Welcome to City-Data.com Forum!
U.S. CitiesCity-Data Forum Index
Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
 [Register]
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
View detailed profile (Advanced) or search
site with Google Custom Search

Search Forums  (Advanced)
Reply Start New Thread
 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:28 PM
 
Location: Manchester NH
15,507 posts, read 6,432,565 times
Reputation: 4831

Advertisements

Quote:
Originally Posted by rebeldor View Post
No, individuals will control themselves. People would be free to join up other people or remain alone.
And if all the means of production are taken by major companies (which will happen) the individual worker will have to work FOR said company or else be deprived and the needed resources.

That is corporate slavery.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message

 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:33 PM
 
Location: Manchester NH
15,507 posts, read 6,432,565 times
Reputation: 4831
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebeldor View Post
1. There will be private, voluntary courts. Celtic Ireland had voluntary courts known as a "tuath," which was a body of people voluntarily united for socially beneficial purposes. There were professional jurists who were consulted to resolve disputes for advice and to act as arbitrators between suitors. They remained at all times private, not public officials, and depended upon their knowledge of the law and their integrity. There was no legislature, no bailiffs, and no police.

2. Corporations are a State creation. So are monopolies. They don't exist in Ancapistan.

3. Wider society doesn't matter; only the individual matters. Force and non-aggression are the base principles of anarcho-capitalism and humans would regulate themselves.

4. Rainwater could be transported in whichever way its owner sees fit. There would certainly be others with access to drinking water.
1.Yes, voluntary, and they work with disputes. If someone doesn’t want to participate there is no way to force them, then lawlessness reigns. History proves lawless societies never work

2. No, just because they won’t be granted by the state does not mean they won’t be obtained

3. This is psychologically false. If wider society is not cared for the (moral) environment will collapse and even the successful individual will turn to cruelty or violence (people are a product of their environment).

4. It is not that simple, it needs to be filtered, and maintained at all hours. One person can’t do that and if you privatize this service it will be done for profit and the customer will be abused.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:37 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
8,750 posts, read 3,119,604 times
Reputation: 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by arctichomesteader View Post
Freedom is the right to be left alone when you are not harming another person.
The NAP. It's life.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:42 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
8,750 posts, read 3,119,604 times
Reputation: 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
You’re dealing with simple phrasing, no matter what if there is nothing to stop them, a corporation will buy up all the resources (think Andrew Carnegie and ores) and control their distribution, workers will have no say.
Corporations cannot exist without a State. A corporation in an anarcho-capitalist society is an oxymoron. Groups of people may combine their resources, but there will be no State picking winners and losers.

Workers would still have a say because every interaction must be voluntary and without force. If a worker doesn't like his employer he is free to go somewhere else. He must also do due diligence and make sure the contract he signs with his employer is clear and concise before he agrees to it.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:46 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
36,853 posts, read 17,363,818 times
Reputation: 14459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
And if all the means of production are taken by major companies (which will happen) the individual worker will have to work FOR said company or else be deprived and the needed resources.

That is corporate slavery.
This is a common misconception because you don't understand the meaning of the words "rightful private property". I wouldn't sweat it though. As a statist and most likely a public school graduate or at least supporter the true meaning of words are often fuzzy and confusing.

In order for property to become privatized it has to...

1. Not already be privatized by an individual (this would be theft...notice that only an individual can own property and if any group wants to form a collective to own property the only way they will be recognized as that group is by contractual law...which only applies to consenting parties)

2. You must mix your labor with the property (homesteading, making a product)

You know how the State owns large swaths of land and regulates the hell out of any company not feeding it buckets of money behind closed doors creating monopolies, artificial scarcity, and general market imbalances?

Consider it gone. WOOSH!

Now, let's add onto 1 and 2 above with another tenet that cements the fact that the means of production will not be monopolized by major companies or anyone else for that matter. Even though a company can only exist within a contractual framework between consenting parties.

* Each individual owns their body and the fruits of their labor outright and this right can't be infringed upon unless that party violates the NAP or consents to do so via personal contract.

You know how the government loves to tell people who, what, where ,and how they can sell their goods and body for that matter?

Consider it gone. WOOSH!

So what does that do for society? Well, with the freedom of association and private property redefined properly as understood by natural law it will create various competitors for goods and services in high demand (to own as well as buy) with little competitors for goods and services in low demand.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:52 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
8,750 posts, read 3,119,604 times
Reputation: 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
And if all the means of production are taken by major companies (which will happen) the individual worker will have to work FOR said company or else be deprived and the needed resources.

That is corporate slavery.
Like I said, there will be no corporations.

Besides, syndicalism fights all traditional producer privileges and deliberately places the producer interest of the workers in the foreground. It makes production impossible, as it prevents advancement and economic progress.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:58 PM
 
Location: Manchester NH
15,507 posts, read 6,432,565 times
Reputation: 4831
Quote:
Originally Posted by No_Recess View Post
This is a common misconception because you don't understand the meaning of the words "rightful private property". I wouldn't sweat it though. As a statist and most likely a public school graduate or at least supporter the true meaning of words are often fuzzy and confusing.

In order for property to become privatized it has to...

1. Not already be privatized by an individual (this would be theft...notice that only an individual can own property and if any group wants to form a collective to own property the only way they will be recognized as that group is by contractual law...which only applies to consenting parties)

2. You must mix your labor with the property (homesteading, making a product)

You know how the State owns large swaths of land and regulates the hell out of any company not feeding it buckets of money behind closed doors creating monopolies, artificial scarcity, and general market imbalances?

Consider it gone. WOOSH!

Now, let's add onto 1 and 2 above with another tenet that cements the fact that the means of production will not be monopolized by major companies or anyone else for that matter. Even though a company can only exist within a contractual framework between consenting parties.

* Each individual owns their body and the fruits of their labor outright and this right can't be infringed upon unless that party violates the NAP or consents to do so via personal contract.

You know how the government loves to tell people who, what, where ,and how they can sell their goods and body for that matter?

Consider it gone. WOOSH!

So what does that do for society? Well, with the freedom of association and private property redefined properly as understood by natural law it will create various competitors for goods and services in high demand (to own as well as buy) with little competitors for goods and services in low demand.
Insulting me without knowing anything about who I am is not wise.

If you have private businesses in one industry eventually (out of desire in maximizing profits) said business will buy out the means of production in that industry (see: Standard Oil). Even without the state to grant a monopoly competition will not prosper and the working class won’t have options in how they want to utilize a certain resource; if they are the once’s producing it they should benefit from it.

If a worker (in your society) wants to quit working for someone they’d need alternative options (something they won’t have).
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 09:59 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
8,750 posts, read 3,119,604 times
Reputation: 1747
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
1.Yes, voluntary, and they work with disputes. If someone doesn’t want to participate there is no way to force them, then lawlessness reigns. History proves lawless societies never work

2. No, just because they won’t be granted by the state does not mean they won’t be obtained

3. This is psychologically false. If wider society is not cared for the (moral) environment will collapse and even the successful individual will turn to cruelty or violence (people are a product of their environment).

4. It is not that simple, it needs to be filtered, and maintained at all hours. One person can’t do that and if you privatize this service it will be done for profit and the customer will be abused.
1. As natural law always exists, no society is ever lawless.

2. Nothing can be obtained unless it is voluntary and without force.

3. People are products of the State. As the State is synonymous with violence people reflect their environment.

4. Entrepreneurs will come up with more efficient ways to purify and filter it. He will have employees who will make his business run more efficiently. If there are competitors to his service his product will either improve and be sold more cheaply--providing better value to customers--or his business will fail and the stronger businesspeople will prosper.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 10:00 PM
 
Location: Manchester NH
15,507 posts, read 6,432,565 times
Reputation: 4831
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebeldor View Post
Like I said, there will be no corporations.

Besides, syndicalism fights all traditional producer privileges and deliberately places the producer interest of the workers in the foreground. It makes production impossible, as it prevents advancement and economic progress.
It does and has worked, if people get out what they put in they will be incentivized to produce rather than control capital.

Look at Catalonia before WW2.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
 
Old 03-24-2018, 10:06 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
36,853 posts, read 17,363,818 times
Reputation: 14459
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winterfall8324 View Post
Insulting me without knowing anything about who I am is not wise.

If you have private businesses in one industry eventually (out of desire in maximizing profits) said business will buy out the means of production in that industry (see: Standard Oil). Even without the state to grant a monopoly competition will not prosper and the working class won’t have options in how they want to utilize a certain resource; if they are the once’s producing it they should benefit from it.

If a worker (in your society) wants to quit working for someone they’d need alternative options (something they won’t have).
If the "working class" don't value that resource then they won't buy it or stop someone else from buying it through non-aggression pressure.

You're describing a default monopoly. It's not really a monopoly because nobody else deems their labor or money worthy enough to stop the monopoly from happening.
Reply With Quote Quick reply to this message
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.

Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.


Reply
Please update this thread with any new information or opinions. This open thread is still read by thousands of people, so we encourage all additional points of view.

Quick Reply
Message:


Over $104,000 in prizes was already given out to active posters on our forum and additional giveaways are planned!

Go Back   City-Data Forum > General Forums > Politics and Other Controversies
Similar Threads

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 08:29 AM.

© 2005-2024, Advameg, Inc. · Please obey Forum Rules · Terms of Use and Privacy Policy · Bug Bounty

City-Data.com - Contact Us - Archive 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10, 11, 12, 13, 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22, 23, 24, 25, 26, 27, 28, 29, 30, 31, 32, 33, 34, 35, 36, 37 - Top