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Old 07-10-2018, 01:48 PM
 
13,601 posts, read 4,931,126 times
Reputation: 9687

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Quote:
Originally Posted by rupp-certified View Post
It's impossible to be an originalist and an activist. Those are opposite and contradictory.
Both originalists and activists seek to read into the Constitution something that isn't there. Originalists state what they think the Founders meant, while activists state what they think it should say. The former try to divine what was going on in the minds of someone 230 years ago, while the latter redefine the law based on current culture. Both are equally speculative.

To the originalist, I would say - I don't really care what the founders intended, what matters is what the words say. To the activist, I say - if you want the Constitution to mean something other than what it says, you need to do an amendment.

This approach is called textualism, and to me is the only objective way to interpret the Constitution. Kavanough is said to be a textualist, but some of his opinions make me wonder about that.
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Old 07-10-2018, 02:53 PM
 
13,954 posts, read 5,623,969 times
Reputation: 8613
Quote:
Originally Posted by KerrTown View Post
Voter ID narrowed the swing vote voter pool to white, suburban voters with overwhelming automobile ownership along with allowing Concealed Carry license here in Texas. SOL if you're black and use the bus only, even though the transit authority is a government agency too.

https://www.politico.com/magazine/st...minutes-214144

Diebold's machines are popular in Texas. The election official in the neighboring larger county is a partisan position who primarily deals with tax collection. Why is the rooster watching the hen house?

But we have a bunch of activist GOP Supreme Court justices that just ruled that Voter ID is OK and that the Texas redistricting map does not need to be redrawn at all. Not because it's constitutional but because it's political payback for their party that got a lifetime appointment.
Yet the same process was used when Obama was elected?
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Old 07-10-2018, 03:11 PM
 
Location: North Seattle
609 posts, read 303,180 times
Reputation: 1002
Quote:
Originally Posted by KerrTown View Post
Voter ID narrowed the swing vote voter pool to white, suburban voters with overwhelming automobile ownership along with allowing Concealed Carry license here in Texas. SOL if you're black and use the bus only, even though the transit authority is a government agency too.
Any random tourist can get a bus pass from a vending machine in 5 minutes. A concealed carry license is a proper document that requires identification to obtain. You're an idiot if you can't see why one is a valid ID and not the other.
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Old 07-10-2018, 03:19 PM
 
Location: North Seattle
609 posts, read 303,180 times
Reputation: 1002
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo58 View Post
Both originalists and activists seek to read into the Constitution something that isn't there. Originalists state what they think the Founders meant, while activists state what they think it should say. The former try to divine what was going on in the minds of someone 230 years ago, while the latter redefine the law based on current culture. Both are equally speculative.

To the originalist, I would say - I don't really care what the founders intended, what matters is what the words say. To the activist, I say - if you want the Constitution to mean something other than what it says, you need to do an amendment.

This approach is called textualism, and to me is the only objective way to interpret the Constitution. Kavanough is said to be a textualist, but some of his opinions make me wonder about that.
Originalists can cite writings by the same men who framed the Constitution whereas activists have no check on their power except their imagination.
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Old 07-10-2018, 03:45 PM
 
6,835 posts, read 2,399,995 times
Reputation: 2727
Constitutions and politics are often tied together, so one might have to consider both.
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Old 07-10-2018, 03:48 PM
 
8,081 posts, read 6,958,439 times
Reputation: 7983
Quote:
Originally Posted by rupp-certified View Post
It's impossible to be an originalist and an activist. Those are opposite and contradictory.
Not really. Pick an end and find a way there. Scalia was very skilled at doing that.
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Old 07-10-2018, 04:01 PM
 
Location: SC
8,793 posts, read 8,163,127 times
Reputation: 12992
Almost everything in the constitution is open to interpretation. Because of that, it will ALWAYS be political considerations that rule the day.
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Old 07-10-2018, 04:57 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,837,332 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by Leo58 View Post
Both originalists and activists seek to read into the Constitution something that isn't there. Originalists state what they think the Founders meant, while activists state what they think it should say. The former try to divine what was going on in the minds of someone 230 years ago, while the latter redefine the law based on current culture. Both are equally speculative.

To the originalist, I would say - I don't really care what the founders intended, what matters is what the words say. To the activist, I say - if you want the Constitution to mean something other than what it says, you need to do an amendment.

This approach is called textualism, and to me is the only objective way to interpret the Constitution. Kavanough is said to be a textualist, but some of his opinions make me wonder about that.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rupp-certified View Post
Originalists can cite writings by the same men who framed the Constitution whereas activists have no check on their power except their imagination.

rupp is right. when the founding fathers wrote that they didnt want the government restricting the right so the people, it is easy enough to tell what they meant since it is in their own writings.
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Old 07-10-2018, 06:12 PM
 
Location: Denver, CO
8,750 posts, read 3,118,763 times
Reputation: 1747
The Constitution was one of the greatest sellings-out in human history.

It took the Articles of Confederation, which was based on natural law and individual sovereignty, and trashed it in exchange for the consolidation of power in a centralized-State--known as the Constitution.
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Old 07-10-2018, 06:19 PM
 
33,387 posts, read 34,837,332 times
Reputation: 20030
Quote:
Originally Posted by rebeldor View Post
The Constitution was one of the greatest sellings-out in human history.

It took the Articles of Confederation, which was based on natural law and individual sovereignty, and trashed it in exchange for the consolidation of power in a centralized-State--known as the Constitution.

wrong, the constitution, and the bill of rights, was designed to have a weak federal government with particular powers and responsibilities, and gave the rest to the people and the states. try reading the constitution again, specifically the tenth amendment.
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