Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:09 PM
 
34,058 posts, read 17,081,326 times
Reputation: 17213

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Where I work, we have a half dozen college graduates (out of two dozen employees). They can't afford to enroll in community college.
If they need more money, they should seek 2nd jobs.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:10 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
Raises taxes on the middle class, explodes the deficit by more than a trillion dollars, and takes health care away from millions of Americans.

Next up -- cuts to Social Security, Medicare, and Medicaid.

All so GOP billionaire donors will have even more billions to play stock market games with.

It's actually strategically well-crafted. It raises taxes on the HIGH-TAX BLUE STATE middle class while cutting taxes for the middle class elsewhere.

So it effectively punishes blue states while cutting taxes for parents everywhere else.

And also hoses low-wage workers everywhere.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:14 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
However you want to frame it, the middle class in Western European countries (including Scandinavia) have less disposable income and a lower standard of living than the US middle class, because they've accepted paying much higher taxes and therefore having a lower standard of living in exchange for access to more government services.

How middle classes in U.S., Western Europe compare | Pew Research Center

If you think the US middle class would accept a lower standard of living in exchange for access to more government services, work on that behalf.

Or, as I like to put it, American middle-class homeowners have an oversize sense of entitlement. As in Michigan, where they felt entitled to pay 1/4 property tax rate.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:16 PM
 
34,058 posts, read 17,081,326 times
Reputation: 17213
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
It's actually strategically well-crafted. It raises taxes on the HIGH-TAX BLUE STATE middle class while cutting taxes for the middle class elsewhere.

So it effectively punishes blue states while cutting taxes for parents everywhere else.

And also hoses low-wage workers everywhere.

Not necessarily. I know many New England towns where property taxes are under 6k, and a middle class person making say 75k would owe 3k max in state income taxes. That has them under the 10k cap.

A cousin with a mortgage well above 10k SALT is still going to save, net, $1,300 per year in Federal Income Taxes.

3% reduction on tax brackets from $9,525 to over $80k, for singles, goes a long way.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:25 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
Does the 1% still pay more in tederal income taxes than any other group? Yes, by a large amount.

Does about 45% of the lowest earners still pay no federal income taxes while receiving more services than the top 1%? Yes.

And you think the 1% are getting over on everyone else? Lol, yeah, good one.

Who owns the income-producing assets and businesses patronized by the 99%? (many businesses are closely held i.e. privately owned)

When the 99% get their tax cuts they will hand back a lot of it to the top e.g. rents will necessarily skyrocket and the tax cuts will be a gift that keeps giving to landlords.

A childless adult working full time at minimum wage pays $468 in 2017 federal income tax, plus over $1,000 in Social Security and Medicare taxes. Is this person in the top 55% of income earners? If not, why are they paying federal income tax when 45% are not?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:31 PM
 
34,058 posts, read 17,081,326 times
Reputation: 17213
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
Who owns the income-producing assets and businesses patronized by the 99%? (many businesses are closely held i.e. privately owned)

When the 99% get their tax cuts they will hand back a lot of it to the top e.g. rents will necessarily skyrocket and the tax cuts will be a gift that keeps giving to landlords.

A childless adult working full time at minimum wage pays $468 in 2017 federal income tax, plus over $1,000 in Social Security and Medicare taxes. Is this person in the top 55% of income earners? If not, why are they paying federal income tax when 45% are not?
All should pay. I'd favor a flat tax, one rate for both people and corps, paid from dollar one, on an individual basis. 10% would be a nice rate. So a mw worker, 2,080 hrs @ 7.25 or $15,080 gross would pay $1,508.

No exemptions. No deductions. Change rate should require 75% vote in both House and Senate, plus POTUS signature.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:33 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by BobNJ1960 View Post
Not necessarily. I know many New England towns where property taxes are under 6k, and a middle class person making say 75k would owe 3k max in state income taxes. That has them under the 10k cap.

A cousin with a mortgage well above 10k SALT is still going to save, net, $1,300 per year in Federal Income Taxes.

3% reduction on tax brackets from $9,525 to over $80k, for singles, goes a long way.

The tax cut for full-time low-wage workers (10% tax bracket, no kids) is a whopping $160 per year. How does that go a long way when rents in most US markets are going up faster than that?

The average low-wage worker will be worse off at the end of 2018 than they were at the end of 2017.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:34 PM
 
34,058 posts, read 17,081,326 times
Reputation: 17213
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
The tax cut for full-time low-wage workers (10% tax bracket, no kids) is a whopping $160 per year. How does that go a long way when rents in most US markets are going up faster than that?

The average low-wage worker will be worse off at the end of 2018 than they were at the end of 2017.
2.7% earn mw.

Focus should be, and is, on the MIDDLE class.

4.1% national unemployment. Who in the world cannot get past the lowest 2.7% of earners in such an economy?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:41 PM
 
33,016 posts, read 27,464,007 times
Reputation: 9074
Quote:
Originally Posted by PedroMartinez View Post
I can see you now. Best Buy has a 20% off sale, and you think you should get money back even though you didn’t purchase anything from them.

Taxes and private sector businesses are not the same.

Doesn't hurt me one bit when Best Buy has 20% off and I don't buy anything.

Doesn't hurt me when a rich person gets a tax cut and buys a Lexus - doesn't stop me from buying a Metro.

Hurts me a ton when tens of millions spend their tax cuts in the rental market and THEIR spending means MY rent goes up $100. (Really hard to avoid paying rent unless you are a freeloader or a member of the Property Class.)

And no that's not the same as if they buy Doritos with their tax cuts - crunch all you want, we'll make more. Not so with housing. It will take at least the better part of the decade for the housing market to deliver enough supply to meet the increased demand caused by this tax cut.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 12-25-2017, 04:47 PM
 
34,058 posts, read 17,081,326 times
Reputation: 17213
Quote:
Originally Posted by freemkt View Post
. It will take at least the better part of the decade for the housing market to deliver enough supply to meet the increased demand caused by this tax cut.
Has your rent been stagnant for 15 years now?
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:55 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top