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Old 06-05-2018, 03:31 PM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,563,173 times
Reputation: 8094

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Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Won't make a lick of difference.

1. Without regulations more people will be damaged by improper medicine or lack of - and then need MORE - or else they'd all be dumped into a morgue outside the ER.

2. Same. People are not equipped to know about the tens of thousands of conditions and expenses they might occur. They will become more prey for predators. The strong will eat the weak even more than they do today.

3. Foreign companies are a VAST part of our medical system.

Won't change a thing. Our problem is that we keep being the very definition of insane - that is, doubling down on the idea that the free market works in health care. It didn't work in civil rights. It doesn't work in war and peace (it prefers war). It doesn't work in the environmental field...

Simplistic solutions which require a 100% change in our system can't happen anyway - so I'll just grow some wings (more chance of that) and fly up to heaven.

The very same forces that create our inequality created our "double the cost and less value" health care. Give any capitalist or corporation the choice between us spending 1.5 trillion a year on health care...or 3.3 trillion a year. Guess which one they will pick? I thought so.
Enjoy your crappy and expensive health care then.
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:33 PM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,563,173 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Be careful talking about "vast majorities"

"the rise of China’s middle class. New Century and shopping malls like it- are emblematic of the rise of China’s middle class, which is expected to expand from 430 million today to 780 million in the mid-2020s"

So, their middle class is already as much as triple the size of ours and has living standards which match many US States.

"typical middle-class living standards in a second-tier city like Chengdu are on par with those in some of the poorer states in the United States (not least because the cost of living is about half as high as in the United States by purchasing power parity estimates). Meanwhile, living standards for wealthy families in Beijing and Shanghai can match the best the United States has to offer. Ordinary Chinese urbanites can afford to shop at mega-malls, own their own cars, and even take overseas vacations."

Never before have so many people been lifted out of poverty so quickly.

In the end, it doesn't matter whether 500 million or 700 million Chinese are middle and upper class - either way, it represents a vast amount of wealth. And wealth begets more wealth, especially among a high-IQ educated population that values hard work.

The folks I know in Southern China and Hong Kong think nothing of a first class ticket to the US and back (14K). In fact, that's the only way they would travel. How about you? First class?
China has 1.3 billion people! The rise of some Chinese people are precisely because of CAPITALISM. There's no better example in the world. They aren't much richer is because the stupid government still in place.

Also the Chinese are prolific savers - they are extremely frugal, not like the Americans.

https://www.cnbc.com/2015/10/25/chin...n-a-chart.html

I would never travel on first class, and I've traveled all over the world already. As a frugal person, I don't see I need to spend $14K on an airline ticket no matter how much money I have.
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:43 PM
 
12,772 posts, read 7,976,365 times
Reputation: 4332
Quote:
Originally Posted by rotikdls View Post
Point lost.. Costs are going up. And fast. Very little is being said because economy is red hot. Recall the great recession and all of that? Yeah, that bill is just starting to be printed for tender. Recall also that Mainstreet bailed out wall street and now main street is closed up. The high minded called it moral hazard.

Add to that earlier pile of why things can't last much longer.
I get the point you are going after, but my point is that most of this stuff is avoidable (meaning dont eat garbage and its a lot cheaper in the long and short term) and do better saving and not wasting money. Economies go in cycles, when the going is good, thats the time to stock up and save so you are prepared for the bad times. You can also take advantage of the bad times when stocks and products get heavily discounted. Although what you are describing you are kind of putting in "end of world" type terms, and I dont think we are there...yet.
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:43 PM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,563,173 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by rotikdls View Post
And in turn, the same here. Except we did build after WW2.

China has lots of room to grow. We, the US, are only going to slip and fall away more and more. Politicians would be wise to stop the BS antics of America is still the top of this and that, and prepare people for the lower standard of living that is inevitable.

Historically these things don't end well. Britian is also seeing it's living standards fade.

Bernie Sanders could well have won, and he would have won because he was preparing people to accept we are heading down and reorganizing society as such. Notice he dominated completely in rural areas.

$400 to your name for millions of people is no accident and the result of many factors.
LOL! Have you been to China?

A country that can't even produce a decent car engine can overtake US? Give me a break.

The China's success is based on two things, one is bad, the other very good:
1. Plagiarism
2. Capitalism

Chinese didn't pay any royalty when they have copied everything that they can get their hands on, from cars, TVs, airplane, medicine, to toilet paper. There's zero respect to intellectual property. Stealing intellectual properties from the west is universally encouraged in China. In the short term, it helps to improve the quality of life, but in the long run, it would not.

China benefits greatly after the introduction of capitalism, but with the communist party still in power, it's greatly limited. Their growth will slow down in the future. China does NOT have the political system to ensure long term prosperity.
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:46 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,672,766 times
Reputation: 14050
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
China has 1.3 billion people! The rise of some Chinese people are precisely because of CAPITALISM. There's no better example in the world. They aren't much richer is because the stupid government still in place.

Also the Chinese are prolific savers - they are extremely frugal, not like the Americans.

https://www.cnbc.com/2015/10/25/chin...n-a-chart.html

I would never travel on first class, and I've traveled all over the world already. As a frugal person, I don't see I need to spend $14K on an airline ticket no matter how much money I have.
Maybe if you flew 14+ hours regularly you would notice the difference.....

So - let me get at your summary. Our American system is great, but the people suck and therefore the Chinese do a better job of being Capitalists than we do??

Or....could it be that having leaders who actually steer the country in the right direction...and believe in Science, Engineering and Education as being the keys to helping the country move more and more people out of poverty.....beats our "every man for himself" style?
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:47 PM
 
Location: St. Louis, MO
4,009 posts, read 6,864,509 times
Reputation: 4608
Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
The point is likelihood.

I can give you a hundred examples that some otherwise outstanding citizens somehow just flipped, but that still doesn't disapprove the point that if a person has been an outstanding person, the likelihood of that person behave differently is very low. How low? 2.4/100,000 people vs. 3813/100,000.

On the flip side, if the person has been a douche bag or a criminal, the likelihood of the person suddenly becomes an outstanding citizen is low. Statistically, the recidivism rate is 77%. So go figure.
And


Quote:
Originally Posted by lifeexplorer View Post
I've been married for a long.

The point is likelihood.

I can give you a hundred examples that some otherwise outstanding citizens somehow just flipped, but that still doesn't disapprove the point that if a person has been an outstanding person, the likelihood of that person behave differently is very low. How low? 2.4/100,000 people vs. 3813/100,000.

On the flip side, if the person has been a douche bag or a criminal, the likelihood of the person suddenly becomes an outstanding citizen is low. Statistically, the recidivism rate is 77%. So go figure.
Wow. You copied and pasted your own reply to two different people. That does wonders for your credibility!

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Old 06-05-2018, 03:47 PM
 
Location: Long Island
32,816 posts, read 19,480,794 times
Reputation: 9618
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Be careful talking about "vast majorities"

"the rise of China’s middle class. New Century and shopping malls like it- are emblematic of the rise of China’s middle class, which is expected to expand from 430 million today to 780 million in the mid-2020s"

So, their middle class is already as much as triple the size of ours and has living standards which match many US States.

"typical middle-class living standards in a second-tier city like Chengdu are on par with those in some of the poorer states in the United States (not least because the cost of living is about half as high as in the United States by purchasing power parity estimates). Meanwhile, living standards for wealthy families in Beijing and Shanghai can match the best the United States has to offer. Ordinary Chinese urbanites can afford to shop at mega-malls, own their own cars, and even take overseas vacations."

Never before have so many people been lifted out of poverty so quickly.

In the end, it doesn't matter whether 500 million or 700 million Chinese are middle and upper class - either way, it represents a vast amount of wealth. And wealth begets more wealth, especially among a high-IQ educated population that values hard work.

The folks I know in Southern China and Hong Kong think nothing of a first class ticket to the US and back (14K). In fact, that's the only way they would travel. How about you? First class?
and why is china's middleclass rising....because of capitalism


not communism
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:51 PM
 
Location: Long Island
32,816 posts, read 19,480,794 times
Reputation: 9618
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
I just heard a podcast from an advisor who spent 8 years in the white house. At the end of his time there it was after Trump has won...and, in the normal course of business, he and Obama had dinners or other communications with Xi, Merkel and Trudeau. He noted that Merkel actually cried and that Trudeau was very concerned about the state of the world and Canada. But Xi just smiled and said "If an immature man create chaos in the world, we will know who to blame". In translation, it all meant that he had not the least worry in being able to always come out on top...it's a speck or blip on the screen to China. But to the other two leaders it was more serious business because they were accustomed to a partnership with the US and other Western Nations which is likely to be upset (and it sure is!)...

Xi laughs at us. We are our own undoing. He seriously wishes us well, but cannot save us from ourselves. No one can do that.
merkel is a freaking socialist/fascist aka liberal

Trudeau is in idiot who would even take care of his veterans,he is a fascist liberal thug

trudeau is a nut case that refuses to take care of Canada's veterans
https://globalnews.ca/news/4003755/i...ustin-trudeau/

https://globalnews.ca/news/4003524/r...-the-veterans/

https://www.spencerfernando.com/2018...ive-right-now/

https://www.thestar.com/news/canada/...town-hall.html
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Old 06-05-2018, 03:51 PM
 
26,694 posts, read 14,563,173 times
Reputation: 8094
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Maybe if you flew 14+ hours regularly you would notice the difference.....

So - let me get at your summary. Our American system is great, but the people suck and therefore the Chinese do a better job of being Capitalists than we do??

Or....could it be that having leaders who actually steer the country in the right direction...and believe in Science, Engineering and Education as being the keys to helping the country move more and more people out of poverty.....beats our "every man for himself" style?
I used to fly 18 hours straight to the middle east to work every two months. Your point?

Yes, American system is great until the crappy FDR introduced socialism like welfare. Welfare without obligation permanently impoverishes millions.

American system is still great because virtually all American people are filthy rich compared to any world standard, which you self has proved this point.

American system would be much much better if we remove the vile leftism.
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Old 06-05-2018, 05:18 PM
 
Location: Living rent free in your head
42,850 posts, read 26,268,189 times
Reputation: 34058
Quote:
Originally Posted by evilnewbie View Post
But they do have an iPhone and tickets to some concert while also paying for their kids eating out every week...
Nice story, now back it up with some proof.
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