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Status:
"“If a thing loves, it is infinite.”"
(set 2 days ago)
Location: Great Britain
27,178 posts, read 13,461,836 times
Reputation: 19482
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Quote:
Originally Posted by English Dave
That was me who started the thread you mention. Ironically, I discovered a few weeks ago I have cancer of the bladder. After the diagnosis just over two weeks ago, I quickly moved to cat scans, which showed the tumour was confined to my bladder.
I had an operation yesterday to remove it, and am now awaiting results of tests on another patch of 'irregularities' they found on my bladder wall. It could be something, or nothing. I will find out in two weeks.
At times like these, seeing the NHS close up, I cannot express my gratitude enough to the doctors and nurses, and how they have looked after me in my time of need.
I know many Americans are against universal healthcare on principle. I myself have always spoken up for it, and am glad it is there for all the citizens of my country. All I have to worry about is getting well, and not medical bills.
America, and Americans must decide for themselves what they want from their health care. I myself believe all citizens should be cared for. Yes, taxes have to be paid, nothing is free in this life. But this is the way we have done things here since 1948. Nobody argues we should do things in a different manner. Whoever is in government understands the NHS is the best bang for the buck health care wise.
I have read through this thread from the beginning. There is certainly some cruel, hard hearted people in the world, and that's for sure. Lets hope they remain in good health. If not, they may sing a different tune.
Wishing you a speedy recovery Dave and hope everything is okay in relation to other tests.
Great post about the NHS though, and what it means to people.
That was me who started the thread you mention. Ironically, I discovered a few weeks ago I have cancer of the bladder. After the diagnosis just over two weeks ago, I quickly moved to cat scans, which showed the tumour was confined to my bladder.
I had an operation yesterday to remove it, and am now awaiting results of tests on another patch of 'irregularities' they found on my bladder wall. It could be something, or nothing. I will find out in two weeks.
At times like these, seeing the NHS close up, I cannot express my gratitude enough to the doctors and nurses, and how they have looked after me in my time of need.
I know many Americans are against universal healthcare on principle. I myself have always spoken up for it, and am glad it is there for all the citizens of my country. All I have to worry about is getting well, and not medical bills.
America, and Americans must decide for themselves what they want from their health care. I myself believe all citizens should be cared for. Yes, taxes have to be paid, nothing is free in this life. But this is the way we have done things here since 1948. Nobody argues we should do things in a different manner. Whoever is in government understands the NHS is the best bang for the buck health care wise.
I have read through this thread from the beginning. There is certainly some cruel, hard hearted people in the world, and that's for sure. Lets hope they remain in good health. If not, they may sing a different tune.
It's good to see you back, and feeling well enough to post. I hope it turns out to be nothing.
As much as I would like to sit down and share a drink with you and meet the trouble, I am glad, for now, that you are there and not here. I also hope some of the critics will listen to you when you speak of how the NHS has worked for you.
Be well, friend. Hugs to both of you from across the pond.
English Dave? first off prayers to you with your health situation and hope all of the best for you sir.
I have a family member who is undergoing a cancer diagnosis right now and thankfully Medicaid & Medicare will take care of her bills.
This is stressful enough so I can't even imagine how some people here in the US are opposed to Universal Healthcare.
The stupidity of some Americans is amazing at times.
Yeah, because anyone who dare disagree with your politics must be stupid.
I had insurance through work, too. One day I worked 14 hours, much of it on my feet. When I got home that night, I realized I had rubbed a cyst on my big toe. The cyst became infected and the toe had to be amputated. I went into the hospital and, since I had insurance through my work and since I wasn't working, I lost the insurance.
The infection spread. I became septic and over the course of multiple operations, I am now a RBKA, right leg below knee amputee. I'm on disability while my leg situation is straightened out as I have also lost two toes on my remaining foot. So tell me again how I should find a job with health insurance. I'm not an unusual story. There are many of us out here that would love to hear your thoughts on how we're supposed to find jobs with our situations.
What you missed is “as much as possible “. My wife had a severe stroke last year, the head neurologist stated she would never come out of her vegetative state, and will never work again and I will pretty much have to work till she turns 63.5 then take COBRA.
If something serious happens to me in the next five years we are screwed.
Her stroke was brought on by sepsis. Nasty infection.
Yeah, because anyone who dare disagree with your politics must be stupid.
Stupid may be a tad harsh but I think ignorant or stubborn is a better description. Despite evidence that other countries are in fact better than America at some things they continue to defend a substandard system.
Stupid may be a tad harsh but I think ignorant or stubborn is a better description. Despite evidence that other countries are in fact better than America at some things they continue to defend a substandard system.
Ill grant you that its definitely harsh. My biggest issues are that there are literally no instances where someone can tell you exactly what all of these services and products are going to cost the end consumer or the insurance provider, and government tinkering. There is so much being "fluffed" into the billing that its impossible to understand the real cost, and we need to be able to give the entire industry a more free market model.
The most damaging examples of government intervention ruining things are the biggest issues we face in modern times. Education, Health Care, and Housing. The government feels the need to completely manipulate these areas to pick winners, to try and "fix" things, and its all been backfiring magnificently, and those who aren't paying attention don't even realize that "more government" has been the beginning of the end in these areas, yet they are calling for more of it. And on top of calling for more of it, they proclaim "look what the free market did, its killing us" when in reality its not even close to a free market in those areas. Misinformed people listening to the rants of politicians trying to scare them into voting for them.
Last edited by t206; 08-19-2018 at 11:04 AM..
Reason: grand/grant typo
Ill grand you that its definitely harsh. My biggest issues are that there are literally no instances where someone can tell you exactly what all of these services and products are going to cost the end consumer or the insurance provider, and government tinkering. There is so much being "fluffed" into the billing that its impossible to understand the real cost, and we need to be able to give the entire industry a more free market model.
In many cases you can get a price. In many cases you can bargain that price down. But this mainly applies to more simple and predictable medical encounters. The real problem is when you have a more complex and uncertain encounter. Like an emergent hospital admission for a stoke or heart attack. Because at the start predicting outcomes and cost are quite difficult.
It would be easy to give a price for a routine colonoscopy or gall bladder removal in a relatively young and healthy patient. But what if they are a senior already with multiple diseases, conditions and medical risks? Even with the appropriate pre-op medical specialty clearances, they still could encounter serious complications and much added cost during the hospital stay, or after, not easily predicted or priced out.
How much do you charge for diabetes or hypertension? That answer is going to be very broad, based on the individual patient and their doc.
How much do you charge for cancer or a transplant? Two very variable, complicated and risky medical endeavors.
This is why we have HC insurance. Among other great things is to get the financial security. You have your premiums, co-pays and deductibles to worry about. Let the third parties work out the deals with the provider and other medical entities.
Hospital prices, unbundling and padding happens every day. i.e. the $100 Tylenol. But prices and billings are not what we pay. They are not what your insurance pays. Sure it would be nice to clear up all this muddy water. But it won't happen unless we go to single payer. Because right now the medical powers that be want the waters to stay muddied. They gain more as a result. And that is the arcane nature of medical billing as it applies to insurance carriers and hospitals of today.
As an example my wife's medical bills after our 1/1/17 highway head on crash was on the order of $1.3M. Her BXBS Obamacare policy paid out between $200k and $300K. Her medical bill print out was longer than a CVS receipt! But the vast majority of these charges were not themselves paid. Instead a larger predetermined price was paid based on diagnosis and necessary procedures/drugs/treatments.
In many cases you can get a price. In many cases you can bargain that price down. But this mainly applies to more simple and predictable medical encounters. The real problem is when you have a more complex and uncertain encounter. Like an emergent hospital admission for a stoke or heart attack. Because at the start predicting outcomes and cost are quite difficult.
It would be easy to give a price for a routine colonoscopy or gall bladder removal in a relatively young and healthy patient. But what if they are a senior already with multiple diseases, conditions and medical risks? Even with the appropriate pre-op medical specialty clearances, they still could encounter serious complications and much added cost during the hospital stay, or after, not easily predicted or priced out.
How much do you charge for diabetes or hypertension? That answer is going to be very broad, based on the individual patient and their doc.
How much do you charge for cancer or a transplant? Two very variable, complicated and risky medical endeavors.
This is why we have HC insurance. Among other great things is to get the financial security. You have your premiums, co-pays and deductibles to worry about. Let the third parties work out the deals with the provider and other medical entities.
Hospital prices, unbundling and padding happens every day. i.e. the $100 Tylenol. But prices and billings are not what we pay. They are not what your insurance pays. Sure it would be nice to clear up all this muddy water. But it won't happen unless we go to single payer. Because right now the medical powers that be want the waters to stay muddied. They gain more as a result. And that is the arcane nature of medical billing as it applies to insurance carriers and hospitals of today.
As an example my wife's medical bills after our 1/1/17 highway head on crash was on the order of $1.3M. Her BXBS Obamacare policy paid out between $200k and $300K. Her medical bill print out was longer than a CVS receipt! But the vast majority of these charges were not themselves paid. Instead a larger predetermined price was paid based on diagnosis and necessary procedures/drugs/treatments.
I appreciate and understand the examples, and I'll be honest, I don't have the answer, but there are smarter minds than mine that are capable of figuring out a much more transparent pricing model. We have some incredibly brilliant people who have solved much harder business problems than how much to charge for complex services, I just think the problem is that there is zero incentive to even try and figure it out when you can just slap some text that says "other" or "administrative" on an invoice and drop a $10,000 charge against it that you know nobody is going to question. Its kind of insane. I once had a $14K "other" charge on a simple outpatient procedure. I ended up paying a total of $50 for the entire visit, but if that money was being charged to me I'd have been up in arms and figured out what it was for and probably not pay it.
I appreciate and understand the examples, and I'll be honest, I don't have the answer, but there are smarter minds than mine that are capable of figuring out a much more transparent pricing model. We have some incredibly brilliant people who have solved much harder business problems than how much to charge for complex services, I just think the problem is that there is zero incentive to even try and figure it out when you can just slap some text that says "other" or "administrative" on an invoice and drop a $10,000 charge against it that you know nobody is going to question. Its kind of insane. I once had a $14K "other" charge on a simple outpatient procedure. I ended up paying a total of $50 for the entire visit, but if that money was being charged to me I'd have been up in arms and figured out what it was for and probably not pay it.
Hospitals are always in a state of clawing for all they can get with reimbursements. They have to to stay in business, as they really do give away a lot of free service. So what they persistently do is show all the 'losses' and 'write offs' to those that will or have to listen. Like Insurance companies, local, state and federal HC funding agencies and such. Bidness is bidness. And by keeping the numbers so complicated, secretive and non-transparent, it all works to their advantage.
Hospitals are always in a state of clawing for all they can get with reimbursements. They have to to stay in business, as they really do give away a lot of free service. So what they persistently do is show all the 'losses' and 'write offs' to those that will or have to listen. Like Insurance companies, local, state and federal HC funding agencies and such. Bidness is bidness. And by keeping the numbers so complicated, secretive and non-transparent, it all works to their advantage.
Seems like we all agree on that part, yet very few will acknowledge that its a huge part of the overall problem. My biggest issue is that it will only get worse if we go down the path of having even more government involvement. Its like doing business with the mafia. Pay what they say, and do NOT ask questions.
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