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For starters, the old playbook for pit apologists (which you seem to be stuck on) now falls on deaf ears by most informed people. So you can cut the misidentification ruse.
Miami-Dade county actually had that claim covered by including mixed dogs and even has wording to the effect of dogs with pitbull type characteristics.
I took the time to highlight only one of your many absurd comments, because you sound very much like the type of people I mentioned in my earlier post.
So unless you are one of these PC liberals who throw around the term racist so much it has no defined meaning, I find it hard to believe anyone would claim people who object to a dangerous canine breed is a racist.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LoveToRow
Dog racist? Good grief, I missed that.
Sorry but if you all can call me a low life and a apologist for Pete's sake, like I have anything to apologize for, just for rescuing a Staffordsire terrier and an APBT (whom BTW in 10-12 years never hurt another human being) and pointing out opposing facts I can jokingly use the word dog racist.
If anyone has any doubt what is bred into these dogs, just read this article. This is very long as dogfighting is almost a strange secret society (even when it was only a misdemeanor it was hidden) and it required agents going undercover and becoming one to see inside. Most in depth article I have seen. It's just a sport to them and good dogs are worth thousands in stud fees from articles I have read. Purses for winners can be $100K. (Lets not forget all the guys who do it in their garages for $100 too).
I was surprised to read articles that state they don't see it as completely inhumane. Dogs weren't always fought to the death and bait animals weren't always needed to train them. They were looking for dogs who had the most "game" (will to fight) and it comes naturally to them. It's not something that can be trained. Only dogs who wanted to fight were bred. They say ALL the bull terriers have it in them, just some more than others which make champions. The APBT is the dog of choice due to heritage that can be traced back to 1800's in the US.
That's why the AKC won't register them due to the undeniable history. (I won't comment about my own personal experience with some of THOSE phony "gentleman" snobs and their own foray into creating various frankendogs, but anyway...) Oddly, the lovers of the original sport that is continued today criticize current street fighters as savages as they use bait animals and steal pit bulls from yards for fights, etc. Honor among thieves I suppose, but they have strong opinions. I hate to say it myself, but in the days before it was acceptable to see these dogs with the mainstream public, innocent people rarely got hurt.
I can't sympathize with their beliefs, but I believe them. The cognitive dissonance I see is unreal with some of the pet owners and their enablers. They are the ones endangering the public.
For instance, a dog behaviorist online warned PB's can never be left alone with other dogs. Stated his own PB was "best friends" for years with his other dog and he always thought they would be fine. He came home one day to find a bloodbath and one dead. (A story told over and over online) He said it's been crated ever since. (I wonder how many years this behaviorist told people they were fine alone with other animals until his own dog went off?) Then he goes on to say that PB's are still "great dogs" you just have to know how to manage them.
IMO the only people who knew how to "manage" them are the ones who bred them for the purpose they wanted them for. If the general public could take their rose colored glasses off, they could finally and completely face the natural dog aggressiveness that has been bred into them for centuries. Geez, the behaviorists and trainers make money trying to remove this trait so how can they be objective? It's a total con in so many ways.....This dog should not be promoted to be in homes that just desire a "pet".
(excerpt) Dogmen view their fighting pit bulls as nothing less than spectacularly trained athletes. On dogfighting Web sites, dogmen constantly swap stories about famous pit bulls. (“The best pound for pound match dog I have ever seen was “CH. HOLLY,” one dogman recently blogged. “She was the K-9 equivalent of Sugar Ray Robinson.”) They know the bloodlines of the pit bulls the way horse racing fans know the lineage of Triple Crown contenders. “Let me tell you,” Rogers said when I met him recently, “they are beautiful animals. It’s amazing to watch two of them face off in the box, studying one another, making a move, then changing strategies and making another move. These dogs think. They’re smart. And they get a real joy out of fighting. They’re born and bred to fight. I’m telling you, keeping one of these dogs from fighting is just as cruel as keeping a retriever inside the house and not letting him fetch.”
If anyone has any doubt what is bred into these dogs, just read this article. This is very long as dogfighting is almost a strange secret society (even when it was only a misdemeanor it was hidden) and it required agents going undercover and becoming one to see inside. Most in depth article I have seen. It's just a sport to them and good dogs are worth thousands in stud fees from articles I have read. Purses for winners can be $100K. (Lets not forget all the guys who do it in their garages for $100 too).
I was surprised to read articles that state they don't see it as completely inhumane. Dogs weren't always fought to the death and bait animals weren't always needed to train them. They were looking for dogs who had the most "game" (will to fight) and it comes naturally to them. It's not something that can be trained. Only dogs who wanted to fight were bred. They say ALL the bull terriers have it in them, just some more than others which make champions. The APBT is the dog of choice due to heritage that can be traced back to 1800's in the US.
That's why the AKC won't register them due to the undeniable history. (I won't comment about my own personal experience with some of THOSE phony "gentleman" snobs and their own foray into creating various frankendogs, but anyway...) Oddly, the lovers of the original sport that is continued today criticize current street fighters as savages as they use bait animals and steal pit bulls from yards for fights, etc. Honor among thieves I suppose, but they have strong opinions. I hate to say it myself, but in the days before it was acceptable to see these dogs with the mainstream public, innocent people rarely got hurt.
I can't sympathize with their beliefs, but I believe them. The cognitive dissonance I see is unreal with some of the pet owners and their enablers. They are the ones endangering the public.
For instance, a dog behaviorist online warned PB's can never be left alone with other dogs. Stated his own PB was "best friends" for years with his other dog and he always thought they would be fine. He came home one day to find a bloodbath and one dead. (A story told over and over online) He said it's been crated ever since. (I wonder how many years this behaviorist told people they were fine alone with other animals until his own dog went off?) Then he goes on to say that PB's are still "great dogs" you just have to know how to manage them.
IMO the only people who knew how to "manage" them are the ones who bred them for the purpose they wanted them for. If the general public could take their rose colored glasses off, they could finally and completely face the natural dog aggressiveness that has been bred into them for centuries. Geez, the behaviorists and trainers make money trying to remove this trait so how can they be objective? It's a total con in so many ways.....This dog should not be promoted to be in homes that just desire a "pet".
(excerpt) Dogmen view their fighting pit bulls as nothing less than spectacularly trained athletes. On dogfighting Web sites, dogmen constantly swap stories about famous pit bulls. (“The best pound for pound match dog I have ever seen was “CH. HOLLY,” one dogman recently blogged. “She was the K-9 equivalent of Sugar Ray Robinson.”) They know the bloodlines of the pit bulls the way horse racing fans know the lineage of Triple Crown contenders. “Let me tell you,” Rogers said when I met him recently, “they are beautiful animals. It’s amazing to watch two of them face off in the box, studying one another, making a move, then changing strategies and making another move. These dogs think. They’re smart. And they get a real joy out of fighting. They’re born and bred to fight. I’m telling you, keeping one of these dogs from fighting is just as cruel as keeping a retriever inside the house and not letting him fetch.”
I think they're calculating as well as intelligent. Like the one that knew to behave through three months of that dog rescue. It was smart enough to wait until it had someone more vulnerable to show its true self.
I don't think anyone is really opposed to pit bulls in general. It's just that people are opposed to them being kept where they might threaten the public. And unfortunately, the pit bull, just by being what it is, is the kind of dog that attracts criminals and the very people who can't keep them confined and away from the public.
All dogs can bite and all large dogs can kill a human being if they want to. Most large dogs, however, don't chew through fences and break leashes trying to get to a person or another dog and most large free roaming dogs don't attack with no provocation. And most large dogs aren't used for dog fighting or have a genetic background for fighting.
The problem with the pit bull is the same as I faced with people when I had my Dobe. I can't count how many times I heard how my dog would turn on me, but how could I prove he wasn't going to turn on me until he died and he hadn't turned on me in his lifetime (and even then someone told me he hadn't lived long enough to turn on me).
The pit bull as we know it today needs to be taken into capable hands and have the fighting gene eliminated. It can be done. The only thing about this is criminals and drug dealers will simply turn to other breeds of dogs that exhibit viciousness and use them.
I think they're calculating as well as intelligent. Like the one that knew to behave through three months of that dog rescue. It was smart enough to wait until it had someone more vulnerable to show its true self.
Yes, they used to never be allowed to be adopted. Too unpredictable. In the old day's (20 plus years ago) they would only be held 5 days by law for owner retrieval if they came in as strays. Recently, with adoption heading toward "No Kill" in my area only a select few were adopted and many came back anyway due to problems.
I remember looking at one over 20 years ago and the head dog warden yelled at me saying "That one is NOT going up for adoption - keep looking!" This was in the days these guys were commonly called "dog catchers". He has probably passed by this time and is probably rolling over in his grave now that even some of the worst ones are going into homes.
I carry a knife with me when I go outside for a walk in case a pit bull gets loose. I may get bloodied in the process, but I am determined to stab that dog enough times to kill it before it kills me.
I don't think anyone is really opposed to pit bulls in general. It's just that people are opposed to them being kept where they might threaten the public. And unfortunately, the pit bull, just by being what it is, is the kind of dog that attracts criminals and the very people who can't keep them confined and away from the public.
All dogs can bite and all large dogs can kill a human being if they want to. Most large dogs, however, don't chew through fences and break leashes trying to get to a person or another dog and most large free roaming dogs don't attack with no provocation. And most large dogs aren't used for dog fighting or have a genetic background for fighting.
The problem with the pit bull is the same as I faced with people when I had my Dobe. I can't count how many times I heard how my dog would turn on me, but how could I prove he wasn't going to turn on me until he died and he hadn't turned on me in his lifetime (and even then someone told me he hadn't lived long enough to turn on me).
The pit bull as we know it today needs to be taken into capable hands and have the fighting gene eliminated. It can be done. The only thing about this is criminals and drug dealers will simply turn to other breeds of dogs that exhibit viciousness and use them.
Honestly, I don't know the solution.
True about the criminal element. Found that out with my GSD in the early 90's. She was a stray and since I knew she was a purebred I was sure she was someone's dog. Ran an ad and sure enough 2 criminal types showed up. One girl from across town thought it was a relative's dog. Said he was currently in jail and she didn't want him to have it back as it was tied up. I ended up bringing her to the pound so she would legally be mine if no one claimed her after advice from ACO's.
I was even afraid of GSD's then. My vet had her for 1/2 a day and said she had the best temperament of any GSD he had seen in his 30+ yrs of practice and was great for any dog. (But that told me a lot about other GSD's obviously, that's why I am not a big fan and why I am critical of PB owners who are vocal about having a nice one without recognizing the traits they are bred for) He said the temperament he saw in her was like the older Rin Tin Tin type ones and that wasn't commonly bred for anymore. Also, considering her owner was in jail and relative didn't even want him to have her back, I have to question "It's all how you raise 'em!". It helps but genetics will win IMO. Dogs are different than people in that way.
Unfortunately, we all know unless deluded what the APBT was bred for.
True, criminals will just turn to another breed. Now with genetic engineering, (see article below) it could get pretty scary. I thought the dog in this video was a photo shop. It's a genetic mutation.
I carry a knife with me when I go outside for a walk in case a pit bull gets loose. I may get bloodied in the process, but I am determined to stab that dog enough times to kill it before it kills me.
I notice from reading news reports, with a lot of attacks on walkers they have a dog with them that PB wants to attack making it more likely then, but it pays to be safe regardless. Site below mentions different methods to remove fighting dogs, etc. Another poster here had to use a taser. There is a 100,000 volt break stick marketed to PB owners on their sites. Pretty bad, they have to go that far. Interesting comments below article. One said on the street, they are like Canine IED's. Hadn't heard that one.
I notice from reading news reports, with a lot of attacks on walkers they have a dog with them that PB wants to attack making it more likely then, but it pays to be safe regardless. Site below mentions different methods to remove fighting dogs, etc. Another poster here had to use a taser. There is a 100,000 volt break stick marketed to PB owners on their sites. Pretty bad, they have to go that far. Interesting comments below article. One said on the street, they are like Canine IED's. Hadn't heard that one.
A pit up street from where my mother was staying years ago attacked the German Shepard when she was walking him. No warning whatsoever. The pit didn't growl or anything. They were walking and next thing she knew the pit was attacking. Came out of nowhere. The GS tore the thing up though. The GS was snappy at everyone for weeks afterwards until he settled down on his own. Had trouble even taking him for a walk. Was like he thought he was going to be attacked at any moment. I liken it to PTSD. I hope they put the pit down. People were afraid of it all over the neighborhood.
A pit up street from where my mother was staying years ago attacked the German Shepard when she was walking him. No warning whatsoever. The pit didn't growl or anything. They were walking and next thing she knew the pit was attacking. Came out of nowhere. The GS tore the thing up though. The GS was snappy at everyone for weeks afterwards until he settled down on his own. Had trouble even taking him for a walk. Was like he thought he was going to be attacked at any moment. I liken it to PTSD. I hope they put the pit down. People were afraid of it all over the neighborhood.
When I used to walk my dogs, I would always have a stun gun for just such a situation. I never had to use it, but it was peace of mind knowing any dog that tried to attack us would get a nice strong zap. Most dogs will run in the other direction just from the noise it makes when activated.
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