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It isn't "outsiders" who are advocating for no restrictions on gun ownership
It isn't "outsiders" who make irrational speeches warning about the threat from "liberals" La Pierre's speech at CPAC basically advocates for gun owners to start the next civil war over the threat of having reasonable restrictions on who can buy a gun...
The NRA has no interest in "rational gun ownership" like it used to advocate
It doesn't even represent the majority of its own members---
It reflects what has happened within the more traditional GOP itself--where the alt-right fringe elements have taken control of leadership and drive the agenda...
The question is how can people belong to an organization that DOESN'T represent their own beliefs???
Would someone who believes it is ok to abuse animals belong to the SPCA?
Would a teenager belong to the AARP (even if they allowed it)???
Would you belong to a local PTA if you didn't really want to support education in your neighborhood?
So it will be intersting to see if the NRA members actually do something to let the NRA leadership know they are unhappy---
Maybe not renewing their membership---maybe voting out current leadership---but you have to have another set of candidates to offer a viable slate of new leadership and I haven't seen anyone IN NRA to come out and challenge La Pierre...
We already have 22,000 gun laws on the books. We already have "reasonable restrictions". The NRA is not going to advocate for bans on semi-auto firearms. That isn't in its members best interest. It will just restrict the law abiding, not the criminal, nor criminally insane.
For the most part the NRA does a good job. The training, and safety programs are excellent. For the SMALL amount of money they have compared to the Unions, and Soros backed orgs, they do a good job.
The NRA is small potatoes. They don't compare to those on this list, and don't come near cracking the top fifty, and probably not near the top 100.
Grenade launcher (more precisely, a muzzle device that enables launching or firing rifle grenades, though this applies only to muzzle mounted grenade launchers and not those mounted externally).
A second handgrip or a protruding grip that can be held by the non-trigger hand
A fixed capacity in excess of 7 rounds
The ability to accept a detachable magazine
"Large capacity feeding device" is any belt, drum, strip, magazine, or similar instrument used to feed ammunition into a firearm that has a capability of holding more than ten rounds.[26]"
My advice to the NRA and gun enthusiasts is to find a workable solution fast otherwise these shootings will lead to a crisis that will lead to a ban of guns. Understand? Want guns=take responsibility for solving gun problems.
the problem with putting people that are on a no fly list, on a no gun buy list is that you are trying to equate a privilege with a right. flying is a privilege, and thus one can be put on a no fly list just because, but to take that no fly list and use it as a no buy list, that is unconstitutional as there is no due process. so yes i have a huge problem with a no gun buy list without due process.
convict someone of a felony, get someone adjudicated as mentally defective, and then put them on a no buy list, fine. as long as everything is above board and open. there also needs to be a clear path to get yourself removed from a no buy list if you can prove that you dont belong on said list. secret lists that are nearly impossible to get off of is wrong. there has to be proper recourse.
actually i think the NRA CAN help here. the NRA has pushed for better background checks, more gun safety, and more education, in addition to protecting our second amendment rights.
how hard was it to get your brother off the no fly list? some people get on there, and find it nearly impossible to get off the list. and that is a problem imo.
if you were to actually stop listening to the gun grabbers that continually demonize the NRA, and make up things about what the NRA is all about, and listen to what the NRA themselves actually say about these issues, you would find that they too dont want the mentally ill to get their hand on guns.
the NRA is all about protecting our second amendment rights, and they are all about proper due process as well. take this last kid for instance, the cops went to his house 39 times due to issues, did they have enough to do anything about him? what would the ACLU for instance say if the cops had hauled him up before a judge with little evidence? what would a lawyer, or even the family say if they did that?
the problem is as always, not the gun, but the rights of the individual. you have to go through proper due process to suspend a persons rights, and to do that you have to have evidence. without at least some evidence, you cant have a judge order someone into therapy. so who do you blame then when he gets a hold of a gun and shoots up a school? if you are an ignorant gun grabber, you blame the NRA, instead of the cops who should have been investigating this kid, or the parents who should have committed this kid when he was younger. we need to put the blame where it belongs, and not demonize an organization that has nothing to do with the kid.
this was a very good thought out reply that contributed much to the conversation and let me know your side of it. thank you.
my rebuttal is that we wouldnt be removing the right from that person, just flagging them for additional background and/or mental health check. i see it as a fair compromise to allow law abiding citizens who want to hunt or protect themselves to get a gun without issue.
It is interesting seeing all these debates, many I have been a part of. What the left doesn't seem to grasp is the big picture. Firearms homicides peaked in 1993, with 7 deaths per 100k. As the years progressed that number dropped. A low was 2010 which was 3.6 deaths per 100k. Sadly that number is starting to rise and we are up to 4.5 per 100k as of 2016.
Over all though, our rate has dropped, while the amount of firearms owners has been steadily increasing. I know someone is going to try and refute that but it just isn't true. And anyone that is an owner and has seen the gun shops, and the NRA CPL training classes knows this.
So , with no bans to really speak of , except for places like CA and NY we have seen a drop in violence. We also see that bans and or higher restrictions have mixed results. The firearms violence in NY has dropped but yet we still a high number in CA.
So, to me , it looks like what we've been doing has been working the past 25 years. Then this spike of mass shootings starts happening. There have been really no changes in the firearms laws since 2010 , either further restricting or less restrictions, yet the up tick of violence. Obviously it isn't the laws and availability that has caused this, there is something deeper that is.
So now we see the left pushing for bans, and or restrictions which in the big picture have really not proven themselves to be effective. To me, why is the majority of US citizens listening to people that have no experience in firearms and chastising those that do, and groups that have actually been beneficial in implementing things like the NICS background check system , and many safety programs ? Why does the majority want to put their faith in things that we can't prove work instead of things that have proven themselves to work ? It just seems completely bass ackwards thinking to me.
My advice to the NRA and gun enthusiasts is to find a workable solution fast otherwise these shootings will lead to a crisis that will lead to a ban of guns. Understand? Want guns=take responsibility for solving gun problems.
Why do NRA and gun enthusiasts need to find a workable solution? Everyone should work together to find a solution. Finger pointing does not help at this moment.
The problem starts with the term itself. The “assault weapons” for sale in the U.S. now aren't really weapons of war. Many people mistake these firearms for machine guns capable of shooting multiple rounds of ammunition with a single pull of the trigger.
Many people think AR-15 AR means assault rifle. They don't even bother to understand the term
AR stands for ArmaLite rifle.
If you (the general term) want to be gun grabbers, you'd better find a good argument why banning guns can be a good solution.
The ONLY argument I heard is "Oh, look at UK, Japan, and Israel..." They have completely different system and culture. Comparing apples to oranges is just
Why do NRA and gun enthusiasts need to find a workable solution? Everyone should work together to find a solution. Finger pointing does not help at this moment.
The problem starts with the term itself. The “assault weapons” for sale in the U.S. now aren't really weapons of war. Many people mistake these firearms for machine guns capable of shooting multiple rounds of ammunition with a single pull of the trigger.
Many people think AR-15 AR means assault rifle. They don't even bother to understand the term
AR stands for ArmaLite rifle.
If you (the general term) want to be gun grabbers, you'd better find a good arguments why banning guns can be a good solution.
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Why do NRA and gun enthusiasts need to find a workable solution? Because it is those people who want to keep their guns. Want to keep your guns? Find a solution that works or it will be done for you and you may not like that solution.
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Why do NRA and gun enthusiasts need to find a workable solution? Because it is those people who want to keep their guns. Want to keep your guns? Find a solution that works or it will be done for you and you may not like that solution.
Nope, each person is responsible for his or her action ONLY.
Will you ban sex just because there are rapists around?
Gun free zone just means "hey lookie lookie, good people have no guns here. Come and ambush them"
am·bush
1.
a surprise attack by people lying in wait in a concealed position.
Do you know how many unregistered guns are out there? Banning gun in America is unrealistic. Come on now.
Bad people are already armed.
Last edited by lilyflower3191981; 02-26-2018 at 07:29 AM..
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