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Old 06-05-2018, 02:45 AM
 
7,489 posts, read 4,955,226 times
Reputation: 8031

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kracer View Post
why shouldn't they want to hold on to their advantage?

Of course they do so at the expense of the US as they want to maintian their gravy train ride.

the yelling you hear is that of spoiled children holding their breath between screams.

they will come around. Trump has essentially forced them to face reality and share the profits.

Left wing media has written the story after 1 round of a 15 round match and declaring it a loss for Trump. Premature conclusions are a characteristic of a trump hating media who expects instant graification.
Whose advantage?

Canada and the USA have co-existed for decades without ever invoking the "national security" clause against each other. The USA has now invoked that doing business with Canada poses a National Security risk, and the USA should no longer rely on Canada for steel and aluminium because in a time of war, Caanda might withhold aluminium and steel. Really. Bizarre, but okay, we understand that your president is a bit nuts.

Impact on Canada is minimal. The USA consumer will pay the bill and Canada has the advantage while the USA is pissing on its neighbours.

Last edited by Lieneke; 06-05-2018 at 02:58 AM..
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:09 AM
 
7,489 posts, read 4,955,226 times
Reputation: 8031
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mason3000 View Post
You don't understand negotiations. Steel/aluminum tariffs with Canada, are actually about Canada's exploitation of NAFTA. The reason Canada has a a bustling steel industry, or auto industry, et al. is because they're allowing foreign corporations to exploit the NAFTA loophole into the U.S. Do you believe foreign steel corporations would have bought up Canadian steel factories if they couldn't ship that steel into the US tariff free via NAFTA? Or foreign auto makers, or any other corporations for that matter? Hell no. The ONLY reason they invested in Canada was to get to the US market without paying the entrance fee. Why should Canada get all that industry, revenue & jobs when the only thing they have to offer is free entrance into the U.S.?

Look at South Korea, also an strong ally. SK knew they were abusing us, so they agreed to allow the US to sell more cars in SK & relax the preposterous red tape that made it prohibitive for US corporations to do business there. Voila' they're exempt from the steel/aluminum tariffs. It was that easy. Canada simply chose not to be fair or reasonable and are going to pay the price until they wise up.
Mmm. No. The USA put their cards on the table and stated what they wanted. Mexico and Canada sorted it out and agreed, and then the USA said "fooled you, changed my mind".

Everyone in Canada and Mexico understands that the USA manages NAFTA negotiations in bad faith.
New normal, or continuing 'country to the South' problems?
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:14 AM
 
7,489 posts, read 4,955,226 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by greywar View Post
The EU doesn't buy this argument either. These are our allies, trying to claim that this is a national security issue only applies if we were going to leave NATO. Russia and China must be loving this.
Leave NATO, and stop being an ally to Canada?

As the second largest country in the world and as a smaller, highly educated population, Canada is not going to capitulate to bullying from a smaller over-populated dirty country to the South like the USA or Mexico.
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:37 AM
 
45,676 posts, read 24,012,426 times
Reputation: 15559
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lieneke View Post
Whose advantage?

Canada and the USA have co-existed for decades without ever invoking the "national security" clause against each other. The USA has now invoked that doing business with Canada poses a National Security risk, and the USA should no longer rely on Canada for steel and aluminium because in a time of war, Caanda might withhold aluminium and steel. Really. Bizarre, but okay, we understand that your president is a bit nuts.

Impact on Canada is minimal. The USA consumer will pay the bill and Canada has the advantage while the USA is pissing on its neighbours.
I don't think Canada has the 'advantage'.

Both countries will be impacted by this.

Look -- the steel industry in the USA might see a boost, but the rest of the country will see an increase in costs and some industries are concerned for their viability and profitability with those price increases. Consumers are the ultimate victims.
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Old 06-05-2018, 06:50 AM
 
Location: the very edge of the continent
89,026 posts, read 44,824,472 times
Reputation: 13712
Quote:
Originally Posted by dothetwist View Post
trump does not understand history, diplomacy or just being a good neighbor.
Good neighbors have fences/walls, and keep their own s**t in their own territory. What am I missing?
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Old 06-05-2018, 07:51 AM
 
Location: Canada
7,680 posts, read 5,529,153 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by moneill View Post
I don't think Canada has the 'advantage'.

Both countries will be impacted by this.

Look -- the steel industry in the USA might see a boost, but the rest of the country will see an increase in costs and some industries are concerned for their viability and profitability with those price increases. Consumers are the ultimate victims.
Will it overall? Canada imports a lot of steel from the U.S. Both Canada and Mexico have announced they will be slapping retaliatory tariffs on U.S. steel. About 50% of U.S. steel exports go to Canada and 39% go to Mexico.

https://www.trade.gov/steel/countrie...exports-us.pdf

The whole situation is so dumb.
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Old 06-05-2018, 07:54 AM
 
22,923 posts, read 15,489,598 times
Reputation: 16962
Quote:
Originally Posted by InformedConsent View Post
Good neighbors have fences/walls, and keep their own s**t in their own territory. What am I missing?
That part about yelling stupid stuff over the fence about how your neighbours new car has caused a rift with your wife and mistress.
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Old 06-05-2018, 07:54 AM
 
9,742 posts, read 4,495,432 times
Reputation: 3981
Lumber prices are shooting up. there already was shortage and now Candaa slapped a tariff on their exports.
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Old 06-05-2018, 08:28 AM
 
22,923 posts, read 15,489,598 times
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There is no doubt that Canada will suffer some pain but not to any greater extent than those Americans in states employing people using steel or aluminum in their manufacturing processes.

It has been more than adequately shown (using U.S. gov. provided figures) that each country has enjoyed a surplus from time to time in a pattern of alternating years. Especially so if including "services" exchange across the border.

This was all so unnecessary and only done to bully Canada into accepting NAFTA changes that would have UNFAIRLY impacted a smaller economy.

A sunset clause would require a renegotiation every few years, subjecting businesses to undue uncertainty as most use a five year projection to anticipate costs. A smaller economy would feel the negative effects of that far more than a ten times larger economy that can more easily absorb sectional impacts.

A removal of an impartial third party adjudication process, the WTO, with the resultant prospect of the larger economy being able to "force" compliance or ignore the deleterious effects it's causing it's partners is another non-starter. Who would actually be stupid enough to expect agreement with letting the fox guard the henhouse.

The U.S. insistence it's been taken advantage of for years is not born out by the facts easily available to all who actually go looking rather than listen to buffoon tunes.
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Old 06-05-2018, 08:34 AM
 
Location: Near Manito
20,169 posts, read 24,330,946 times
Reputation: 15291
Quote:
Originally Posted by BruSan View Post

The U.S. insistence it's been taken advantage of for years is not born out by the facts easily available to all who actually go looking rather than listen to buffoon tunes.
You mean like this?

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