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I say pull all US Forces out of Mainland Europe, but leave a Combat Brigade in both England, Poland and any other European nation that wants to stay allied with the U.S. and gaurantees to devote 2% of their gross GDP to the common defense of this new pact that wouldn't include both France and Germany.
Last month, Macron of France, with the full support of Merkle of Germany, was talking about creating an European Army to defend themselves from the Russians, Chinese... And Americans. Wow... Simply wow!! How many U.S.Military Cemetaries are in France were we have buried OUR war dead, who died to liberate France and Europe in both World War One and World War Two? The answer is... Way too many.
Scr*w the European Union!! If they want their own Army, go for it and get a taste of how it feels to foot close to 2/3rds of the total cost of defending Europe.
I'm pretty sure that most of "Europe" doesn't want to be under the military control of France AND Germany... How well has that worked out in the past??
The EU has no nukes, Britain and France have nukes, the EU military forces are those from each member country and NATO members.
The UK may well decide to review some defence and security arrangements in the future, especially given the stance the EU has taken in relation to Brexit negotiations.
The United Kingdom will side with the U.S. and I seriously doubt that they would commit their military forces to a French/German Command structure.
So, The European Union loses its best and most capable military force... Along with their nuclear weapons.
I guess Germany will need to build her own nuclear force... Ha!! I wonder how the rest of the EU would feel about a nuclear armed Germany calling the military shots and controlling their banks!!
Could easily kick out the Americans... They are just logistical bases they use themselves to fight their sheep herders in the ME.
The EU could easily destroy anything the Russian sent over their boarders.. but its cheaper if the Americans just stayed there.. for EVERYBODY.
You wanna see you 401K gets smashed when the Petro Dollar collapses because the US does not want to show they are willing to defend their Dollar in world wide business transactions? The Dollar would loose 30-40% of its value, interests rates would skyrocket and the US treasury would probably have to default on loans, meaning fewer nations would trust the US anymore and loan them money.
China will become the new world business center decades before it is projected.
However the EU countries spend 2% of its GDP on NATO and 11% of GDP on Healthcare, with better outcomes.
While the US spends 3% globally of its GDP ( NOT on NATO) on defense and 18% of GDP on Healthcare.
I say the US has its priorities wrong when it wastes $1 Trillion each year on Healthcare, when their defense budget is $700 Billion. You are waisting a US defense budget each year, to get poor healthcare outcomes compared to the EU.
Could easily kick out the Americans... They are just logistical bases they use themselves to fight their sheep herders in the ME.
The EU could easily destroy anything the Russian sent over their boarders.. but its cheaper if the Americans just stayed there.. for EVERYBODY.
You wanna see you 401K gets smashed when the Petro Dollar collapses because the US does not want to show they are willing to defend their Dollar in world wide business transactions? The Dollar would loose 30-40% of its value, interests rates would skyrocket and the US treasury would probably have to default on loans, meaning fewer nations would trust the US anymore and loan them money.
China will become the new world business center decades before it is projected.
However the EU countries spend 2% of its GDP on NATO and 11% of GDP on Healthcare, with better outcomes.
While the US spends 3% globally of its GDP ( NOT on NATO) on defense and 18% of GDP on Healthcare.
I say the US has its priorities wrong when it wastes $1 Trillion each year on Healthcare, when their defense budget is $700 Billion. You are waisting a US defense budget each year, to get poor healthcare outcomes compared to the EU.
You are essentially advocating neo-colonialism - something the lefties have been accusing the US of doing for the last 50 years.
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27,178 posts, read 13,461,836 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bergun
The United Kingdom will side with the U.S. and I seriously doubt that they would commit their military forces to a French/German Command structure.
So, The European Union loses its best and most capable military force... Along with their nuclear weapons.
I guess Germany will need to build her own nuclear force... Ha!! I wonder how the rest of the EU would feel about a nuclear armed Germany calling the military shots and controlling their banks!!
I totally agree.
The UK already has the UKUSA Intelligence Agreement, so even if NATO collapsed US bases would remain in the UK, and we could expand the agreement beyond intelligence and in to other areas of cooperation.
Similarly a CANZUK Agreement could also be part of even stronger Anglosphere Defence Ties.
The EU is currently trying to punish the UK opver Brexit and is beng inflexible when it comes to borders, whilst at the same time they expect UK Forces to help protect their borders from Russian Aggression.
At the same time they accuse the UK of 'Cherry Picking' when in reality that's exactly what the EU are doing.
As thing stand, personally I would be fine with withdrawing British forces from Europe altogether and letting the Germans deal and other Europeans try and build some unworkable Euro Army.
The United Kingdom will side with the U.S. and I seriously doubt that they would commit their military forces to a French/German Command structure.
So, The European Union loses its best and most capable military force... Along with their nuclear weapons.
I guess Germany will need to build her own nuclear force... Ha!! I wonder how the rest of the EU would feel about a nuclear armed Germany calling the military shots and controlling their banks!!
They've proven so reliable in their past.
The power hungry and war like strain than runs through Germans can only remain suppressed for so long. We gave Europe a long pause from those Kr***s, time to move on for us and focus on the Americas and Asia.
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Originally Posted by LKJ1988
Be nice to pull every person out of each country and cut back on the number of troops.
The Germans are the most annoying country in terms of Europe.
Germany forms part of the Central Front, which is one of the key was the Russians would advance.
The Germans spend a mere 1.2% on Defence and are home to 2/3rds of the US Army in Europe as well as nearly half the USAF in Europe, and they are also a very wealthy country with a very strong economy.
Other countries that have the threat of Russian Aggression hanging over them in relation to Poland, and some Blatic States tend to have decent enough defence forces, and the region is currently supported mainly by US and British forces.
The French spend around 1.8% which is not too far from the 2% target, however they are not home to any major US bases.
As for the Italians, they are not really at risk of invasion from Russia and most of the US Forces in Italy could easily be withdrawn with the exception of some naval facilities. Why the US keeps an Army Brigade in Italy is beyond me, and there is also a Naval Support facility, major USAF base and a US Naval Air Base in Italy. Italy and Spain account for nearly the entire US Naval presence in Europe.
In terms of the UK, the majority of US bases are based on gathering intelligence, the exception being Lakenheath, although I suppose the fact that Lakenheath is further away from Russia means planes would at least have a good chance of being abe to scramble and take to the air. The US base at Mildenhall is set to close by 2023, and the transport/refuelling planes are going to be moved to Ramstein in Germany, along with over 3,000 USAF Service Personnel.
The rest of Europe doesn't have a big US presense.
The US could withdraw some forces, especially in relation to Germany and Italy, indeed the Germans should be doing more to defend themselves rather than relying on others, and a lopt of US Forces in Italy aren't really needed.
America is not some "stand alone utopia".... this isolationist view is insane, maybe the millions who's ancestry who came from Europe should trace back their history and board boats and head back to where their ancestry came from if they don't like American Democracy.... since they claim to have so little concern for American Diplomacy and American Global Partnerships. They can't head back, because they don't know where they came from, because of the long history of race mixtures that has taken place over the centuries. So, their best bet is to face up and respect American Democracy and American Diplomacy, and the Diplomatic Reality of Allied Relations with our Allied Nations.
Unfortunate as it is... Among the biggest mistakes ever made in America was allowing unrestricted immigration from Europe without Screening the people who came here after 1776, and the 1800's and early 1900's... We would not have this rabid group that continues to disrespect what is American Democracy.
People do know in history, there were many among the masses who came to America since the late 1400's who fought for The King, before and after the signing of the Declaration of Independence... and unfortunately, they were not sent packing. We made another mistake as a nation, when it allowed those of the Confederacy to not have to re-apply for citizenship; since they fought against the Union....
They could have then been deported for subversion as well as tried for Treasonagainst the Union's, United States of America.
So here we are today.. still with a mass of Anti-Democracy people... still wreaking havoc, pushing bigotry, lining up to support the Serfdom their ancestry claimed to be fleeing from, and pushing racism as a serf group fighting to protect their masters dominance over themselves.
The make up of savagery types who came here not for democracy, butfor savage driven pursuits of wealth by any means with regard for nothing but their own avarice driven hearts.
They are continually trying to Tell Democracy Loving Americans... what the Constitution should not support. They have the least concern to respect or care for the words of the Preamble of the Constitution. Therefore they have no conceptual understanding of our elected congressional established programs of public services... and they have a resentment at the premise and principles of paying taxes.... they have a squatters mentality, wanting to gain the benefits without paying the cost which taxation is designed to provide.
Technology, whether its liked or unliked, whether we think it's good or not good will be developed in ways to address these types. The term "subversion" will become even more pronounced to address those who fight against the elements that support Democracy and the equality it stands to represent. It will address those who fight against the principles of International Diplomacy and those who oppose the diplomatic establishment of relations with Allied Nations.
The Re-Education of Americans will before a focus in the future... where people must have "civics based education's"... which respect the principles of equality which is the foundation of what supports Democracy.
Time is marching forward in a continual procession to rectify the wrongs of the past; all of which were created and driven by racism, bigotry, bias, greed by any means, and the fight against our American system of Regulatory Governance. One can rest assured "Democracy will prevail".... and the Confederacy Agenda will be forever removed from the lands of American Society.
The Future stops for no-one.. it keeps coming.
We have no need not to support our Allied Nations... there will be no withdrawal of troops from Europe.
Apparently, we have zero reason to be there.
What do you think? And please, can I get some serious responses?
Trump should offer EU two options;
1. Withdraw all US troops, or
2. Have EU pay 125% of our costs. Make these military posts a profit center.
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