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If we abolished those completely and started fresh
How do you propose to do that? Outlaw them? I would love to see more than two viable parties, but you can't just "abolish" one because you don't like it.
Should we simply abolish the two party system we currently have and start fresh with new multiple political parties?
- Social Democrats
- Green party
- Liberal party
- Christian (right) party
- Conservative party
- ?
Similar to other Western countries. This is much better and will also stop the fight basically between republicans and democrats, and basically more choices for the people.
There are more than 2 parties.
Politics and the power of money, only recognize 2.
It is the reason Ron Paul learned he would get nowhere near what he did in 2012, as an independent, as he had run as before. Ron Paul, was the Bernie of the Republican party. He really won the primaries, but the fix was in. We all saw it. What Hillary did to Bernie with her clout, Romney did to Ron Paul.
It is the RNC and the DNC, that are the pickers and choosers of the puppet for the CIA.
Should we simply abolish the two party system we currently have and start fresh with new multiple political parties?
- Social Democrats
- Green party
- Liberal party
- Christian (right) party
- Conservative party
- ?
Similar to other Western countries. This is much better and will also stop the fight basically between republicans and democrats, and basically more choices for the people.
This is really a "grass is always greener" thing. It leads us to exactly the same place we are, if not worse.
Because no party can take a majority in a multi-party system, that means a coalition must be formed. Which can then completely reject the will of the voters.
Take Germany as an example. Their center-left (SPD) and center-right (CDU) parties are in a coalition, and nobody is happy with the arrangement. It would be as if the Democrats and Republicans were ruling as a coalition, with the Greens on the left, and the Libertarians on the right. Voters strongly denounced this coalition in last year's elections, and both the SPD and CDU lost seats. Angela Merkel was thoroughly rejected by the voters.
But neither party wanted to give up power, so they formed another coalition and Angela Merkel is still Chancellor despite being rejected by voters. German voters will be increasingly frustrated that even when they vote for change, they can't get it, and they'll turn to increasingly extremist parties in order to get change (which we are kind of seeing here, but not to the same extent as Europe.)
The point is... no system is perfect. The two-party system sure isn't. But the multi-party system also has its faults. Plus, "abolishing" it is not as easy as it sounds and would require constitutional amendment(s) which is all but impossible.
Teddy Roosevelt ran on the Bull Moose party ticket over a century ago.
Changing the Electoral College would require amending the constitution, NO chance.
The Conservative Party still exists in NY, as do other minor parties.
NY has Electoral Fusion -- to my knowledge, no other state has it. That means Donald Trump can run on both the Republican and Conservative lines, and Hillary Clinton can run on both the Democratic and Working Families lines, and the votes they get on both are combined for their total vote count.
But NY is perhaps the most voter suppressive state in the nation. Let's not hold it up as a beacon of democracy.
Should we simply abolish the two party system we currently have and start fresh with new multiple political parties?
- Social Democrats
- Green party
- Liberal party
- Christian (right) party
- Conservative party
- ?
Similar to other Western countries. This is much better and will also stop the fight basically between republicans and democrats, and basically more choices for the people.
1 we are NOT a two party system, just because two main parties happen to have their way most times does not make it that system
2. actually there are over 12 parties, at least here in NY....
personally I would like for them to stand up all 12 parties full time in EVERY state like they are here in NY
the problem is the parties have melded/blended
so with in the republican party here in NY, you have the conservatives, the tea's, the RTL's, etc...all slightly different from the more moderate republicans
although nationally its only 2 MAJOR parties, we have been multiple parties for a few decades now
the other or sub parties too
there are already at least 12 parties out there
the republican party
the conservative party
the democratic party
the liberal party
the socialist party
the communist party
the right to life party
the green party
the workers party
the tea party
the liberty party
the libertarian party
not counting a true Independent party which would be 13
the problem is the parties BLEND in many cases
for example in 2008: here in NY , Obama was the green candidate .. the socialist candidate.. the democrat candidate.. and the liberal candidate.....
McCain had the republican, conservative, RTL and workers party
so as you can see...two candidates but 8 parties between the two
1 we are NOT a two party system, just because two main parties happen to have their way most times does not make it that system
2. actually there are over 12 parties, at least here in NY....
personally I would like for them to stand up all 12 parties full time in EVERY state like they are here in NY
the problem is the parties have melded/blended
so with in the republican party here in NY, you have the conservatives, the tea's, the RTL's, etc...all slightly different from the more moderate republicans
although nationally its only 2 MAJOR parties, we have been multiple parties for a few decades now
the other or sub parties too
there are already at least 12 parties out there
the republican party
the conservative party
the democratic party
the liberal party
the socialist party
the communist party
the right to life party
the green party
the workers party
the tea party
the liberty party
the libertarian party
not counting a true Independent party which would be 13
the problem is the parties BLEND in many cases
for example in 2008: here in NY , Obama was the green candidate .. the socialist candidate.. the democrat candidate.. and the liberal candidate.....
McCain had the republican, conservative, RTL and workers party
so as you can see...two candidates but 8 parties between the two
The reason they blend is that they can't get their message out. The media pretty much only covers the two parties, and the two parties collude to keep third parties out of debates. If you want to find out about the policies of a third party, you have to go search for it. If you want to find our about the two main parties, well, it is spoon fed to you in every major media outlet.
Do the parties exist? Sure. Do they have a real voice or real access? No.
I think like 70%+ of voters polled said they were not satisfied with either candidate. Their dissatisfaction was not worth them even going and seeking out the message of the third parties though. I think that would be 100% different if at least one or two other third parties were allowed in the debates. The two main parties think this as well which is why both parties collude to keep them out.
The problem is Dems and Reps have put measures in place that a third party simply can't get a foot in the door whatsoever. Pretty much the only thing with full stone-clad bipartisan support. With quotas and percents a party must reach to even run, which to no surprise are out of reach for any grassroots party to even think about, the outlook is dismal on the federal level.
A quick and obvious solution to this is to allow the highest supported third party, despite quotas and percents, to run with and debate televised the other two "big ones" AND automatically be on the ballot in all 50 states. That would be the first step. Afterwards maybe extend it to the top five.
Precisely. The D's and R's collude to keep 3rd party candidates out by making it virtually impossible to get on the ballot in all 50 states without a massive, built-in ground team, that only the corporate sponsored D's and R's have at their disposal. They also made it impossible to get in the game without hundreds of millions of dollars, which ensures nearly all candidates are compromised by the corporations. Then you have the collusion of the corporate, MSM, political arms of the two major parties. The debates, usually hosted by said MSM giants, and where most Americans form opinions of the candidates, won't let 3rd party candidates participate unless they have 10% or more in the polls. That allows CNN/Fox/NBC et al. to set the narrative, keep out pesky upstarts & ensure the corporate sponsored candidates can stick to their scripted answers. Then there's the question of how a candidate gets to 10% in corporate polls, which are often fake or intentionally cooked for political purposes.
The idea that 3rd party candidates have a fair shake, is nothing more than the illusion of choice.
Should we simply abolish the two party system we currently have and start fresh with new multiple political parties?
- Social Democrats
- Green party
- Liberal party
- Christian (right) party
- Conservative party
- ?
Similar to other Western countries. This is much better and will also stop the fight basically between republicans and democrats, and basically more choices for the people.
If you CAN'T get 2 PARTIES to agree on much of anything, how do you expect MULTIPLE groups to agree and get the majority votes to get things passed?
ESPECIALLY in the Senate when may things require a 60 VOTE MAJORITY.
I don't think your idea has much chance of getting ANYTHING done. It would be MUCH worse then it is now.
Should we simply abolish the two party system we currently have and start fresh with new multiple political parties?
- Social Democrats
- Green party
- Liberal party
- Christian (right) party
- Conservative party
- ?
Similar to other Western countries. This is much better and will also stop the fight basically between republicans and democrats, and basically more choices for the people.
The Christian Right Party will have to give up their Christian claim of Religious Tax Exemption.
So, the question is, if people have such disdain for the Muslim Religion influencing Government in Muslim Populated lands, why would anyone what to have a Christian Religion Influencing Government in America?
We already state the fact "In God We Trust", and "God Bless America", because "God" as referenced is the God of All without a favored discernment about a particular Religion, that's why we have "Freedom of Religion" in America.
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What needs to be removed from Political Party Agenda is "Confederate Ideology".... And "Antebellum Race/Class Divisiveness". It has infected and tarnished this nation for 100's of years.
Every aspect of the Perversion of Democracy, was done by the 100's of years of perverting the Constitution, perverting Our System of Political Discourse and the Vile Contortions of Our Justice System, which was done to institute Slavery, and this was perversions meant to sustain it over Centuries. That is what has made America's problems which has continually insulted the very premise and principles of Democracy.
[color="DarkRed"]"Racism's Madness", drive in core by and for the "Lust of Money at the Expense of Adopting Policies and Practices of Inhumanity"
.... and weaving it into the interpretations of Political Policy and interjecting it into the Practices of the Laws, while spreading in the social and civic arena, to disenfranchise people who are non white.
We don't need any new political parties, what we need is a more "educated society", educated in the civics of what is Democracy and how Democracy works in a Republic Form of Administering our Governance System.
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When America awakens to accept the vast mass of Mis Education, by the centuries of promoting white nationalism, and seeking to promote and sustain white dominance, then it too will understand how and why so many are uneducated who rode on the spread of such things by the Mis-Educated, who wrote books, pushed policy and promoted civic discord toward and unto and did all it could to promote contentions among American people, while using the influences of wealth and power to disenfranchise, women, non whites and to keep low the economic means as well of the poor whites. As a tool, to promote ongoing tensions... while the wealthy Amass and consolidate power over the political process and ultimately over the people.
People follow what they are taught and what is give to them by the wealthy and the powerful who have long dominated the political arena.
Only in THIS DAY AND TIME, technology have given the masses a tool of "information", in ways that society never had so widespread in the past, where "every person" can research, investigate the past and review the past policies and how they came into being. People can look back and history and find information on every aspect of how racial divisiveness was interjected that led to slavery, as well as how it was processed over the multiple centuries of slavery, through the many "contorted delusions that were taught to the American masses for the 100 yrs of segregation".
The young today, and some of the older now, embrace that research, they seek out the real truths that led to the mass divisiveness that is being promoted today. The young especially are rejecting the vile of such a malice promoted system of inequity and divisiveness, both by race and gender, with inequity promoted as well based on ethnicity and place of origin.
There has always been a segment of society who embraced Multi-cultural society, but the wealthy and power have fought that by the use of political discourse on every front. People, especially the young, "reject" that cycle of madness, and people are far more aware of the agenda by the wealthy who dominate and control power and political process, are awakened to the system of "indenturing" that is with the make up of the core of such a motivated perversion against and upon Democracy.
People are becoming aware that Democracy is "for all", not a separate form of Democracy for the Wealthy and Powerful.
We are facing a time in TODAY, where the Wheels of Justice is facing "the Justments of Justice" to be applied equally, to the Wealthy and Monetary Powerful, as equal as it is to be applied to "every man"... in society.
(That is the battle we are witnessing with the Trump debacle, who is seeking exemptions of every sort from justice, because of being wealthy and monetarily powerful). It will reshape the powers of the Presidency, where "Non is Above Justice" while in Office or Out of Office of the Highest Governance Position in this nation.
This is what it looks like for that change to come about!!!! It was never going to be pretty, becausepeople don't relinquish power over people and influence in society willingly !!!!
We are living in the time of transition, we saw it take place in the mid 1960's, and what followed was a span of 54 yrs of "exporting the jobs away" to ensure that economic parity would not be easily won by the people, not for women, not for minorities and not for poor whites. But that too... has ran its course!!! The affected includes women, minorities and poor whites. The political contention struggles to try and separate the poor whites as if they are victims of women and minorities, but time and circumstance and the evolution of events, will awaken the poor whites, as to how they have been used like pawns in a game that has left them equally as disenfranchised.
Its played out through their religion, because all the history of America racism was conducted in the pews of the white evangelicals for centuries, therefore, they have to face the change in their religious ideal, which is a challenge for any society of people, to find their way back to the principles of God's truth, without the wrangling of racism, driven by political influential agenda to promote societal discord of divisiveness.
They stand now face to face, with "the big questions of "morality"... in what they now support of Trump and Republican Agenda, VS... the humane dignity and respectful honor of God's truth that All Mankind is Made Equal in Gods Creation. It upsets every tenet that has been taught for centuries in the white nationalist and white dominance agenda in how it influenced the population, which was instituted to seek to justify slavery and segregation.
The young are many who long departed from the churches of the Evangelical teaching, as they rejected the racism and the race divisions and the race bigotry, they found so prevalent. They will only return when the Evangelical system changes its tenet's and respect the true premise of Gods Truth for ALL MANKIND.
They chose to seek out "information", to research, and to study other cultures and broad history of multi ethnic people, and what they are finding, does not favor the history of evangelical teaching over the past centuries. They are seeing the same in the system of Catholicism.
Some of the young among the black society strayed from the various denomination of Churchs, which once kept the people in toned containment to avoid the violence that would be enacted upon and against them, now, they want a church that teaches that God has made a world where anything and everything is available to all. The ways of the indoctrination during slavery when American black churches was established, was to teach that, "everything was not available, and that one can only have Gods gifts in the afterlife", and they now see that God made a world that all things are made for All people within their living. They continually make their way "back to churches, but with a determination to change the ways religion is administered. Not in the ways of the past, where self denial of Gods great attributes are denied, but in a Church that teaches that all such things of Gods creation are equally and rightfully available to "all". This changes the ideals in the young black mind away from the teaching of things being denied by their race and ethnicity, but to one where the embrace of Gods gifts in their lives makes all things available unto their desires, aims and grasp through their efforts and works to achieve and have what is available within the world. (This is a transformation taking place in young black society in this day and time, and they hold fast to the principles of living to honor God in premise and principles.
The principles taught in the black churches have never abandoned the principles that Gods glory is to live with a good heart and compassionate soul toward others. (we saw that in the forgiveness people stood for when the shooter killed people in the black church). the street crime in black society will find its point of turn, as much is the outgrowth of economic impoverishment and the cycles of contention that is prevalent in this "type" of impoverishment. Poverty among black society continues to diminish every decade. The % factors are well over the short span of 54 yrs, since Civil Rights Act, and progressing every day to uplift more to embrace and pursue their own individual potential. The old system of media, driven to diminish by defamation of public saturation of violence and discord, does not define the black community, nor does the promotion of such aims to defame, carry the force it was designed. Black people continue to advance in all fields with astounding presence in every category. This is the change that is continually unfolding.
Thus so... society is making changes... the nation is to change !!! "It will not go backwards"; it will not recreate "white nationalism as being white dominance and claiming white superiority".... it will create "American Nationalism for All As America People".
This is the change that will bring back the power to the people, which is what the premise of Democracy is founded upon and stands upon and is built to promote and be administered by.
The history of change has never been pretty, but what it produces in its evolution is an unfolding toward the beauty that is destined for humanity. One must remember, "even as a rose bush blooms in the blistering heat of summer, it too appears dried out and dead in the depths of the winter, only to come to life again in the spring with a more matured and exceedingly beautiful presence.... and so too will America, bloom for All.
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Knowledge and Information is "POWER"!!! it can no longer be withheld from people.
Last edited by Chance and Change; 09-03-2018 at 07:04 AM..
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