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I strongly suggest, given that time period, the founders were speaking of a well regulated militia, made up of ordinary citizens.
They wanted to guarantee that the militia would always be armed should the need arise for them to be.
In other words, another invasion.
For far to many years, this amendment has been the source of the wrong interpretation by many.
Most believe that the word"people", meant the entire population, when in fact it meant the well regulated militia only.
Perhaps you were unaware that ALL MALE CITIZENS are the militia.
Since 1777, the militia were defined as all able bodied male citizens, between 17 and 45. They were obligated to train, fight, and die, on command. That is the reason why conscription is 100% constitutional.
. . .
“It may be laid down, as a primary position, and the basis of our system, that every citizen who enjoys the protection of a free government, owes not only a proportion of his property, but even of his personal services to the defence of it, and consequently that the Citizens of America (with a few legal and official exceptions) from 18 to 50 Years of Age should be borne on the Militia Rolls, provided with uniform Arms, and so far accustomed to the use of them, that the Total strength of the Country might be called forth at Short Notice on any very interesting Emergency.”
- - - George Washington; "Sentiments on a Peace Establishment" in a letter to Alexander Hamilton (2 May 1783); published in The Writings of George Washington (1938), edited by John C. Fitzpatrick, Vol. 26, p. 289.
Militia duty:
“AGE.... In the United States, at twenty-five, a man [citizen] may be elected a representative in congress;
at thirty, a senator; and
at thirty-five, he may be chosen president.
He is liable to serve in the militia from eighteen to forty- five inclusive, unless exempted for some particular reason.”
- - - From Bouvier’s Law dictionary, 1856 ed.
Title 10 USC Sec. 311. Militia: composition and classes
(a) The militia of the United States consists of all able-bodied males at least 17 years of age and, except as provided in section 313 of title 32, under 45 years of age who are, or who have made a declaration of intention to become, CITIZENS of the United States and of female citizens of the United States who are members of the National Guard.
(b) The classes of the militia are
(1) the organized militia, which consists of the National Guard and the Naval Militia; and
(2) the unorganized militia, which consists of the members of the militia who are not members of the National Guard or the Naval Militia.
Title 50 USC Sec. 453. Registration (Selective Service)
(a)...it shall be the duty of every male CITIZEN of the United States, and every other male person RESIDING in the United States, who, on the day or days fixed for the first or any subsequent registration, is between the ages of eighteen and twenty-six, to present himself for and submit to registration at such time or times and place or places, and in such manner, as shall be determined by proclamation of the President and by rules and regulations prescribed hereunder.
Art. 1, Sec. 8, USCON (1789)
Congress shall have power ... To provide for calling forth the militia to execute the laws of the union, suppress insurrections and repel invasions;
Articles of Confederation, VI. (1777)
...every State shall always keep up a well-regulated and disciplined militia, sufficiently armed and accoutered, and shall provide and constantly have ready for use, in public stores, a due number of field pieces and tents, and a proper quantity of arms, ammunition and camp equipage.
PENNSYLVANIA GENERAL ASSEMBLY
TITLE 51, PART II, CHAPTER 3
THE MILITIA
Sec. 301. Formation.
Enactment. Chapter 3 was added August 1, 1975, P.L.233, No.92, effective January 1, 1976.
§ 301. Formation.
(a) Pennsylvania militia.--The militia of this Commonwealth shall consist of:
(1) all ABLE-BODIED CITIZENS of the United States and all other able-bodied persons who have declared their intention to become citizens of the United States, residing within this Commonwealth, who are at least 17 years six months of age and, except as hereinafter provided, not more than 55 years of age;
(Note: PA militia obligation is longer than the Federal: 17-55 versus 17-45!)
“The great draft riot in New York City in July 1863 involved Irish immigrants who had been signed up as citizens to swell the vote of the city's Democratic political machine, not realizing it made them liable for the draft.”
...
The Supreme Court has held, in Butler v. Perry, 240 U.S. 328 (1916), that the Thirteenth Amendment does not prohibit "enforcement of those duties which individuals owe to the state, such as services in the army, MILITIA, on the jury, etc." In Selective Draft Law Cases, 245 U.S. 366 (1918), the Supreme Court ruled that the military draft was not "involuntary servitude".
If not involuntary servitude banned by the 13th amendment, it must be VOLUNTARY SERVITUDE.
Okay - the militiamen VOLUNTEERED to be so regulated.
No problem.
All male CITIZENS, are liable for militia duty - a surrender of one’s right to life and liberty! Citizenship was and is voluntary in the united States of America.
In the USA, volunteering to be a citizen is consenting to be governed, which waives endowed rights in exchange for government privileges that come with mandatory civic duties... just like the FOUNDERS who pledged their lives, their fortunes, and their sacred honor.
HOWEVER, the people (who did not consent) do retain the Creator endowed right to life and to bear arms in defense thereof. That's ALL PEOPLE, not just the militia.
And PRIOR RESTRAINT is unconstitutional (unless consent was granted). So no funny business with mental health screenings, etc. All government can do is prosecute AFTER THE ACT. If government is so incompetent to prosecute, get new servants, not new laws.
Last edited by jetgraphics; 08-09-2018 at 10:53 PM..
Very little
Original
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed.
My version
A well regulated militia being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the non felon and sound of mind people to keep and bear small arms shall not be infringed.
IE non criminals and crazy and no, you cannot have a cannon.
Note the original amendment was meant to arm state militias as a counterweight against a federal army. I find it funny that many 2nd amendment protagonists just love a large federal army.
I'm with this. It should be clarified to exclude felons, former felons and the mentally ill.
Not sure how I would word it, but it would help today if it clarified what "arms" one can bear without having the government infringe.
Of course, some people think it obviously means guns, but it doesn't. It says what it means, arms. That right has been infringed and nobody in their right mind would want all arms open for individual ownership. There are at least a few hundred Americans that could actually afford their own nukes. Not to mention ballistic missiles, anti-aircraft weapons, etc.
If you believe the 2nd amendment should not be infringed, you should be lobbying for people's right to buy nukes and weapons of warfare, not just Glocks and Winchesters.
Ummm no, nuclear weapons are STRATEGIC weapons meant to be deployed against enemies abroad and more in a deterant role. The Militia does not deploy overseas either independently or in cadre to the regular military. An argument could be made for AA/AAA or conventional artillery firing projectile ammunition ....I guess. Militia weaponry is more traditionally small arms though. Squad up stuff. Militia are more small unit/intelligence gathering and line probing and ambush operations. Harrassment and interdiction. Militia can also operate domestically with regular military in case of invasion and can also form up to defend against violent criminal enterprise in defense of the community. Ask the James brothers about that.
To add to my previous post if the Mongols, MS13, et al were to roll into your town causing chaos and perpetuating violence a community militia could and should form and stomp a mud hole in them. That is NOT "vigilante" action. It is community defense. Militia territory.
Ummm no, nuclear weapons are STRATEGIC weapons meant to be deployed against enemies abroad and more in a deterant role. The Militia does not deploy overseas either independently or in cadre to the regular military. An argument could be made for AA/AAA or conventional artillery firing projectile ammunition ....I guess. Militia weaponry is more traditionally small arms though. Squad up stuff. Militia are more small unit/intelligence gathering and line probing and ambush operations. Harrassment and interdiction. Militia can also operate domestically with regular military in case of invasion and can also form up to defend against violent criminal enterprise in defense of the community. Ask the James brothers about that.
Artillery back then was cannons and howitzers.
Today... the same just a modern version opposed to jamming pounds of powder and shot down the muzzle... At 60k per shot though, it wouldn't be cost prohibitive for most. But we would have mortars though.
I could see quad 50s in old deuce and a halfs for AA but anti aircraft missiles? Again cost prohibitive. You'd need the radar to go with it. Unless it was a conglomerate effort where you would collect the funding locally to cover the cost of missiles and radar tower.
Mil surp tanks aren't all that expensive when you think about it. There's a former soviet nation selling tanks for 60k a piece, APCs for 40k a piece. Can scoop up duece and a half and 5 tons for less than 10k. Humvees too.
Shame they won't sell our surplus back to us. Just drag it out to a field and shoot it up for target practice then smelt it all down to make new...
I'd love to buy an old huey chopper, or a cobra, a tank and the navy Seals jet boat. The Mark V the Seal museum not far from me has one. These would make awesome fishing boats.
The seats are comfortable! And they're air ride/suspension seats so you can jump waves forget a Fountain, these boats are built to take a knockin and keep on rockin.
I'd change it. Not sure how at the moment but it definitely needs an update.
There are so many I'd love to rewrite! Our IQ has nearly doubled since it was written and our population has exploded. Things change and the laws of this country should be reflecting that.
The constitution is not the bible. Our laws should be amended to reflect our changing times, that's a given.
First off, I am not against people having the right to defend themselves, so your contention that I am some left wing yahoo who wants weapons taken away from the public is absolutely false.
What I am saying is, one must look at the context of the time in which the 2nd was written and adopted.
We had just ended a bloody war, for independence, and had to assure that we had a suitable well armed, and regulated militia, made up of the same average citizens that fought for out independence.
These "people" that are to be any militia, would be guaranteed their right to always have arms, unimpeded by any government, be it state, or federal.
I believe that was the TRUE meaning of the 2nd amendment.
The federalist papers were never law, but ideas set aside as opinions by those who wrote them, or contributed to them.
Many of the opinions(not all) in the federalist papers did in fact serve as a conduit for the actual wording of the constitution, but, once again, the views expressed in those papers, are opinions at the time.
Looking back to that time in history, it is only natural that the founders wanted to assure the country was well protected against any future invasion, be it British, or otherwise.
The most logical step was to assure that the country have a well regulated militia, and also assure that their right to bear arms would never be infringed.
If you, or anyone can state in plain language if that were not the case, then why were the words"a well regulated militia" put into the amendment?
Why did it not state, "the citizens of the United States have the right to bear arms, and that shall not be infringed, if that is what they meant?
I strongly suggest, given that time period, the founders were speaking of a well regulated militia, made up of ordinary citizens.
They wanted to guarantee that the militia would always be armed should the need arise for them to be.
In other words, another invasion.
For far to many years, this amendment has been the source of the wrong interpretation by many.
Most believe that the word"people", meant the entire population, when in fact it meant the well regulated militia only.
Bob.
I've covered this elsewhere, but maybe you missed it. The 2nd Amendment is technically unnecessary anyway. The 4th Amendment guarantees that you are free from searches and seizures except via due process of law. That would indicate that you have the right to own any property you choose, which would include guns. The Second Amendment is really just reinforcing this idea, least a government come along and try to argue that the Fourth didn't really mean to include guns.
Now, as to why the explanatory clause is there? It's there to explain why the founders believed that a special amendment is needed ONLY for guns, and not for other property, such as houses, carriages, horses, cattle, etc. It is only guns that are needed in order to have a well-regulated militia and that well-regulated militia in necessary to preserve freedom. It is not necessary to have carriages, horses, and so on.
Why is a well-regulated militia needed. I would suggest that it was NOT really outside invaders that the founders had in mind. In fact, the Preamble contains the language that the government "provide for the common defense". That suggests that protection from invasion was intended to be a function of the new Federal government, not the militia. As you correctly pointed out, though, the bloody revolutionary war was fresh in their minds when they wrote this. What was that war about? It was about fighting against an established government that was acting in tyrannical fashion (at least in their opinion) and against the best interests of its people. What would stop the NEW government from doing the same in the future? Well, the well-regulated militia, of course! The militia, by which they meant the people at large, needed to be armed to keep the government in line. That's the real reason for the Second Amendment. Without that reason, there would be no Second Amendment and gun rights would simply follow from the Fourth, just like all other property rights do.
I'd change it. Not sure how at the moment but it definitely needs an update.
There are so many I'd love to rewrite! Our IQ has nearly doubled since it was written and our population has exploded. Things change and the laws of this country should be reflecting that.
The constitution is not the bible. Our laws should be amended to reflect our changing times, that's a given.
The Constitution is indeed the bible. From its conception its been established as the law of the land. All public officials take an oath and are sworn to uphold it as it is written. There's a big difference between individual civil liberties as spelled out in the first 10 Amendments to the Bill of Rights and laws that are passed. Any law that is passed that violates any of those rights is unconstitutional and should never have been passed in the first place. Many of those types of laws have already been deemed unconstitutional. Others are waiting in the docket. If the Constitution could be changed so easily we may as well have no civil rights at all and the Constitution would be nothing more than a historical piece of paper. The Constitution's purpose was to insure all of our individual civil liberties from a tyrannical and abusive form of government.
Don't forget that there are two sides to this. Who gets to decide? My side or yours? That's why this nation was founded as a Constitutional Republic and not a Democracy so all off our civil liberties remain intact no matter which side has the majority. You better be careful for what you wish for as the political pendulum swings back and forth. Then you will find that your side will be on the s**t end of the stick.
There is a legal process to amend the Constitution, which is different than just passing another law:
Quote:
Article V of the Constitution itself establishes the two ways in which it may be amended:
Amending the Constitution was never meant to be simple. While thousands have been discussed since the original document was approved in 1788, there are now only 27 amendments in the Constitution. While its Framers knew the Constitution would have to be amended, they also knew it should never be amended frivolously or haphazardly. Clearly, their process for amending the Constitution has succeeded in meeting that goal.
"The Congress, whenever two thirds of both Houses shall deem it necessary, shall propose Amendments to this Constitution, or, on the Application of the Legislatures of two thirds of the several States, shall call a Convention for proposing Amendments, which, in either Case, shall be valid to all Intents and Purposes, as Part of this Constitution, when ratified by the Legislatures of three fourths of the several States, or by Conventions in three fourths thereof, as the one or the other Mode of Ratification may be proposed by the Congress; Provided that no Amendment which may be made prior to the Year One thousand eight hundred and eight shall in any Manner affect the first and fourth Clauses in the Ninth Section of the first Article; and that no State, without its Consent, shall be deprived of its equal Suffrage in the Senate."---https://www.thoughtco.com/how-to-amend-the-constitution-3368310
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Artillery back then was cannons and howitzers. 
the Seal museum not far from me has one.
