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A company "goes public" (publicly traded) in order to generate capital. Investors by "stock" in the company, expecting to profit by the company's success. The revenue received by selling stock is usually used for the purpose of business expansion.
There is nothing at all wrong with this system. But those stockholders (now part owners of the company) do expect to receive a return on their investment. They receive a share of the profits.
Unless a company has an Employee Stock Purchase Plan, an employee is entitled only to his salary or hourly wage. He is paid according to the work that he/she does, and that is determined by the market. Every position has a wage/salary range. When you reach the top of that range, you must either improve your skills so that you can move into a higher paying position, or you are going to remain where you are forever. Few people are going to do that. Most people seek to better themselves and their earnings.
But union workers often do not move into higher paying positions. Instead, they demand more pay for doing the same job they have been doing for many years. They claim that they "deserve" to share in the profits that they created." Wrong. They are paid to do a job. Their paycheck is their reward for their service. They have no other investment in the company other than time, and they are getting paid for that.
This is all accurate. Yet, we can create a system where eventually .1% have 99% of the wealth. At what point would this be problematic? Because we are heading in that direction at a record pace. Tax policy may be the ONLY way that we can prevent our nation from becoming an oligarchy. Is there any other solution you are aware of?
Tax the hell out of the rich and eliminate pensions and retirement accounts (because they depend on the profits made from the financial risks taken by the rich).
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nononsenseguy
A company "goes public" (publicly traded) in order to generate capital. Investors by "stock" in the company, expecting to profit by the company's success. The revenue received by selling stock is usually used for the purpose of business expansion.
There is nothing at all wrong with this system. But those stockholders (now part owners of the company) do expect to receive a return on their investment. They receive a share of the profits.
Unless a company has an Employee Stock Purchase Plan, an employee is entitled only to his salary or hourly wage. He is paid according to the work that he/she does, and that is determined by the market. Every position has a wage/salary range. When you reach the top of that range, you must either improve your skills so that you can move into a higher paying position, or you are going to remain where you are forever. Few people are going to do that. Most people seek to better themselves and their earnings.
But union workers often do not move into higher paying positions. Instead, they demand more pay for doing the same job they have been doing for many years. They claim that they "deserve" to share in the profits that they created." Wrong. They are paid to do a job. Their paycheck is their reward for their service. They have no other investment in the company other than time, and they are getting paid for that.
This is all accurate. Yet, we can create a system where eventually .1% have 99% of the wealth. At what point would this be problematic? Because we are heading in that direction at a record pace. Tax policy may be the ONLY way that we can prevent our nation from becoming an oligarchy. Is there any other solution you are aware of?
At the very least tax policy should not encourage it!
Tax policy should not be manipulating a free market system and trying to make everyone "equal." And your assumption that we will reach a point where ".1% have 99% of the wealth" (again, you're assuming there is only so much wealth) is just plain ridiculous!
A company "goes public" (publicly traded) in order to generate capital. Investors by "stock" in the company, expecting to profit by the company's success. The revenue received by selling stock is usually used for the purpose of business expansion.
There is nothing at all wrong with this system. But those stockholders (now part owners of the company) do expect to receive a return on their investment. They receive a share of the profits.
Correct, and that also applies to anyone whose pension plan or retirement account holds corporate debt. They expect the principal to be repaid, plus interest.
US Corporations are moving off-shore because of the High US Tax Rates on those same Corporations. The profits are not taxed unless they come back to the USA ...... so they don't come back and they don't use those profits in the USA to build more business, hire more people, increase wages AND support the US Tax Structure.
there's an easy solution : Don't let companies that are based in tax havens do business in the United States anymore. Make it a criminal offense for Americans to engage in business with tax havens. Start throwing American lawyers and accountants and financial planners in jail if they violate these laws, just like we would do with someone supporting ISIS.
If we were losing corporate HQ's to Germany, China, UK, Japan, or other *real* nations, then you might have a point. But the idea that we ought to lower our corporate tax rates to compete with an island tax haven that exploits us is ridiculous and counterproductive.
Start cracking down on these little non-existent island countries, simple as that.
Tax policy should not be manipulating a free market system and trying to make everyone "equal." And your assumption that we will reach a point where ".1% have 99% of the wealth" (again, you're assuming there is only so much wealth) is just plain ridiculous!
Think!
First of all, you have neatly sidestepped my point and my question. Is there a point where X number of people hold x amount of wealth that would make you take notice?
Are you aware that the acceleration of wealth to the top has increased noticeably in the past decade?
Do you believe it is worth considering that lowering the tax rate on wealthy individuals may have the effect of accelerating this process.
If you choose to ignore these very simple questions we have zero reason to converse any further.
We have steadily watched the US wealth gravitate to fewer and fewer people, no? It is accelerating as we speak. Tax policy is encouraging it. If you do not want tax policy to be manipulative, then why push it even further? Is the Trump clan going to inherit billions to build upon (with the best lawyers and FAs that money can buy) because Don Jr and Ivanka are so much better and smarter than you? Do you really believe that the very wealthy have become that way via "the free market"? Not by being in a position to massage the rules and create the tax codes to favor them?
Libertarians believe that it will all work out through the magic of economics. I do not. History has soundly proven that the free market creates massive bubbles and excesses. The people at the bottom economic rungs are always the one's who suffer and with each deep recession the wealthy come out further ahead.
Those with the gold make the rules. For some reason those without keep helping them.
Last edited by shaker281; 11-16-2017 at 08:36 AM..
Tax policy should not be manipulating a free market system and trying to make everyone "equal." And your assumption that we will reach a point where ".1% have 99% of the wealth" (again, you're assuming there is only so much wealth) is just plain ridiculous!
Think!
Our existing tax policy is not trying to make everyone equal. Our existing tax policy is paying for essential things like schools, public universities, roads, airports, bridges, police, fire protection, the military, water and sewer systems, social security and healthcare for grandma, food and shelter for the disabled, labor protection, consumer protection, environment protection, and all of the other things we take for granted.
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