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I agree that there has been some pressure, but 7,000 signatures on a petition and 5 girls in makeshift uniforms was not what caused this change. I'm not sure why you're so hostile toward the idea that BSA did this to boost numbers, because they absolutely did.
Two recent blows to the BSA were the LDS scouts saying they were going to come up with their own program, and the looming balloon payment on the Summit. This decision is all about numbers and money.
I personally think the ridiculous name is also a money thing. The couldn't really keep using Boy Scouts of America (well they could, but you know) so they came up with this redundant stupidity of a name because all of their branding is BSA and they can't afford to change it. So we get 'Scouts Boy Scouts of America', instead of a logical name like Scouts of America, so they can keep using all the BSA branded things.
Come now.We both know that the 2 instances I chose to cite were not the whole of the pressure put on the BSA, just a couple of examples out of thousands. And while people can make the claim that it was done solely to drive up numbers, the very words of the BSA I linked deny this. As I said in another post, I have no doubt that part of what brought the BSA around was the realization that this would increase their numbers, but to say this is the original impetus is not born out by the words of the BSA in the years immediately preceding the decision.
So the Boy Scouts are dropping 'boy' from their name but keeping BSA? How does that work? Will the Girl Scouts keep 'girl' in their name when boys and transgenders want to join?
I want to see Transgender Scouts replace the Girl Scouts.
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19,219 posts, read 17,091,524 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ContraPagan
This was a change made by the PTB at the National level. Do your research before commenting; there are a number of posters here who are providing the FACTS about this. Some of us have been watching what's been going on that has led to this for YEARS, because we have friends or family that have been members for decades.
I realize your believe yourself the encyclopedia of scouting but the change has been made regardless of the level. This mind set that everything must be equal because girls want to do what the boys do gets ridicules and I don't have to like the proposed change(s). Let GSA update their program to make it attractive because it seems they may be stuck in another era.
Boy Scouts -- Girl Guides - all seeing serious declines.
Girl Guides - 30% decline since 2003
It's hard to tell with the Boy Scouts because the articles seem to focus on the decline once the Boy Scouts announced they would 'allow' gay members (like there weren't gay members before -- ugh).
I have three boys and each of them had a friend or two who was a boy scout but most of their buddies were too busy with other activities -- football, baseball, hockey, soccer, music.
When i was a kid girls were in Brownies or Guides and boys were in Scouts -- it was always that way.
Now -- meh not so much.
Girl Guides were upset with the Boy Scouts because Boy Scout organizations were actively recruiting the girls. It isn't about 'letting' girl in - it is about having girls join to help keep up the numbers.
As a Den Leader, I quickly realized that a lot of the lessons/meeting subjects were facing stiff competition from the 21st century age of video games and the internet. And a bit of is just archaic at best (how to play marbles for example- I never did and was born in 1965). That might explain the decline.
Consequently, I try my best to tweak it and liven it up a bit. Field trips and guest speakers- anything to keep them from having to hear ole Moth drone on.
At best this decision will be a wash for the BSA. More likely is that it will cause an even further drop in membership by losing more boys than they gain girls.
When I was in the BS it wasn't really all that cool even back then, when it was likely a little more rough and ready. We used to kill and eat rattlesnakes on campouts, swim in places that no Scoutmaster would be allowed to let kids go now, and do all sorts of things that would be considered unsafe and off limits today. A bunch of us, far more than a couple of SM could have watched, once spent an hour in a raging river we could barely stand up in coming out of the outlets at the spillway of a local lake catching by hand some of the enormous amount of fish being sucked through and tossing them on the bank, then had a fish fry . I was hazed and initiated in a not too gentle fashion , among other things that simply wouldn't happen today. But even then the Scouts weren't all that popular among average schoolkids, and had sort of a "goody two shoes" rep. Now, girls can join. So it will become even less cool and less attractive to boys who want to feel they are in something "manly". It cant be too cool and rugged to a 15 yr old boy if the girls in his school can do it also , and this will turn a number of them off to joining the new and improved Boy and Girl Scouts ( which is how it will be thought of even if though that wont be the name ).
The BSA has pretty well caused their own demise over the last few decades , and it is now in the process of feminizing itself when the original point was to be a way to grow up manly and moral young men . The standards from now on will be " can the girls do it also" , because if they cant then it will be discrimination against the female members.
That is sure to attract boys wanting to be boys and do boy stuff.
Status:
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(set 22 days ago)
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19,219 posts, read 17,091,524 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wallflash
The BSA has pretty well caused their own demise over the last few decades , and it is now in the process of feminizing itself when the original point was to be a way to grow up manly and moral young men .
Today that mean your a sexist pig and this behavior must be stopped!
So the Boy Scouts are dropping 'boy' from their name but keeping BSA? How does that work? Will the Girl Scouts keep 'girl' in their name when boys and transgenders want to join?
I want to see Transgender Scouts replace the Girl Scouts.
Boy Scouts of America (BSA) is the organization name.
Within the organization, they have multiple programs:
Cub Scouts
Boy Scouts
Venture Scouts
Sea Scouts.
They are changing the name of the PROGRAM Boy Scouts to simply Scouts as it will now have programs for both boys and girls.
Venture Scouts has been co-ed since it's inception and Sea Scouts has been co-ed since 1972.
As a Den Leader, I quickly realized that a lot of the lessons/meeting subjects were facing stiff competition from the 21st century age of video games and the internet. And a bit of is just archaic at best (how to play marbles for example- I never did and was born in 1965). That might explain the decline.
Consequently, I try my best to tweak it and liven it up a bit. Field trips and guest speakers- anything to keep them from having to hear ole Moth drone on.
I'm guessing your Scouts never did a Deep Freeze/Klondike Derby weekend - sleeping outdoors in sub-zero weather, in either a platform tent or an open-sided lean-to.
I realize your believe yourself the encyclopedia of scouting but the change has been made regardless of the level. This mind set that everything must be equal because girls want to do what the boys do gets ridicules and I don't have to like the proposed change(s). Let GSA update their program to make it attractive because it seems they may be stuck in another era.
This has nothing to do with GSA. This is the BSA trying to remain a solvent organization by broadening their membership. If their membership count was still what it was 30-40+ years ago this would not be happening.
Also, the bolded part makes no sense whatsoever. Rewrite.
Quote:
Originally Posted by golgi1
Who are "those of us that are involved"? You're speaking for all those involved in Boy Scouts?
your inability to understand multiple posts that clearly indicate that girls in the scouting program will be in SEPERATE TROOPS (single gender environments) is your issue not mine.
"those of us" would refer to those in this thread who are posting.... no one that has self identified as part of the program have articulated false understandings .... stuff like "isn't that what girlscouts is" or 'they changed the name of Boy Scouts" etc.
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