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Old 01-10-2018, 12:46 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,742,791 times
Reputation: 9728

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Quote:
Originally Posted by cttransplant85 View Post
China's one child(now 2) policy is going to be their great downfall. China will get old before it ever gets rich. They have an aging population problem that's far worse than the US. Also communism doesn't work, our market based economy will always be superior to their centrally planned economy.
Well, Japan is in a similar position, yet they manage to cope with their aging population. Some of their innovations actually result from the demographic change, for instance robots that take care of humans.
Not sure that is a good development, just saying...

The difference with the US is simply that China is not a country of immigration. Otherwise the US would also age considerably. Most educated people in the West don't have more than 1 or 2 kids, either. Here in Portugal it is the same thing, it is as if we had had a 1-child policy as well, although we didn't.

There is a certain discrepancy between the percentage of men and women as many people only wanted a male child during the time of the 1-child policy. But that discrepancy will gradually fade away.

The market-based system is not "ours", China already had it long before the US and most European countries even existed. The communist years were just a short intermezzo in Chinese history. Economically China has not been communist for quite a while now.
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Old 01-10-2018, 01:06 PM
 
Location: San Diego
18,739 posts, read 7,606,770 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ohhwanderlust View Post
That would certainly explain why so many Chinese citizens are clamouring to purchase real estate in North America. It's a safer place to keep their money, and they have to do it now before any more rules complicate future efforts.
According to my wife's friends, that's no longer possible. China has recently made it illegal to move Chinese currency out of the country, at least in amounts greater than US$10,000 per year. For ANYTHING, including to buy real estate in other countries. That pretty much kills that market for the Chinese people. Some of them who had made down payments, taken out mortgages etc., now can't make the payments. It's a huge problem, she says.
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Old 01-10-2018, 02:41 PM
 
9,229 posts, read 9,756,796 times
Reputation: 3316
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboteer View Post
According to my wife's friends, that's no longer possible. China has recently made it illegal to move Chinese currency out of the country, at least in amounts greater than US$10,000 per year. For ANYTHING, including to buy real estate in other countries. That pretty much kills that market for the Chinese people. Some of them who had made down payments, taken out mortgages etc., now can't make the payments. It's a huge problem, she says.
Really rich people can still find a way.
My uncle wants to buy properties in Europe. He registered some company in Hong Kong, and transfers money from there.
I do not know the details, but he managed to do it.

It really hurts the upper middle class mainly.

Also college tuition is exempt, though an official invoice is required.
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Old 01-10-2018, 03:52 PM
 
Location: Madison, WI
5,301 posts, read 2,354,699 times
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Kind of frustrating when people don't learn from the past. So much unneeded suffering could be ended if people would move in the direction of individual rights and away from central planning.
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Old 01-10-2018, 06:30 PM
 
3,594 posts, read 1,793,472 times
Reputation: 4726
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
Well, Japan is in a similar position, yet they manage to cope with their aging population. Some of their innovations actually result from the demographic change, for instance robots that take care of humans.
Not sure that is a good development, just saying...

The difference with the US is simply that China is not a country of immigration. Otherwise the US would also age considerably. Most educated people in the West don't have more than 1 or 2 kids, either. Here in Portugal it is the same thing, it is as if we had had a 1-child policy as well, although we didn't.

There is a certain discrepancy between the percentage of men and women as many people only wanted a male child during the time of the 1-child policy. But that discrepancy will gradually fade away.

The market-based system is not "ours", China already had it long before the US and most European countries even existed. The communist years were just a short intermezzo in Chinese history. Economically China has not been communist for quite a while now.
No, in the interior US the fertility rate is outpacing any other westernized country. Utah and Oklahoma for example is like double the replacement rate. You're wrong. The coastal states are near replacement rates(mainly from China, Russia, Europe, Mexico) because of the 14th amendment. The US is in good shape.
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Old 01-11-2018, 09:46 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,742,791 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by cttransplant85 View Post
No, in the interior US the fertility rate is outpacing any other westernized country. Utah and Oklahoma for example is like double the replacement rate. You're wrong. The coastal states are near replacement rates(mainly from China, Russia, Europe, Mexico) because of the 14th amendment. The US is in good shape.
Of course, because Utah and Oklahoma are very religious states.
https://geographyeducationdotorg.fil...gallup-600.jpg

And fertility rates:
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...n_2013.svg.png

Religion leads to more kids, look at Afghanistan and such places. That doesn't have anything to do with civil rights and the 14th amendment. There are a lot of countries where such rights are in effect non-existing, yet they have very high birth rates, Nigeria and such places.
At the same time Europe and Canada, whose civil rights are at least as good as those in the US, have very low birth rates:

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...n_2014.svg.png

And the map roughly coincides with the religiosity map:
http://i.imgur.com/iDcSeMY.png
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Old 01-11-2018, 12:04 PM
 
Location: Trieste
957 posts, read 1,133,195 times
Reputation: 793
They exploited the West as long as they needed by showing a good face
now they no longer need us they had already begun to show their true face
in China most western media websites are simply off
and they do this abroad too

in Australia, where 30% of the college pupils are Chinese, when an history teacher try to talk about democracy or Tien An Men they threat and bully him
they pay they rule

the Western way...
good deal...
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Old 01-11-2018, 12:38 PM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,742,791 times
Reputation: 9728
You have a weird way of looking at things. The Chinese exploited the West?! In my view it was the other way round, the West went there and hired cheap Chinese labor to manufacture stuff and at the same time destroying the environment in China.

It is high time China thought of itself first.

Most Chinese students are not exactly fans of their government, they are happy to be able to live abroad, so your claim about Chinese students in Australia is not very credible.
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Old 01-11-2018, 12:43 PM
 
Location: Salisbury,NC
16,759 posts, read 8,212,614 times
Reputation: 8537
Friends of mine did a 3 week tour in China last year. They were told to watch what they said and did in certain areas by the TOUR guides. Seems the Govt. is cracking down on free speech in areas like Tiananmen Square and around Govt buildings.
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Old 01-11-2018, 12:56 PM
 
34,278 posts, read 19,368,360 times
Reputation: 17261
Quote:
Originally Posted by Roboteer View Post
According to my wife's friends, that's no longer possible. China has recently made it illegal to move Chinese currency out of the country, at least in amounts greater than US$10,000 per year. For ANYTHING, including to buy real estate in other countries. That pretty much kills that market for the Chinese people. Some of them who had made down payments, taken out mortgages etc., now can't make the payments. It's a huge problem, she says.
I traveled and worked extensively through China a decade ago, and still have many Chinese friends from my time there. Your wifes friends are stating the laws, but ignoring the reality. Its like saying "By federal law its illegal to partake in cannabis in the United states, so there is no market for it, and no one does it". The reality of course is that the majority of US citizens have done pot. Same with the 10K limit. I suspect thats part of why bitcoin has gone up so much as it was a convenient way to bypass it. There are TONS of other ways as well.

It IS a problem for some folks, but not as much of one as it appears. And the government is working hard to make it enforceable, but not with as much success as you might think.

The comments earlier about censorship etc....thats been true forever. Its just more noticeable these days I think. But it was there back then too.

There is a LOT going on though, and its hard to get as clear of a picture as you might wish. Protests are occurring more I think, but as news of them is censored people are unaware of it. And the boom bust cycle of capitalism is not something that China will deal gracefully with. Interesting times. I appreciate hearing your wifes view on it. Thanks!
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