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Old 06-19-2018, 08:49 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,643 posts, read 26,371,773 times
Reputation: 12648

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Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
We had a thread yesterday about the 'deep state.' One after another liberal poster stepped forth to deny and deride even the existence of a 'deep state.' One compared it to the 'chem trail' conspiracies. Another said that it was tin-foil hat territory. The denial posts were long on derision and short on facts. The thread was unfortunately closed before resolution.


For those who deny that there is such a thing as the 'deep state,' what is your explanation for the case of Catherine Engelbrecht?
https://www.nationalreview.com/2013/...-kay-melchior/


She and her husband owned a small manufacturing company in Texas. They had been in business since around 1990, with zero contact from feds, other than filing annual tax forms.

In July, 2010, she filed for 501(c)(4) status with the IRS for an organization she called 'True the Vote.' That winter, the FBI showed up at her shop asking questions about a group member. In Jan 2010, the IRS showed up to audit her business. In 2011, the FBI made four further inquiries. In Feb 2012 the BATF showed up to do an unscheduled audit. The company had a license to make gun parts, which they had never used. In July 2012 OSHA showed up to audit them. They were fined $17,500 for violations such as not having the correct kind of seat belt on a forklift. In Nov 2012, the Texas state version of the EPA showed up.


After three years she still had not received tax exempt status for 'True the Vote.'


Twenty years with zero contact, and then about 2 years with about 10 instances of contact? Incidentally 'True the Vote' was prominently on the radar of several Democrat congress critters, including Elijah Cummings, who was closely involved in the investigation of the IRS and Lois Lerner.


Do deniers seriously expect us to believe that this was all coincidental? That would seem to me a much bigger leap of faith than to posit the existence of a 'deep state' in some form. Or do the deniers out there have some other plausible explanation for what happened to Catherine Engelbrecht?

It is not completely outside the realm of coincidence, but it wouldn't surprise me to learn the couple was the subject of a campaign of harassment either.

The problem is that there is no way to know with 100% certainty.

The solution - the only real solution - is to reduce the federal government's ability to wage war against the people.
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Old 06-19-2018, 08:51 PM
 
Location: Unperson Everyman Land
38,643 posts, read 26,371,773 times
Reputation: 12648
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
What is your evidence that she partnered with a hostile foreign government?
I didn't know the Tea Party movement partnered with hostile foreign governments.
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Old 06-19-2018, 09:23 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,568 posts, read 17,275,200 times
Reputation: 37290
Quote:
Originally Posted by Winter_Sucks View Post
Don’t partner with a hostile foreign government to influence a presidential election and you won’t have a problem with “the deep state.”
So it does exist, right?
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Old 06-19-2018, 09:54 PM
 
Location: Lone Mountain Las Vegas NV
18,058 posts, read 10,344,025 times
Reputation: 8828
Well True the Vote has brought notoriety on itself..

And that may well have led to her name causing suspicion. Who would you suggest? Random or those who appear in "colorful" roles?

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2...ter-fraud-myth
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Old 06-19-2018, 10:05 PM
 
8,196 posts, read 2,843,415 times
Reputation: 4478
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
We had a thread yesterday about the 'deep state.' One after another liberal poster stepped forth to deny and deride even the existence of a 'deep state.' One compared it to the 'chem trail' conspiracies. Another said that it was tin-foil hat territory. The denial posts were long on derision and short on facts. The thread was unfortunately closed before resolution.


For those who deny that there is such a thing as the 'deep state,' what is your explanation for the case of Catherine Engelbrecht?
https://www.nationalreview.com/2013/...-kay-melchior/


She and her husband owned a small manufacturing company in Texas. They had been in business since around 1990, with zero contact from feds, other than filing annual tax forms.

In July, 2010, she filed for 501(c)(4) status with the IRS for an organization she called 'True the Vote.' That winter, the FBI showed up at her shop asking questions about a group member. In Jan 2010, the IRS showed up to audit her business. In 2011, the FBI made four further inquiries. In Feb 2012 the BATF showed up to do an unscheduled audit. The company had a license to make gun parts, which they had never used. In July 2012 OSHA showed up to audit them. They were fined $17,500 for violations such as not having the correct kind of seat belt on a forklift. In Nov 2012, the Texas state version of the EPA showed up.


After three years she still had not received tax exempt status for 'True the Vote.'


Twenty years with zero contact, and then about 2 years with about 10 instances of contact? Incidentally 'True the Vote' was prominently on the radar of several Democrat congress critters, including Elijah Cummings, who was closely involved in the investigation of the IRS and Lois Lerner.


Do deniers seriously expect us to believe that this was all coincidental? That would seem to me a much bigger leap of faith than to posit the existence of a 'deep state' in some form. Or do the deniers out there have some other plausible explanation for what happened to Catherine Engelbrecht?
I'll just say this. If you'll notice. The liberals come in and raise a ruckus so as to get a thread closed if it is about something that sheds a light on something that they don't want exposed. But let them post threads spreading lies about President Trump and his supporters and boy howdy that thing will go on forever.
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Old 06-19-2018, 10:36 PM
 
Location: CO/UT/AZ/NM Catch me if you can!
6,926 posts, read 6,934,737 times
Reputation: 16509
Quote:
Originally Posted by wutitiz View Post
We had a thread yesterday about the 'deep state.' One after another liberal poster stepped forth to deny and deride even the existence of a 'deep state.' One compared it to the 'chem trail' conspiracies. Another said that it was tin-foil hat territory. The denial posts were long on derision and short on facts. The thread was unfortunately closed before resolution.


For those who deny that there is such a thing as the 'deep state,' what is your explanation for the case of Catherine Engelbrecht?
https://www.nationalreview.com/2013/...-kay-melchior/


She and her husband owned a small manufacturing company in Texas. They had been in business since around 1990, with zero contact from feds, other than filing annual tax forms.

In July, 2010, she filed for 501(c)(4) status with the IRS for an organization she called 'True the Vote.' That winter, the FBI showed up at her shop asking questions about a group member. In Jan 2010, the IRS showed up to audit her business. In 2011, the FBI made four further inquiries. In Feb 2012 the BATF showed up to do an unscheduled audit. The company had a license to make gun parts, which they had never used. In July 2012 OSHA showed up to audit them. They were fined $17,500 for violations such as not having the correct kind of seat belt on a forklift. In Nov 2012, the Texas state version of the EPA showed up.


After three years she still had not received tax exempt status for 'True the Vote.'


Twenty years with zero contact, and then about 2 years with about 10 instances of contact? Incidentally 'True the Vote' was prominently on the radar of several Democrat congress critters, including Elijah Cummings, who was closely involved in the investigation of the IRS and Lois Lerner.


Do deniers seriously expect us to believe that this was all coincidental? That would seem to me a much bigger leap of faith than to posit the existence of a 'deep state' in some form. Or do the deniers out there have some other plausible explanation for what happened to Catherine Engelbrecht?
Oh, Lord! That outfit? For one thing Catherine Engelbrecht and her coterie of fellow racists who work hard at voter intimidation and voter suppression in districts that have a high percentage of minority voters got her Get Out of Jail Free Card from none other than the Donald himself. The moment he got into office, he waved his magic wand at the courts and poof! Another witch hunt where the witch herself escaped.

True the Vote is far from being some benign non-profit deserving of tax exempt status. It is inspired and backed by the Tea Party and likes to hand out checks for thousands of dollars to Republican candidates - Democrats need not apply.

Here's what SourceWatch has to say about them:

On May 21, 2013, True the Vote filed a complaint against the Internal Revenue Service to "force a decision in court" of whether its 3-year-pending application for 501(c)3 tax-exempt status should be approved. This complaint arose from the IRS pattern of targeting organizations containing the words "Tea Party" or "patriot," which the IRS claimed was a method of centralizing a large influx of nonprofit applications between 2010 and 2012.

While the IRS did admit that mistakes were made in the categorization and review process, it is likely that True the Vote has rightly been scrutinized since its inception in 2010. Many media sources identify 2012 as the year when targeted IRS investigations and abuses occurred, but True the Vote's status has been questioned since its inception in 2010. While a 501(c)4 Tea Party group, such as the King Street Patriots may engage in some political activity, a 501(c)3 status is an absolute bar against any campaign or partisan activity.

Is True the Vote really Nonpartisan?

Questions about whether True the Vote is really a "charity" refraining from political activity (necessary to be considered a 501(c)3 nonprofit) arise as early as its partisan roots. A 2010 video announcing True the Vote's launch begins with right-wing activist David Horowitz telling the camera that "Republicans have to win by at least three percent in order to win an election," since Democrats are likely to case fraudulent votes. Further, True the Vote's activities largely consist of training Tea Partiers to act as "poll watchers," some of whom have been accused of voter intimidation.


True the Vote - Stop Voter Fraud

At the time of True the Vote's "poll watching" activities in Harris County, Texas during the November 2010 elections the organization was described as a "project" of the Houston-based Tea Party group the King Street Patriots. As a result of a 2010 lawsuit filed against the King Street Patriots by the state Democratic Party, a Texas judge ruled that the organization was an unregistered PAC rather than the nonprofit corporation that it claimed, and that it unlawfully provided in-kind donations to the state Republican Party. The judge's ruling was based in part on True the Vote's voter intimidation practices and the parent organization's close ties to the state Republican Party.


- more at https://www.sourcewatch.org/index.php/True_the_Vote

You're just ticked off that black Americans and brown Americans have the very same right to vote as white Americans do. You blame the Dems and the so-called "deep state" for the fact that you can't always get away with voter suppression the way you long to. As for the Democrats, guilty as charged. We are not in favor of voter suppression and proud of it. As for the "deep state," take two valiums and don't call me in the morning.
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Old 06-19-2018, 10:39 PM
 
Location: USA
18,491 posts, read 9,157,203 times
Reputation: 8523
Is a “liberal” anyone who doesn’t buy into far-Right conspiracy theories?
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Old 06-19-2018, 11:10 PM
 
11,181 posts, read 10,530,167 times
Reputation: 18618
We are real, very real.
Be afraid, very afraid.
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Old 06-19-2018, 11:24 PM
 
21,467 posts, read 10,570,105 times
Reputation: 14120
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss View Post
The non-profit she wanted to start. Was it to improve the community or that of a group. Did it have meetings. Did the group have officers. Are there minutes of the group meetings. Who was the member, did he have a criminal back ground. You have left a lot out.



Or was it one of the bogus groups being formed to take advantage of tax laws (IE. loophole).
Read the article linked. They hated her group because they wanted to ensure the integrity of elections, and prevent voter fraud. And they are conservative. They did nothing wrong.
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Old 06-19-2018, 11:26 PM
 
21,467 posts, read 10,570,105 times
Reputation: 14120
Quote:
Originally Posted by EDnurse View Post
What do you get when you ask good questions?

*Crickets*
He got three answers and you call that crickets? Watch her congressional testimony. It’s on YouTube. Or read the article in the OP.
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