Quote:
Originally Posted by gladhands
There literally is no private property without the theft of a public resource, or the purchase of a stolen resource.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gladhands
It’s really quite simple; no one created the land, water, stones or ores. Any ownership thereof is the product of theft.
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The fact that no one created those things is proof no theft occurred.
Your claim those are "public" resources fails miserably.
Which "public?"
The United States? Because that smacks of ethnocentrism. There's no distinction between the US as one actor among 195 actors, and one person among 320 Million, or even 6.7 Billion.
Are you arguing for one world government? You must be, because if, as you claim, resources are "public" then they're globally public, not locally.
Quote:
Originally Posted by turkey-head
Do you own land in the United States?
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I don't own land in the US, but I do own land in Romania.
To whom should I give it back?
Quote:
Originally Posted by turkey-head
Or have you given it back to the Native Americans from whom it was stolen?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kevinm
The original natives had no concept of "ownership of land", so we had a culture clash.
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Uh, no, some tribal groups in the Americas did have a concept of land ownership.
Ever wonder why there are tribal groups still living in the New England States, including New York, that were never forcibly removed to reservations?
Customary Laws are laws agreed upon by various States, even when no formal written treaty exists.
The Customary Law of the Sea is an excellent example. Every sea-faring State abided by the Customary Law of the Sea, even though no formal written agreement existed until the 1950s, when Great Britain wrote the text of UNCLOS I -- the United Nations Customary Law of the Sea.
There was a Customary Law of Land, too.
Land that was developed was considered to be owned, even when no formal documentation existed.
Undeveloped land was free for the taking.
Land was considered developed, if it had permanent housing, roads, wells, property markers or boundary markers.
Tribal groups in the New England States had stone houses, community wells, roads, and there were boundary markers separating tribes, and also boundary markers between land held by individual tribe members.
So, yes, some Native American tribal groups recognized individual property rights, even though they didn't write up property deeds and store them at their county court house.
While the French and British governments recognized the Customary Law of the Land, the US government did not, so it forcibly removed other land owning tribes, like the Miami, Shawnee and Pawnee from areas in Ohio and Indiana to reservations in the Plains States.
As you moved further west and south in the US, tribal groups were semi-nomadic, and then in the middle of the US, those tribes were wholly nomadic, until you got to the western US, where you had tribes like the Hopi, Navajo, Zuni and others living in permanent dwellings.
Taking land from the Cherokee, Creek, Seminole, Choctaw, Chickasaw, Miami, Pawnee and Shawnee was wrong, and in violation of the Customary Law of the Land, but taking land from the semi-nomadic and nomadic tribes who inhabited the area west of the Mississippi River to the Rocky Mountains was perfectly acceptable and within the limits of the Law.
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