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Old 03-06-2018, 04:23 AM
 
Location: Great Britain
27,139 posts, read 13,429,141 times
Reputation: 19432

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Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Selling in the United States is a privilege and all the leverage he needs.
I suggest Americans put down George Orwell's 1984 and start reading famous Scottish philosopher and economist Adam Smiths work 'The Wealth of Nations', which encases the very freedoms in areas such as trade that the US was founded on.

Indeed if a nation can supply you with raw materials or a commodity at a cheaper rate take advantage of it and use it to manufacture your own goods thereby making them cheaper in terms of world markets and increasing sales overseas.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Adam Smith

“If a foreign country can supply us with a commodity cheaper than we ourselves can make it, better buy it of them with some part of the produce of our own industry employed in a way in which we have some advantage.”—Adam Smith

Quote:

James Madison, in a speech given in Congress on 2 February 1791, cited The Wealth of Nations in opposing a national bank: "The principal disadvantages consisted in, 1st. banishing the precious metals, by substituting another medium to perform their office: This effect was inevitable. It was admitted by the most enlightened patrons of banks, particularly by Smith on the Wealth of Nations".

Thomas Jefferson, writing to John Norvell on 14 June 1807, claimed that on "the subjects of money & commerce, Smith's Wealth of Nations is the best book to be read, unless Say's Political Economy can be had, which treats the same subject on the same principles, but in a shorter compass & more lucid manner"

The Wealth of Nations - Wikipedia

Donald Trump's mercantilist trade policy was debunked by Adam Smith more than 200 years ago - Quartz

The effect of the Trump tariffs — Adam Smith Institute

Trump wrongly says U.S. has made others rich while our wealth has 'dissipated' - Poltifact

Last edited by Brave New World; 03-06-2018 at 04:48 AM..

 
Old 03-06-2018, 05:56 AM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,647 posts, read 26,363,905 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by desertdetroiter View Post
Banning bauxite exports will help a little. We don’t mine much of it here, but what we do mine should be banned from exportation.

We also export scrap aluminum to countries that sell it back to us in one form or another.

https://www.ustradenumbers.com/commo...ste-and-scrap/
 
Old 03-06-2018, 06:28 AM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,647 posts, read 26,363,905 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lieneke View Post
Canada will do what it is already doing with oil - laying pipe that bypasses the USA to export the product.

Holding the upper hand in any negotiation requires the willingness to walk away from the deal.

Still the largest economy in the world, economically diverse and rich in natural resources, the US is uniquely positioned to walk away form just about any deal.

The decision to walk away becomes even easier when part of the deal is creating a Chinese communist military monster that could potentially cost the world a generation of young men.
 
Old 03-06-2018, 06:40 AM
 
45,676 posts, read 23,994,029 times
Reputation: 15559
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Holding the upper hand in any negotiation requires the willingness to walk away from the deal.

Still the largest economy in the world, economically diverse and rich in natural resources, the US is uniquely positioned to walk away form just about any deal.

The decision to walk away becomes even easier when part of the deal is creating a Chinese communist military monster that could potentially cost the world a generation of young men.
USA only provides 39 percent of its own oil.

That means it is looking to the rest of the world for the other 61%
 
Old 03-06-2018, 07:03 AM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,647 posts, read 26,363,905 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by moneill View Post
USA only provides 39 percent of its own oil.

That means it is looking to the rest of the world for the other 61%


US demand for crude oil has been declining since 2005.


https://www.indexmundi.com/energy/?c...ph=consumption



The US is projected to be a net oil exporter in just four years.


https://www.wsj.com/articles/why-u-s...rld-1518539887
 
Old 03-06-2018, 07:10 AM
 
Location: Central Mexico and Central Florida
7,150 posts, read 4,900,681 times
Reputation: 10444
Looks like Ryan send Kevin Brady to Mexico on behalf of keeping NAFTA. Bottom line: trump will not 'tear up NAFTA' as he promised in the campaign. No tariffs against Canada or Mexico, as he recently promised. Promises, promises!!

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/06/rep-...y-in-pact.html
Quote:
House Ways and Means Committee Chairman Kevin Brady, just back from NAFTA talks in Mexico, said Tuesday he believes the United States will not scrap the trade agreement.
Quote:
"The stakes are so high here," said Brady, who has been involved in a dozen free trade negotiations "in one way or another." He led a bipartisan delegation to Mexico to meet with NAFTA negotiators during the past two days.
 
Old 03-06-2018, 08:15 AM
 
7,489 posts, read 4,949,345 times
Reputation: 8031
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brave New World View Post
I suggest Americans put down George Orwell's 1984 and start reading famous Scottish philosopher and economist Adam Smiths work 'The Wealth of Nations', which encases the very freedoms in areas such as trade that the US was founded on.

Indeed if a nation can supply you with raw materials or a commodity at a cheaper rate take advantage of it and use it to manufacture your own goods thereby making them cheaper in terms of world markets and increasing sales overseas.


Donald Trump's mercantilist trade policy was debunked by Adam Smith more than 200 years ago - Quartz

The effect of the Trump tariffs — Adam Smith Institute

Trump wrongly says U.S. has made others rich while our wealth has 'dissipated' - Poltifact
Thank you for the links! It's so nice to see the consequences of a tariff in simple terms that should be understood by even the most uneducated: your washing machines will cost a lot more, you will lose jobs, and there will be job loss in other counties.

To prevent a washing machine tariff, Trump could ban all foreign made products. This leans towards communist Russia and Hitler's Germany. Throw in other remarks from Trump about president for life, and we see a dictatorship where the oppressed praise the oppressor.
 
Old 03-06-2018, 08:16 AM
 
8,494 posts, read 3,335,020 times
Reputation: 6991
Quote:
Originally Posted by dothetwist View Post
Looks like Ryan send Kevin Brady to Mexico on behalf of keeping NAFTA. Bottom line: trump will not 'tear up NAFTA' as he promised in the campaign. No tariffs against Canada or Mexico, as he recently promised. Promises, promises!!

https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/06/rep-...y-in-pact.html
Interesting ... you've got the official USTR statement from Lighthizer (Trump's negotiator) yesterday, saying
Quote:
In spite of this hard work, we have not made the progress that many had hoped in this round. ... Now our time is running very short. On July 1, as everyone here knows, Mexico will choose a new president. That campaign as I understand it begins in earnest just next month. But Mexico is not the only NAFTA country in the midst of elections. Both Ontario and Quebec have elections scheduled later this year. Finally, the United States has mid-term elections coming up in November. All of this complicates our work. I fear that the longer we proceed, the more political headwinds we will feel.
https://ustr.gov/about-us/policy-off...ert-lighthizer

Trump also weighs in by tweet yesterday with his bludgeon-them-over-the-heads tactic: We have large trade deficits with Mexico and Canada. NAFTA, which is under renegotiation right now, has been a bad deal for U.S.A. Massive relocation of companies & jobs. Tariffs on Steel and Aluminum will only come off if new & fair NAFTA agreement is signed. Also, Canada must....treat our farmers much better. Highly restrictive. Mexico must do much more on stopping drugs from pouring into the U.S. They have not done what needs to be done. Millions of people addicted and dying.

Then today, Brady (and Ryan) step up to the plate with another very public Trump end-run "predicting" the US will stay in NAFTA. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/06/rep-...y-in-pact.html

Guess Ryan doesn't think much of Trump's "negotiating style."

As for the upcoming elections ... In Trump's last negotiating fiasco with Mexico a couple of weeks ago, Nieto TRIED to explain the reality of HIS elections to Trump and so, no, he could not just stand there in public next to Trump mute while Trump brought up Mexico paying for the wall. (That the wall not be raised had been the ground rules agreed to by both staffs then Trump went solo with the end result the visit was cancelled.)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.12aaff6d2982

I'm not sure how pissing off Canadian citizens with threats of tariffs "said" to protect US national security will help Trump gain leverage over Trudeau since he's also facing elections. Maybe the Canadians aren't paying any attention.

Last edited by EveryLady; 03-06-2018 at 08:26 AM..
 
Old 03-06-2018, 08:38 AM
 
8,494 posts, read 3,335,020 times
Reputation: 6991
Quote:
Originally Posted by momonkey View Post
Holding the upper hand in any negotiation requires the willingness to walk away from the deal.

Still the largest economy in the world, economically diverse and rich in natural resources, the US is uniquely positioned to walk away form just about any deal.

The decision to walk away becomes even easier when part of the deal is creating a Chinese communist military monster that could potentially cost the world a generation of young men.
The US has no trade "deal" to renegotiate with China, unless you mean that both countries fall under the global trade umbrella or that there are various business and investment agreements - one set symbolically signed by Trump last fall. And then some general trade initiatives.
 
Old 03-06-2018, 08:40 AM
 
7,489 posts, read 4,949,345 times
Reputation: 8031
Quote:
Originally Posted by EveryLady View Post
Interesting ... you've got the official USTR statement from Lighthizer (Trump's negotiator) yesterday, saying

https://ustr.gov/about-us/policy-off...ert-lighthizer

Trump also weighs in by tweet yesterday with his bludgeon-them-over-the-heads tactic: We have large trade deficits with Mexico and Canada. NAFTA, which is under renegotiation right now, has been a bad deal for U.S.A. Massive relocation of companies & jobs. Tariffs on Steel and Aluminum will only come off if new & fair NAFTA agreement is signed. Also, Canada must....treat our farmers much better. Highly restrictive. Mexico must do much more on stopping drugs from pouring into the U.S. They have not done what needs to be done. Millions of people addicted and dying.

Then today, Brady (and Ryan) step up to the plate with another very public Trump end-run "predicting" the US will stay in NAFTA. https://www.cnbc.com/2018/03/06/rep-...y-in-pact.html

Guess Ryan doesn't think much of Trump's "negotiating style."

As for the upcoming elections ... In Trump's last negotiating fiasco with Mexico a couple of weeks ago, Nieto TRIED to explain the reality of HIS elections to Trump and so, no, he could not just stand there in public next to Trump mute while Trump brought up Mexico paying for the wall. (That the wall not be raised had been the ground rules agreed to by both staffs then Trump went solo with the end result the visit was cancelled.)
https://www.washingtonpost.com/polit...=.12aaff6d2982

I'm not sure how pissing off Canadian citizens with threats of tariffs "said" to protect US national security will help Trump gain leverage over Trudeau since he's also facing elections. Maybe the Canadians aren't paying any attention.
Canadians are paying attention.

Trump is lying about trade deficits, and, given that many people in the USA rely on Trump for factual information, they will never fully understand why Trump's actions are so foolish. Trump repeats his lies until people doubt themselves.

" ... numbers provided by Statistics Canada, and the Office of the United States Trade Representative – both say the U.S. has a trade surplus with Canada, to the amount of US$12 billion."

https://globalnews.ca/news/3898843/t...-donald-trump/
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