The Continuing Curse of Leftism: Dr. Seuss museum mural to be replaced amid claims of a racist depiction (abuse, races)
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Eh...thought it would have actually been one of the illustrations Dr. Suess made that was actually racist against the Japanese.
This wasn't but its up to the museum how they want to respond.
FWIW, someone mentioned Uncle Remus books and Little Black Sambo and wanted to note on Remus in particular a lot of blacks don't dislike the stories but we do dislike the fact that Joel Chandler Harris stole the stories and got compensated for something he did not create. He retold cultural stories of black Americans and IMO that is the only sort of "cultural appropriation" that is disturbing and personally bothers me. I don't give a crap about hairstyles or jewelry or cloth patterns, etc., but Harris stole our cultural tales and profited off of them. To me it is like when white rock and role artists stole old Blues songs and didn't pay the originators of those songs.
Little Black Sambo was actually about an Indian boy/family. The illustrations in America did play into stereotypical depictions of black Americans but IMO it was not a bad story.
I think the thing is because America is a lot of different regions and nationalities going to certain regions as well (Hispanics in the southwest, Asians on the west coast, Europeans on the east coast.) That is where I am coming from. There is no unified "American culture."
America does have a culture....
That is why Americans of the ethnic groups/nationalities you cited above, are always known to be "American" by our manners and appearance and when we open our mouths in other countries. We are more alike than different and the dominant American culture is what binds us.
<>
FWIW, someone mentioned Uncle Remus books and Little Black Sambo and wanted to note on Remus in particular a lot of blacks don't dislike the stories but we do dislike the fact that Joel Chandler Harris stole the stories and got compensated for something he did not create<>
Can't find my copy just now, an early edition, I think, but in the preface it relates that Harris was seeking to preserve the characteristics of the dialect for the future.
Steven Foster gets the same bad rap.
That is why Americans of the ethnic groups/nationalities you cited above, are always known to be "American" by our manners and appearance and when we open our mouths in other countries. We are more alike than different and the dominant American culture is what binds us.
There are very distinct dialects, far more than say England. There's Bostonian, Long Island, Brooklynese, Ebonics, Southern drawl, Texas, Cajun, surfer speak, etc. What I am saying that we had far too much sub-cultures to have one true culture that unifies us.
No, not all Massachusetts people are like this. I was born in that city, went to those museums as a kid, and took out my first library book, a Dr Seuss book, at the nearby city library. Sorry that three authors are offended and won't attend the event. Maybe they can find something better to do. There must be something better to do than find silly things to complain about.
A lot of us grew up with those books and survived just fine with no stupid prejudice or stereotypes about the Chinese. These are just kids books, books of cartoons. Cartoons exaggerate features. Get used to it, people.
Another book that kids can't read anymore, btw, is Little Black Sambo. Oh dear. And I used to LOVE that book. He ate ALL the pancakes and I adored him. But somebody decided the book was offensive. Turns out Sambo was from INDIA, he was not a black person at all!
Gypsies are censored too. Kids can't learn about the gypsies unless it's filtered and sanitized. Give kids some credit--they can actually think better than a lot of adults and they are usually more understanding. Stop projecting the warped adult viewpoint onto innocent kids.
Oh, and I am a liberal Democrat who was also a school librarian. I do not believe in censoring books. Children understand and adults can help even more by explaining. We don't have to ban books.
Absolutely right. Librarians are not in the business of censorship and museum curators are not either.
I think the museum is violating ethical standards in doing what they are doing.
Excerpt from their code of ethics:
III. A CURATOR’S VALUES
Curatorial work is guided by the following values:
• To serve the public good by contributing to and promoting learning, inquiry, and dialogue, and by making the depth and breadth of human knowledge available to the public.
• To serve the institution by responsible stewardship of financial, material, and intellectual resources; by pursuit of the goals and mission of the institution with respect for the diversity of ideas, cultures, and beliefs; and by integrity of scholarly research.
• To serve the museum profession by promoting and practicing excellence, honesty, and transparency in all professional activities.
I think the thing is because America is a lot of different regions and nationalities going to certain regions as well (Hispanics in the southwest, Asians on the west coast, Europeans on the east coast.) That is where I am coming from. There is no unified "American culture."
That'd be saying like Mexico does NOT have a "culture". Hell, not all Mexicans citizen even speak Spanish, especially some of the Mayans but; they're still ALL "Mexicans".
There are very distinct dialects, far more than say England. There's Bostonian, Long Island, Brooklynese, Ebonics, Southern drawl, Texas, Cajun, surfer speak, etc. What I am saying that we had far too much sub-cultures to have one true culture that unifies us.
This is true for all countries in regards to geographical differences. Have you been to the UK? They have a LOT of different sub-cultures and dialects (note that "Ebonics" is not really a thing in America it was a made up word for what is considered black or African American Vernacular BVE/AAVE). But they are English and have a common, shared culture and history - same as us Americans.
Can't find my copy just now, an early edition, I think, but in the preface it relates that Harris was seeking to preserve the characteristics of the dialect for the future.
Steven Foster gets the same bad rap.
On the bold, IMO that is condescending. Blacks had already documented many of those stories and "preserved" our own dialect. Black scholars had also already studied our dialect and still do pay a particular attention to BVE/AAVE as noted above.
He stole our stories. That is my personal view and the view of many black people who are educated on the subject and know of the work of black sociologists, anthropologists, and cultural historians.
On Foster, I don't think he gets the same view amongst blacks in particular. I took a lot of music lessons myself and come from a very musical family (going back to my 2nd great grandparents, it was a requirement on my maternal side to sing in chorus and play at least 2 instruments - will note my grandmother in particular was VERY focused on insuring we learned what she called "our songs" primarily negro spirituals that are the basis of a lot of American music). I've always enjoyed Foster's songs and feel that he took/sampled from a lot of ethnic groups to create his pieces and not primarily black American. IMO his music truly is "American" in nature because it combines various types of musical traditions from native, to African, to European. That is why his work is still popular today IMO.
Harris got famous and rich off of the stories of black Americans. He wrote them as being told by a black man because he had admittedly heard them from a black man in his youth. I have a particular interest in literature of black America and as a result I'm very possessive of it, as those stories in particular are one of the few vestiges of black American culture that combines the African tradition and stories with a (black) American take/spin on those stories. So I will always think he stole and profited off our culture and a lot of black people who are really "into" our stories feel the same way. Will also note that I don't think he captured the dialect as well as Charles W. Chestnutt or the later work of Zora Neal Hurston who worked as an anthropologists and documented dozens of black dialects in America and even the folklore of Haiti and other stories/dialects/traditions of the African diaspora. Contrary to what people believe, there is no one particular vernacular in black America and no specific "Ebonics." Just like whites in America have regional dialectic traditions, so do and have black Americans. Also the stories told via folklore in black America differed based on the region and what the storytellers inserted into their particular take of a story. Hurston's documentation of black folklore IMO is one of the best because she was black and grew up with the dialect so had a much more intense experience with it. She also appreciated that it was truly a "black" thing in a way and didn't see black people in the diaspora as a monolith of all being the same, like unfortunately many non-black people did and still do today. Also her particular focus was on preserving folklore and songs of blacks of the American south and Caribbean. Her body of work is way above that of Harris, who just retold stuff he heard and IMO didn't have the appreciation for it like Hurston and Chestnutt did. FWIW, Chestnutt was a contemporary of Harris. He was one of the most well known black authors of that era. Also FWIW, he was mostly white, a "mullatto" who grew up in Ohio. I'm from Ohio and I've also had a particular love for him and his work. Also Paul L. Dunbar whose most famous works were his dialect pieces.
Last edited by residinghere2007; 10-10-2017 at 07:03 AM..
This must reaction about a mural but little concerns for injustices that happen every day to human beings.
Yeah - -your feigned concern for the well being of this country is noted.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
