Are These "Sexual Harrasment" Cases Of Half Of Them Are True By Mostly Females Or Are Their Bogus/False? (attorneys, independent)
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There should be no harassment at work and it should be enforced. But many woman on here are referring to stuff that happens in bars (guy asked me in bar, said no, then followed me).
A bar can't control who enters their bar.
This is true. I know that every time I'm raped at or outside of a bar, I don't report it, because it didn't happen at work.
Let's take something less straightforward. Let's say the workplace is an auto shop, and one of the techs has a calendar posted, and the calendar art is in the style of retro garage pinup. Something like this from the 1940s:
And let's say a woman tech objects to the image and finds it to be harassment. Under our current system, she's right because it is all about how she feels.
Here's a real example. A woman in my workplace (a white collar, cubicle environment) had a poster in her cube that says in large bold letters "I Have a Uterus and I Vote."
A man complains to HR that the poster creates a hostile, threatening workplace. Moreover, the woman is a manager with a dozen employees, all of whom are women. The man who complains to HR also points out not a single employee of the manager is male, and asserts gender harassment and discrimination.
The above happened.
If you were in HR, how would you respond?
I would have the woman take down the poster and come out with a policy on such things. For one, the poster has nothing to do with work and second it makes that particular man and maybe others feel uncomfortable whether or not he works for this woman. I am a woman and it makes me uncomfortable, not only because it is sexual in nature but it is also political. In a work environment there should be nothing of a sexual or political nature in your work space.
I take it you're an idealist. I used to be an idealist but now I'm a realist and am pragmatic about things.
The world sucks to be frank and you have to look out for #1. Trust nobody and make people earn your trust. I'm surprised at your age you still have an idealist vision for the world.
If I'm in a high crime neighborhood, I am paranoid about each and every person there. You never know who may be up to something no good. I question people's motives, you just never know. And I'm a guy. If I was a gal, I would be even more vigilant.
I can see we just have a different philosophy on life. I try to adapt to the way life is, it seems you have some idealistic nirvana that may never come. I'm never disappointed in life because I don't expect much of it.
Oh well, I'm outta here. I feel many have a chip on their shoulder in here and can't have reasonable discussions. Not you per se, but just in general. I guess maybe it's just the "venting" stage and not the actual "let's try to understand each other's points of views" phase. Alas.
I don't think it's being a pollyanna to expect men to stop acting like pigs. Women have been treated like objects for millenia and it shows in the way they are treated; even in seemingly innocuous situations. Some of the worst forms of harrassment have been perpetrated by "nice" guys in business suits in good neighborhood. It has NOTHING to do with demographics and everything to do with the anatomy they wear between their legs. (Meaning it's quite universal.)
I would have the woman take down the poster and come out with a policy on such things. For one, the poster has nothing to do with work and second it makes that particular man and maybe others feel uncomfortable whether or not he works for this woman. I am a woman and it makes me uncomfortable, not only because it is sexual in nature but it is also political. In a work environment there should be nothing of a sexual or political nature in your work space.
Yes, in the ideal world this would be the right approach. What do you think will happen in reality? HR department will probably just laugh at the guy in the best case scenario. If an HR person is man hating feminist, she might say something about the right of women for self expression or similar BS. I think men need to start their own "MeToo" movement and publish the names of the women involved. Then maybe the man hating feminist mafia will get some taste of what it means to be judged guilty without any proof or trial...
I don't think it's being a pollyanna to expect men to stop acting like pigs. Women have been treated like objects for millenia and it shows in the way they are treated; even in seemingly innocuous situations. Some of the worst forms of harrassment have been perpetrated by "nice" guys in business suits in good neighborhood. It has NOTHING to do with demographics and everything to do with the anatomy they wear between their legs. (Meaning it's quite universal.)
So all men are pigs who have been exploiting women for generations? What an amazingly hateful, sexist statement from a member of US feminist mafia. I wonder what would happen if men posted something similar about women...
So all men are pigs who have been exploiting women for generations? What an amazingly hateful, sexist statement from a member of US feminist mafia. I wonder what would happen if men posted something similar about women...
First off, sorry you've felt threatened. I'm sure it's not a great feeling. I want to say this because I think you feel I don't believe you. I do, however, I'm not sure if you've taken preventative steps after these things have happened to not get in a similar situation. You see, I've taken self defense course, so let me explain. We were talking in that class the other day about an instance in New Orleans where the victim was letting a friend into her house and noticed a car across the street with a "red flag" fellow, i.e. someone that she didn't think should be there. She visited her friend and "forgot" to lock the door when the friend left. She was victimized. Now do you think she was wise or should she have locked the door when she saw something suspect?
Now onto my questions...
Where did this happen? At a club? Read my posts about bars/clubs.
Sometimes I think a lot of people (both women and men) take extra risk that they shouldn't. I have good "street smarts" so I never get into situations. If there is a shady character, I immediately cross to the other side of the street, etc...
I've found when you stop taking inordinate risks and start associating with groups of people that share your interests there rarely are issues. And if the people you associate with have undesirable behaviors, maybe it's time to start associating with a new set of people.
These are hard lessons to learn I know but you're 50 so it's time to start maturing and wising up. It's entirely possible to surround yourself with people where this would never occur. As they say in the class, you can always play the victim or you can be the proactive person that never is the victim.
Ahhh yes....if women would just....stay at home out of harm's way! ...and don't go to work - I mean, work isn't usually at a bar but harassment happens there, and on public transportation...too many places to mention. Why do you say "forgot" - are you implying she didn't really and that she wanted whatever that happened? Whenever I hear that I automatically think that it wouldn't have happened if the GUY hadn't DONE IT. I don't think it was the woman's fault in not preventing it. So be quiet with your one little example that does nothing to cover the gamut of situations discussed.
And try not to be so smug - you might get mugged or raped yourself when you least expect it...
I would have the woman take down the poster and come out with a policy on such things. For one, the poster has nothing to do with work and second it makes that particular man and maybe others feel uncomfortable whether or not he works for this woman. I am a woman and it makes me uncomfortable, not only because it is sexual in nature but it is also political. In a work environment there should be nothing of a sexual or political nature in your work space.
A uterus isn't sexual...a vagina is...a p*ssy is...a uterus is for reproduction. It didn't say she voted Republican or Democratic...just VOTE. Sorry, your complaint fails on two counts - whether you're a woman or not.
Let's take the pics of your family out of your cube - not work related and definitely SEXUAL!
The stats say 2-10% are false. The stats also say there are over 300,000 cases a year. So, that's approximately 2,000 - 30,000 false allegations. That spread also shows the data to be unreliable. The truth is we don't actually know how rare false allegations are when a) there are inconsistencies in how sexual assault is defined, b) there unsubstantiated/unfounded reports are being classified as false and vice-versa, c) there are biases among those in law enforcement and social work, d) the burden of proof on college campuses is alarmingly low, below the standard for law enforcement and e) the public is reckless about furthering false/incomplete information and how they classify sexual assault/rape, which leads people to believe they were raped when they weren't. It's safe to say that many cases of actual rape don't see a courtroom when they should. And some cases should never see the light of day.
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