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Old 11-24-2017, 04:06 PM
 
41,813 posts, read 51,059,937 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
I would hope that they are but here is why I look at this with a jaundiced eye. Why target the drug labs as opposed to the drug fields?
This is one of those issues where you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. The people farming those fields are doing it to feed their families. Destroying them produces a farmer who can no longer feed his family because you destroyed his crops, not very good for people you are trying to make friends with. Targeting the labs is good idea because the farmer can continue farming.
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Old 11-24-2017, 04:07 PM
 
Location: Texas
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post
In 2000, they needed the money.

The pictures of the troops from my recollection were later - when we were indeed offering them help.

So during Bush/Obama - all parties were supporting opium production. I am just clarifying that the Taliban did not have a change of heart with their phony ban.
I added it late but besides there was a drought, I wonder if there was any proof of how much of an effect it had? Poppies are drought resistant and I wonder if there is a way to measure the effect of the drought in Afghanistan vs how easy it was to measure Califronias drought.
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Old 11-24-2017, 04:09 PM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,210,872 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
This is one of those issues where you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. The people farming those fields are doing it to feed their families. Destroying them produces a farmer who can no longer feed his family because you destroyed his crops, not very good for people you are trying to make friends with Targeting the labs is good idea because the farmer can continue farming.
You do understand that this makes absolutely no sense right? What good does it do if the farmer has no one to sell to? Or is it as noted above.......we are targeting specific labs while making sure those we support are still able to produce heroin?
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Old 11-24-2017, 04:10 PM
 
Location: Texas
37,949 posts, read 17,870,209 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thecoalman View Post
This is one of those issues where you are damned if you do and damned if you don't. The people farming those fields are doing it to feed their families. Destroying them produces a farmer who can no longer feed his family because you destroyed his crops, not very good for people you are trying to make friends with. Targeting the labs is good idea because the farmer can continue farming.
They tried replacing it with cotton but the market went south.
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Old 11-24-2017, 04:11 PM
 
Location: Texas
37,949 posts, read 17,870,209 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
You do understand that this makes absolutely no sense right? What good does it do if the farmer has no one to sell to? Or is it as noted above.......we are targeting specific labs while making sure those we support are still able to produce heroin?
Right. They go broke either way. At least bomb the fields so the workers dont do all that work only to see it destroyed in the labs.
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Old 11-24-2017, 04:17 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
You do understand that this makes absolutely no sense right? What good does it do if the farmer has no one to sell to?
It would not make sense to you, I understand.
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Old 12-17-2017, 10:07 PM
 
45,582 posts, read 27,196,139 times
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Progress report from the Dept. of Defense...

Department of Defense Press Briefing by General Bunch via teleconference from Kabul, Afghanistan

On November 20th, General Nicholson discussed the opening salvo of airstrikes against the Taliban's opium and heroin enterprise in northern Helmand. Today, I'd like to update you on what the Afghans and we have been able to accomplish in only three short weeks.

Since the beginning of this campaign, we have eliminated 25 narcotics processing labs from the Taliban inventory. This equates to almost $80 million of drug money eliminated from the kingpins' pockets, while denying over $16 million of direct revenue to their Taliban partners.

...
Additionally, the Afghan National Interdiction Unit conducted two simultaneous raids of Taliban narcotics bazaars, as part of this integrated campaign. This resulted in over 2,000 kilograms of heroin and 5,000 kilograms of opium getting confiscated.

...
Again, the Taliban have never had to face a sustained targeting campaign focused on disrupting their illicit revenue activities. But let me be very clear about this campaign: this offensive was a joint effort between the Afghan National Defense and Security Forces, the United States Army, Air Force, Navy and Marine Corps, all collectively exercising authorities granted under the South Asia policy.

...
Further, and more importantly, the Afghans are leading this fight. They want to own it and they do. They demonstrate their sense of ownership every day on the battlefield.

And for the Taliban, they have been completely unable to achieve any objectives from their declared Operation Mansouri during this fighting season. In addition to their unrealistic goals, they have been unable to take a provincial capital or even a single city. This year the Taliban and have fared poorly.

...
the momentum is clearly with the Afghan defense forces. Our coalition is proving the enemy's theory of victory is wrong. They believed they would win because we lacked political will. They underestimated us, and they underestimated the will of the overwhelming majority of the Afghan people. Eighty-seven percent of the Afghans believe the Taliban is bad for Afghanistan.


Thank you Trump Administration for doing what should have been done from the beginning - which is to take out their source of revenue.
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Old 12-17-2017, 10:30 PM
 
45,582 posts, read 27,196,139 times
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On past and present operations...

See, previously, the mission here in Afghanistan was on a shrinking path to around a thousand personnel with decreasing responsibilities.

However, in August, when the president introduced the new South Asia policy and its new accompanying authorities, we transitioned from a time-based mission to one that is now conditions-based. As General Nicholson has stated, we will be here until the job is done.


In other words - we are now truly in the battle to win and be successful.

But a key part to these operations, and our successful future operations, are strong Afghan defense forces. Where before our Resolute Support forces could only train, advise and assist the Afghans at the corps level, the new South Asia policy will allow our forces to embed with Afghans all the way down to their kandaks.

This change allows our forces to train, advise and assist Afghan units and leaders directly controlling the fight and accelerate the transition to increased capability and capacity.

...
We literally are taking the training, advise and assist mission to a new level, the kandak level, which we believe will mark yet another turning point in ultimately demonstrating to the Taliban that they cannot win.


Highlights the change from a hands off approach in the past, to a hands-on approach that is much more effective.

Question to the general...

STAFF: Lucas Tomlinson, Fox?

Q: General, you said that this is the first time the U.S. military has bombed Taliban revenue sources in the drug trade. Why did it take more than 16 years for the U.S. military to adopt this strategy?

GEN. BUNCH: I can't speak to why it's taken us so long.

What I can tell you is that the new strategy highlights that this is a new war. And that the gloves are off, if you will, and that we've got now these authorities we need to be able to go and target the Taliban network.

With the air interdiction campaign, we are able to go after the Taliban's support structure, whereas before we could only strike essentially in defense of the ANDSF forces that were in contact with the enemy. And so now we're able to go after their weapons cache sites, their revenue generation, their C2 nodes. All the areas where they thought they were safe and they are no longer so.

And so that is our new strategy going forward and it's definitely been a game-changer and the Taliban is definitely feeling it.


In the past administration, we tied our own hands from attacking the Taliban by making up a rule to only use combat if the Afghan special forces were in a battle. Now, we are no longer hamstringing ourselves from defeating the enemy.

So you can see the operational differences before Trump got into office versus what they are doing now.
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Old 12-18-2017, 12:33 AM
 
79,907 posts, read 44,210,872 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DRob4JC View Post

In the past administration, we tied our own hands from attacking the Taliban by making up a rule to only use combat if the Afghan special forces were in a battle. Now, we are no longer hamstringing ourselves from defeating the enemy.

So you can see the operational differences before Trump got into office versus what they are doing now.
The Taliban never did anything to us.
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Old 12-18-2017, 12:44 AM
 
34,300 posts, read 15,656,546 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pknopp View Post
You could as easily bomb the fields. That we are not going after the fields leads me to believe this is not a true effort.
What's the crop worth if it can't be processed ? Not much eventually.
Attacking the fields would be seen as an attack on farmers and all that comes with that.

The transport of the harvest can be tracked by satellite to the processing plant and it cost less to take out the drug labs.
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