School shooting Fla. MERGED (legal, health care, terrorist, money)
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well then, how come several people reported that he wasn't only mentally ill...
I didn't say he wasn't mentally ill, just that mental illness isn't the underlying cause of why he acted out. Uncontrolled anger was
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Originally Posted by cremebrulee
but he threatened to do something, they feared he was violent, his grandmother feared him, the school had expelled him?
This is all true, but not indicative of a mental illness. Mass shooters almost always have a few traits in common. A history of violence, perhaps domestic, and anger or rage issues.
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Originally Posted by cremebrulee
You kill people, your mentally ill....that thought doesn't even enter the minds of those who are grounded and mentally sane....
Neither of those statements are true. First, mental health defense usually doesn't work out too well. It surprises me that a lot of people make the statement that did when the rime happens, but when the trial is going on, they get mad as hell if the defense uses that as a defense.
Most mentally ill people are a threat to themselves more than anyone. They are more apt to be the victim of a violent crime, not the perpetrator. One argument I saw right after the school shooting was made by folks who rightly pointed out that most gun deaths are suicides, not homicides. This is because depressed people kill themselves. Oddly the gun right advocates used this as a reason not to do more background checks to keep guns away from the mentally ill
Full disclosure. As a mentally ill man, I don't think the mentally ill should own guns. Not because they'll kill someone else, but because they'll kill themselves.
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Originally Posted by cremebrulee
there are also many different levels of mental illness...some very mild, some a little more, which can be controlled with meds...however, there are those that cross the line and want to hurt, maul, rape or torture others, including murder...that is an unstable mind, period..
That is true. I imagine we would argue about statistics though
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Originally Posted by cremebrulee
there is also something else that everyone seems to be overlooking, what kind of drugs was Cruz on? Lets explore that...there are certain drugs that do not mix well with certain people's chemistry, and makes them do horrible things.
I agree it needs to be explored.
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Originally Posted by cremebrulee
Next, maybe, just maybe, if the kids in school wouldn't have teased him for being autistic, so much, maybe he would have never done this....
He may have got bullied. I don't know. Maybe that's where his extreme anger took hold. Being bullied is not a sign of mental illness.
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Originally Posted by cremebrulee
My cousin's grand son is autistic, and note, there are also different levels of autistic, there is never one size fits all, but the kids were so mean to him in school, he wanted to kill himself....???????
Also true about the different levels of autism. I feel if I had been a child of the 2000s, I may have been diagnosed with Aspergers and ADD. As a child of the 80s, I was just a class clown and a kid who liked trains. And I don't mean to make light of your cousin's son, but you said he wanted to kill himself. Not that he wanted to kill the kids being mean to him. I hope he is getting help for his mental illness.
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Originally Posted by cremebrulee
People need to stop blaming the gun, and start using some common sense. If your mind's in good health, you wouldn't pick up a gun to kill someone....you wouldn't torture animals, or rape kids....there are way too many really sick people walking around society that shouldn't be.
Actually more people need to realize that the means of how one kills needs to be addressed. an 18 year old kid, whether it be this creep in Florida or my well-behaved son, does not need access to an AR-15 or similar gun without being in the military. I'm not calling for banning guns although we should take a look at banning these types of weapons altogther. I'm also not for confiscating any guns owned by people who got them legally until they do something to lose the right to a gun, for example, a domestic abuse charge.
The more and more we find out about this the more it really looks like it was staged and planned. Way too many failures across the board for this to be real. Way too many.
I hadn't heard it but it appears that it happened and it appears that unless they had someone working besides the Deputy he was alerted to this as well:
"During his English class on Wednesday afternoon, Chris McKenna, 15, left to take a bathroom break.
The restrooms were closed on the first floor, said Chris, a freshman, so he headed to the second floor. He found the shooting suspect, Nikolas Cruz, 19, in a stairwell between the first and second floors in the freshman building.
Sitting on the stairs, Mr. Cruz was loading a semiautomatic AR-15 rifle, Chris said.
Mr. Cruz appeared “shocked” when he opened the door to the stairwell, Chris said. “I don’t think he expected me to see him at all,” he said, as Mr. Cruz was loading the gun.
“He told me, ‘Better get out of here, things are about to get messy,’” Chris said.
Chris, who said he did not know Mr. Cruz, left the stairwell, heading outside, where he ran into Aaron Feis, an assistant football coach and security monitor, at a school gate. After Chris told Mr. Feis what he had seen, Mr. Feis drove him in a golf cart to a baseball field about 500 feet away. Mr. Feis left him there to return to the school." https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/16/u...-parkland.html
Did you see a "death threat"? I didn't.
I can't imagine why anyone would threaten these two brave CNN rock stars.
Fox, like the other major Cable News Networks, gave Hogg plenty of airtime. Likely he was one of the few survivors capable of talking without dissolving into tears, during the evacuation.
Trump Admin hosted a controlled " Listening Session" and cherry- picked participants. This is the event where Trump carried notes including instructions to listen. Hogg was not among them. One student survivor was in attendance who shared his experience and position. One parent who had recently buried his daughter remarked how he observed that all visitors to the Dept of Edu building were escorted by armed security in the elevator.
CNN hosted a townhall this week attended by thousands of students and parents of this school. Don't know if Hogg attended. He was not one of the speakers. No shortage of articulate and passionate students at this school of 3300 students.
POTUS, Florida Governor and state legislators declined to attend in person or by video.
Both Senators and House Rep attended.
NRA attended.
No matter what anyone thinks about Rubio and NRA, they had the guts to show and respond.
There is no upside to critizing survivors of mass shootings or Gold Star Families, regardless of viewpoint being expressed. Doing so says more about the critics than the individuals they target.
Not what I said and not what I believe. It's rather silly to even think we could ban all guns.
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Originally Posted by workingclasshero
so why don't you be honest... you like most of the fascists liberals wants to ban ALL GUNS
how very Nazi of you... hitler did the same
First, using the Nazi label is very lazy and pretty stupid when anyone does it, especially just because the other person doesn't agree with your political stance. I've never called anyone a Nazi. Really, I should put you on ignore for what you said.
I don't believe in banning all guns and I don't believe in confiscating any guns from anyone until that person makes it clear he doesn't need a gun.
My immediate opinion is to make it illegal for anyone under 21 to own a gun. If I understand what he thinks today -- it might be different tomorrow -- that means I at least agree in part with President Trump on that.
Will banning AR-15 and similar weapons from civilians (not the police or military) stop mass shootings? Nope. Not sure anything can, unfortunately. Does it mean we give up entirely? Nope.
I believe I will ignore you. You gave up the right to me engaging in a conversation with me when you called me a Nazi.
The more and more we find out about this the more it really looks like it was staged and planned. Way too many failures across the board for this to be real. Way too many.
Claiming that this was staged while families are grieving the loss of their children is reprehensible and of the lowest order. Disgusting.
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