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Contrary to the title of the thread, I don't think we can actually solve this debate but I am curious if the collective people here on City Data can come to any type of solution. Even a little..........
Pretty much every thread you read about gun violence has the exact same arguments over and over so I am going to challenge you NOT to post unless you can offer some glimmer of a solution. Even a weak solution that could potentially be built upon. Please read to the end before posting.
Pro-Gunners
I am a pro-gun individual but I am challenging you to really think about this and offer up what you are willing to do towards gun control / stopping all types of gun violence. As for myself I would agree to 1) make all full auto weapons illegal for sale to the public regardless of stamps. 2) All silencer's to be illegal as there isn't a real good reason to have them other than their cool........and don't do the whole hearing protection argument as it is weak. 3) Make tannerite illegal...........mark my words it will be used in a mass killing. Why is this product legal? I know it is damn fun and really cool to blow stuff up but think about it. Why is it legal? 4) Eliminate bump stocks. By all indications bump stocks were used in Vegas. (My own disclaimer to the above. I have not shot a full auto firearm but would love to do so. I have used a silencer, tannerite and a bump stock. All of which were a lot of fun but that is about it in my opinion........fun.)
Anti-Gunners
I apologize but I have a difficult time thinking as you do. This is not a slap in the face as I truly do want to understand your position. Perhaps you could bring answers to these questions to the thread. 1) Chicago and Washington D.C. have the strictest gun laws in existence yet they have the highest gun related crimes in the US. Why? 2) Regardless of what gun laws are put into place, people like Steve Paddock don't care. If they are willing to fire full auto into a crowd of 22,000 then they could really care less about a gun law. After all it is illegal to murder someone right? How do you address this? 3) I heard on the radio today there is 330,000,000 firearms in the US..........if they are made illegal what keeps the entire US from being turned into a large scale version of Washington D.C. and Chicago? 4) There has been a lot of discussion about mental health and gun ownership. How do you enforce this? How do you decide if someone is mentally fit to own a firearm or not? I would sure bet that Steve Paddock would have passed the test.
Guess we will see where this goes from here. I sincerely hope to see honest soul searching on how to help the situation.
I don't know why the pro-gun folks and the anti-gun folks (or should they be called pro-gun restriction?) Cannot come to some kind of terms.
Do the laws we have on the books work? Are they enforced? Should mentally incapable people be restricted from buying-obtaining-using firearms? How do you define mentally capable and how do you restrict their use?
It's the age-old question, how do restrict its use?
Next issue, silencers. Hunters, why again do we need silencers?
Must we die on this hill?
Tell you what liberals. We'll compromise, but since we don't trust you as far as we can spit, nor should we, we'll have to compromise.
Give us something. Seriously. Give us something small, like Obamacare repeal and replace, then we'll compromise something here.
How willing are you to go?
I'm no NRA fan, seriously. They've become a huge ripoff. Where would the country be without them? That's another story.
There's always a bunch of things we can compromise. Say like, waiving Confederate flags around vs making nuns pay for birth control.
What are you willing to give up?
Quote:
Originally Posted by kell490
There is no need for Alcohol yet 88,000 people die a year in the US from it why not ban that?
Only one in 10 of us is alky or potential alky and only another 10 % of us even likes to drink hard or get drunk on a regular basis. So 80% of us don't even have a problem with booze in the first place, or the second or third place, I think I lost my place.
We can't ban booze anyway if we wanted to. That's like banning food. People can make their own alcohol. So there's another topic for another thread obviously, but an interesting topic to me nonetheless.
Quote:
Originally Posted by stockwiz
I stopped when I read to make suppressors illegal. They should be unregulated and free for non felons to purchase. Punish the criminals, not the law abiding. Hearing protection is a very valid reason, especially for an indoor home defense situation at night.
Why again can't the hunter just wear ear protection, donning it right before they pull the barrel down to take the shot?
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer
Which gun show? I bought most of my guns at gun shows. Every time I had to go through background checks.
By the way, not too many things are more stupid than background checks, seriously. If someone is so dangerous that he can’t even own a gun, why the hell do we let him roam the streets????
I did.too.
We need to be brutal and medieval to violent and hardened criminals. Let's at very least monitor them better or find out what's wrong with our justice and penal system and fix it. What do other countries do, who does it better, how do they do it?
Please stop using what has become the most f'ing overused, misused word since it was hijacked by the dogmatic, raging, militant, fanatical extreme American right and subsequently bleeted, ad nauseum, by its sheep:
"agenda."
Just stop. There is NO agenda. There is NO conspiracy.
There is also no US government (including Trump and his motley crew) that poses nearly as much of a public health and security threat as does the Angry White American Male. His rage transcends any sitting president, any administration, any booming or busting economy, or any refugee.
His rage knows no bounds. It has no beginning and, likely, no end. His domestic terrorism -- yes, that's exactly what it is -- is more sinister, more senseless, more relentless, but every bit as bloodthirsty as any potential act of international terrorism on US soil.
Only one of the above require a background check. I don't even have to register firearms.
We essentially have no gun control (outside of full auto bans). What we have is basically just on paper and poorly enforced and has too many holes in it.
Which gun show? I bought most of my guns at gun shows. Every time I had to go through background checks.
By the way, not too many things are more stupid than background checks, seriously. If someone is so dangerous that he can’t even own a gun, why the hell do we let him roam the streets????
I should really forget about all the mass shootings in the US that have left who knows how many dead -- including 20 6-YEAR-OLD CHILDREN. I should stop being melodramatic.
There are after all, far more important issues, like NFL players kneeling during the US anthem.
If you're not planning to kill yourself and aren't a felon (a stretch for the left I'm sure) you're 40x more likely to be killed by a car and more likely to be struck by lightning than to be killed by someone with an "assault rifle".
You don't provide a source for your stats, and they are laughable. Using your numbers only 3 % of gun homicides represent an individual shooting a "non-felon." I don't think that's the case. The domestic violence homicides alone are a higher percentage.
I really forget about all the mass shootings in the US that have left who knows how many dead -- including 20 6-YEAR-OLD CHILDREN. I should stop being melodramatic.
There are after all, far more important issues, like NFL players kneeling during the US anthem.
Your rage is misdirected, the guns didn't act on their own and 99.9% of the white guys you so resent harmed no one with theirs. You seem kinda unhinged,if you dont have one now, please dont buy one.
Because your "assault weapon" is my weekend plinker. You won't be any safer if I give it up. You can't "buy back" something that was never yours. All ammunition is "armor piercing" when it comes out of a rifle. We already have a gun registry, and nearly all "domestic abuse" complaints are bogus.
Your last remark is incredibly ignorant. Half of all female homicide victims are killed by an intimate partner.. Are you saying that's made up? And before homicide occurs, those women and their children have usually endured years of prior abuse and domestic violence.
Not to mention that many of the mass shootings that occur nearly every day in the U.S. are murder/suicides in which a family member, usually a male, kills himself and members of his family.
Domestic violence includes abuse of children. "In 2014, state agencies identified an estimated 1,580 children who died as a result of abuse and neglect — between four and five children a day. However, studies also indicate significant undercounting of child maltreatment fatalities by state agencies — by 50% or more."
Witnesses reported that Stephen Pollack mistreated his girlfriend in public. Many violent offenders are also perpetrators of domestic violence.
Your rage is misdirected, the guns didn't act on their own and 99.9% of the white guys you so resent harmed no one with theirs. You seem kinda unhinged,if you dont have one now, please dont buy one.
I've been surrounded my whole life by the strong, white males in my family, including the two I carried, gave birth to, and am raising to be strong, white men.
The only white men I resent are those weaklings responsible for the murder and devastation in 99% of the mass killings in this country.
My God you've nailed it!
I suggested they move to either North Korea or Venezuela. Do you think they'll take me up on it? They hate this country, the principles that it was founded on and every thing it has ever stood for. Yet they cant understand why there's so much vehement opposition to them?
We are a Constitutional Republic and not a Democracy where the majority or mob rules. The Constitution is the law of the land who's purpose is to uphold individual civil liberties and constrain government. Our rights are "endowed by our creator" and not by the will of the people or an elected body of men or women. They just can't come to grips with that and are trying to teach a convoluted version of our history through our public educational system, colleges and universities. But that still does not change the facts.
I am glad you think so, and your post is worthy of being quoted as well.
I can see the NRA arguing that mentally ill people have 2nd Amendment Rights too.
I would suspect it would depend on what type of mental illness a person was legally and medically adjudicated to have. Not everyone who has some mental illness is automatically violent or a threat to society.
If you are/were a nurse, you should appreciate that. Mental illness should not be stigmatized and generalized as one size fits all.
Lets also not forget that the powers that be can designate people to be mentally ill just as a backdoor gun control scheme. That is exactly what Obama & Co did with older Americans and veterans who needed help with their finances.
Hopefully you are aware of what I speak and agree?
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