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-Disarm the cops.
-Disarm the entire government.
-Abolish and disarm the military.
Only private citizens should be allowed to own guns.
That would be a terrible idea. It would more likely go like this.
Disarm the private citizens
Disarm the cops
Disarm most of the government.
Abolish and disarm most of the military.
Essentially we are Japan.
MY views on lives saved is that often when you say a life was saved with a gun the criminal that was shot isn't included in the death, and we often don't know if the criminal even intended to shoot anyone, luckily most armed criminals never fire a shot when robbing a place. Sure the criminal is a dirty and evil person/animal. But if we are talking about lives being saved killing a criminal isn't saving a life. Pointing a gun at a criminal who runs away isn't saving a life. Shooting an unarmed criminal isn't saving a life if he wasn't trying to actively kill you. About the only instance you could say is saving a life is maiming and not killing a criminal with a gun after he has already tried to murder you which is extremely rare.
The pendulum also swings the other way. If someone stops a mass shooter... How many lives did she/he save? Did he/she kill one but saves 3,000+ students and staff? That's ridiculous but to say he saved zero lives is also ridiculous. But Republicans must include that in their number of lives saved by gun owners, I wonder how gun-loving people would quantify lives saved, would it be closer to the 3,000 people in the building or closer to the zero.
My point is when you can't even possibly quantify the number of lives saved, to the point anytime a homeowner shoots a criminal it is saving a life even if it was someone simply trespassing to get a ball to a full six men committing a violent armed home invasion that has lead to death of homeowners previously but was stopped. Not to mention that these people don't consider criminals (regardless of how violent they are) as human, so they don't count the criminal lives lost as lost lives.
When a good guy and a bad guy face-off with weapons although the criminal can run away if they don't someone is losing their life.
Yet the gun lobby has prevented the CDC from studying gun violence, been ongoing for decades.
They don't want a discussion on gun violence, just a few anecdotes to make their case.
That would be a terrible idea. It would more likely go like this.
Disarm the private citizens
Disarm the cops
Disarm most of the government.
Abolish and disarm most of the military.
Essentially we are Japan.
MY views on lives saved is that often when you say a life was saved with a gun the criminal that was shot isn't included in the death, and we often don't know if the criminal even intended to shoot anyone, luckily most armed criminals never fire a shot when robbing a place. Sure the criminal is a dirty and evil person/animal. But if we are talking about lives being saved killing a criminal isn't saving a life. Pointing a gun at a criminal who runs away isn't saving a life. Shooting an unarmed criminal isn't saving a life if he wasn't trying to actively kill you. About the only instance you could say is saving a life is maiming and not killing a criminal with a gun after he has already tried to murder you which is extremely rare.
The pendulum also swings the other way. If someone stops a mass shooter... How many lives did she/he save? Did he/she kill one but saves 3,000+ students and staff? That's ridiculous but to say he saved zero lives is also ridiculous. But Republicans must include that in their number of lives saved by gun owners, I wonder how gun-loving people would quantify lives saved, would it be closer to the 3,000 people in the building or closer to the zero.
My point is when you can't even possibly quantify the number of lives saved, to the point anytime a homeowner shoots a criminal it is saving a life even if it was someone simply trespassing to get a ball to a full six men committing a violent armed home invasion that has lead to death of homeowners previously but was stopped. Not to mention that these people don't consider criminals (regardless of how violent they are) as human, so they don't count the criminal lives lost as lost lives.
When a good guy and a bad guy face-off with weapons although the criminal can run away if they don't someone is losing their life.
Why in the world would you want to disarm private citizens while allowing the State, and its goons, to stay strapped? And why do you say "most" of the government and military? Why not all? Are they somehow better and/or more important than us? Are their lives worth more than ours?
From your username, I assume you are a black man. Why in the world would you not want to disarm cops until after we are? They're the ones who are shooting y'all down by the hundreds.
If it's simply used to form social/collectivist policy via State edict I'm pretty uninterested in how many people used a gun in a specific way over a specific timeframe.
" The value of firearms in the hands of law-abiding citizens should be measured in terms of lives saved or crimes prevented, not criminals killed. "
But the 'balance' between lives saved and lives lost is SO lopsided that there is no point!! The US gun laws = the highest (by quite some distance) amount of gun deaths in the whole of the first world. You simply cannot argue against the stats, you have more chance of arguing that fighting fire with petrol is a good idea!
But the 'balance' between lives saved and lives lost is SO lopsided that there is no point!! The US gun laws = the highest (by quite some distance) amount of gun deaths in the whole of the first world. You simply cannot argue against the stats, you have more chance of arguing that fighting fire with petrol is a good idea!
Only if you consider actual legal self defense shootings. The vast majority of self defense use of firearms will not lead to shooting, but just things like potential robbers enter a 7-11 at 10:30pm, the teller reaches down to the shotgun behind the counter because he notices something off, it's noticed by the prospective robbers (even though the gun isn't visible or even touched) and they leave. Without the shotgun, the store would be robbed, and the teller possibly killed, even if there was no shotgun behind the counter the chance there may be a shotgun there may make a robber move on, should they see the teller seem to reach down to get something with his attention focused on them.
Much like sex crimes there's a huge swathe of self defense firearm use that isn't tracked because the person scared off, or the person scaring off don't report it.
National Institute of Justice (already posted in the thread, sponsored by the CDC) found a low of 500,000 defensive gun uses annually, and a high of 3,000,000. Even if that wasn't all homicide preventing, at 1% preventing homicide it's between 5,000 and 30,000 homicides prevented annually (on top of the actual 11,000 recorded homicides).
Similarly we should also determine how many homicides would still occur should the weapon used (a gun) not be legally available. So all illegal possessions, almost all drug and organized crime homicides, etc. To figure out what net impact there may be in a disarmed US. It's not as simple as banning and disarming civilians will drop 11,000 recorded homicides to zero.
Once we know how many people are saved by guns as are lost to guns (and only guns) an informed decision can be made.
Yet the gun lobby has prevented the CDC from studying gun violence, been ongoing for decades.
They don't want a discussion on gun violence, just a few anecdotes to make their case.
Several such studies have been done, including studies made during the Clinton and Obama administrations. For some reason, they are getting very little media attention.
A gun is a woman’s best line of defense against rape. Yet the left wants to deny women the means to defend themselves against rapists.
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