steady increase for the idea, but currently "...independent voters are split on the idea, with 42 percent in favor and 33 percent opposed..." We need a clear majority of those independents before the Dems make an all out attempt. That's why I think Sanders is doing the Dems no favors by pushing it too soon. As of now, it's just a bridge too far.

I only hope it doesn't take too many years before Americans see the light or things could get really bad, or maybe that's what it'll take...
Of course they won't. They are only for the wealthy. This is also why republicans hate unions who represent the middle class.
 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:21 PM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,191,640 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by sd-bound View Post
I agree with most of what you say including that most Dems would support a single payer system that every other civilized country enjoys. After all it reduces costs and increases coverage.
You can say they would but the DNC voted it down again.

https://www.healthcare-now.org/blog/...e-payer-again/
 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:22 PM
 
18,983 posts, read 9,073,833 times
Reputation: 14688
Quote:
Originally Posted by sd-bound View Post
I agree with most of what you say including that most Dems would support a single payer system that every other civilized country enjoys. After all it reduces costs and increases coverage.

But I can assure you that the Republicans will NEVER, EVER be so bold or smart to propose one. Did I mention ever? And I believe it's a big mistake for the Dems to go down that path, as a country, we're just not ready for it. If they did, I think they would give the Republicans a big advantage.

The trend is clear, looking back there's been a slow but steady increase for the idea, but currently "...independent voters are split on the idea, with 42 percent in favor and 33 percent opposed..." We need a clear majority of those independents before the Dems make an all out attempt. That's why I think Sanders is doing the Dems no favors by pushing it too soon. As of now, it's just a bridge too far.

I only hope it doesn't take too many years before Americans see the light or things could get really bad, or maybe that's what it'll take...
You don't think we're at that point already? The GOP is doing everything it can to make sure the ACA fails, and when/if it does it will be a desperate situation for millions upon millions of Americans. Or if one of their horrible bills passes it would be a desperate situation for millions upon millions of Americans.

What alternatives do you see at this point?
 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:25 PM
 
18,983 posts, read 9,073,833 times
Reputation: 14688
Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
You can say they would but the DNC voted it down again.

https://www.healthcare-now.org/blog/...e-payer-again/
That was over 14 months ago. There might be a different outcome today.
 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:29 PM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,191,640 times
Reputation: 17209
Quote:
Originally Posted by JAMS14 View Post
That was over 14 months ago. There might be a different outcome today.
Nancy Pelosi Rejects Single Payer Being Added to Democratic Party Platform

Nancy Pelosi, Democratic Party Reject Single Payer Health Care System | Observer

You keep on making excuses though.
 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:36 PM
 
716 posts, read 393,312 times
Reputation: 1045
Quote:
Originally Posted by JAMS14 View Post
You don't think we're at that point already? The GOP is doing everything it can to make sure the ACA fails, and when/if it does it will be a desperate situation for millions upon millions of Americans. Or if one of their horrible bills passes it would be a desperate situation for millions upon millions of Americans.

What alternatives do you see at this point?
Bleak ones, I'm not very optimistic about the near future.

Actually if the Republicans continue to actively work to defund and wreck the ACA and things get really bad, it might offer the opportunity to get one passed. It seems that the older I get, the more pessimistic I am about Americans doing the right thing. Trump's election being a prime example...
 
Old 09-22-2017, 09:46 PM
 
Location: Sunshine Coast, QLD
3,674 posts, read 3,034,970 times
Reputation: 5466
Quote:
Originally Posted by Loveshiscountry View Post
Costs go up when government gets involved. Obamacare is a perfect example.
Like it was ultra cheap pre ACA??
 
Old 09-22-2017, 11:23 PM
 
Location: SE Arizona - FINALLY! :D
20,460 posts, read 26,328,298 times
Reputation: 7627
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kibby View Post
You are welcome to find a single LINK that I've ever posted from Fox News that I've ever posted - Good Luck!

As for the article from The Hill that you posted - I read The Hill regularly and posted this same LINK months ago ...... did you notice the part about Nancy Pelosi doesn't endorse this "plan"? Did you stop and wonder WHY Nancy Pelosi didn't endorse this plan?

House Minority Leader Nancy Pelosi (D-Calif.) said in a statement the proposal has "some promising ideas" but did not appear to fully endorse it.

I feel confident that Pelosi/Schumer remember the Massive Public Backlash to the last "Bailout" they proposed.
It wasn't pretty. This 10 point plan is right on point for what they really want ..... a Massive Bailout to Big Health Care and BIG Insurance companies.

That will go over like a Lead Balloon to the American Public. The American Public pays huge premiums with huge Deductibles that they never meet and for that honor ..... Big Health Care & BIG Insurance get multi Billion dollars in Bailout every single year ....... just to keep Obamacare from Imploding.

That is exactly why the Democrats have proposed no Bill at all to "fix" ObamaCare - the only "fix" they are willing to examine is a Massive Huge Annual Bailout to Wealthy Hospitals and Wealthy Insurance companies.
There's nothing in that article that states that Pelosi is against the plan, just that she didn't FULLY endorse it. What that means is anyone's guess. Maybe it means what you claim - though I doubt it, maybe it means she likes some of the ideas but not others, maybe it means she would like a few additions. In any event the Democrats are not currently IN a position to make this plan - or any other right now - a reality.
Of course that may change before too awfully long.

So WHY did you lie and claim that Democrats never proposed any "fixes" when you now claim you posted this very link months ago? These are concrete proposed "fixes" by Democrats - whether or not Pelosi gives her full endorsement.

Ken
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