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Old 11-01-2018, 07:49 PM
 
12,772 posts, read 7,985,902 times
Reputation: 4332

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Because government isn't the answer to things that private business can and should do.

Look what government did to the housing market. Look what government did to the higher education market.

Good intentions don't always equal good results.
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Old 11-01-2018, 07:52 PM
 
Location: Prepperland
19,029 posts, read 14,226,529 times
Reputation: 16762
I love the ideal of universal health care and the “right to access it”.
There's a problem - it's not a right. Government has criminalized or restricted access to medical care and medicine. You can only buy and sell care and medicine, by government's permission and licensing.

FIRST POINT: There is no "right" to healthcare if government requires permission (licensing) and criminalizes the unlicensed practice.
SECOND POINT: Greed was behind the push for licensing, not incompetence. Licensing created scarcity and boosted income of physicians.
THIRD POINT: Allopathic medicine was accorded the monopoly over dispensing potent medicines, and other schools of medicine were driven out or downgraded as "quackery".
FOURTH POINT: Inflated costs are directly attributed to government, abusive tort laws, monetary debasement, taxation, not to forget to mention that you cannot buy medicine without permission (prescription) bought from a government licensed person. And you can only buy it from another government licensed person, who buys his stock from other licensed entities.
FIFTH POINT: Health "insurance" is nothing less than a scam for insurance companies to skim vast fortunes from the patients (or whoever is paying the bill), via legalized gambling.

If you wish UNIVERSAL and affordable health care, you must get the government out of the way.
Government is the cause for:
[] Inflation [] Administrative overhead [] Taxation [] Scarcity [] Licensing [] Litigation [] Underwriting (insurance)

How about this:
UNIVERSAL health care means everyone can care for anyone to the best of their ability - and you exercise free choice.
[] Decriminalize giving health care;
[] Decriminalize the trade and possession of medicine and equipment;
[] Expand opportunities for medical education;
[] Offer credentials (not licenses) by supervised examination, regardless of where or how one learned medicine - including apprenticeships;
[] The only government function is to be a credential bank available to the public; and
[] Eliminate tort abuse with "Satisfaction guaranteed, or your money back!" - and nothing more.
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Old 11-01-2018, 07:52 PM
 
1,279 posts, read 855,064 times
Reputation: 2055
I am not a Republican, but economics shows that a business owned by the government is likely to be less efficient and less innovative than one owned by the private sector. Nothing indicates that healthcare would be any different.

The whole US healthcare system needs to be restructured but having government run everything isn’t the solution.

What if government had taken over the Internet and cell phone industries in 1999; where would we be today? Same for healthcare.
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Old 11-01-2018, 08:00 PM
 
Location: Pacific NW
9,437 posts, read 7,377,088 times
Reputation: 7979
Quote:
Originally Posted by jojajn View Post
Seniors love their Medicare. Citizens of other countries that have single payer healthcare love their system. The only function health insurance companies have is to take money, skim profits, and call the shots for what treatments they will pay for. Do profit sucking insurance companies own Republicans?
You have no idea what you're talking about, do you? To insurance companies own Republicans? Is that supposed to be a joke? You liberals MANDATED that EVERYONE buy overpriced insurance from them and guaranteed that the government would pay it! If anyone is owned by insurance companies it's democrats.

Seniors don't love Medicare, they need it because you democrats have driven the cost of health care so high.

Citizens of other countries have single payer and STILL buy additional insurance because single payer is so great. Anyone who sees how government run health care works for Veterans (real vets, not SJW protesters) doesn't want anything to do with government in health care, much less turn it over to them.
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Old 11-01-2018, 08:06 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,662,160 times
Reputation: 9676
Quote:
Originally Posted by biafra4life View Post

That being said, I realize that single payer presents its own set of issues; long wait times, poorer efficiencies, etc. I would love to hear someone come up with something that works for everyone. Trump found out that this is harder than it looks.
Do old people complain about the long wait times and other serious problems with their Medicare? If not, let's have Medicare for all.
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Old 11-01-2018, 08:07 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,662,160 times
Reputation: 9676
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwmson View Post
Its simple, they have been bribed to vote against it. Too much money in our existing system. I pay 1600 a month with a 6k deductible and I'm healthy. Now imagine if that's the norm. Imagine how much of our money that is being diverted to for-profit insurance companies, hmo's and big pharma. Now, with a single payer, it all goes into one fund. No insurance, no referrals, no billing departments, no huge bureaucratic mess, it's streamlined and efficient. The doctors can still make 250k year, all healthcare providers can still make a nice income, big pharma can still sell drugs, but can't repackage generics and charge Medicare $600 for 2 $5 drugs. Now imagine a society where health care no longer being profit motivated but care and prevention motivated. Take all that money we are spending on basically catastrophe insurance and put that back into the economy. Lets do some math.
I pay 1600 a month.
1600 x 12 months - $19200 This is correct. almost 20k a year and I'm healthy, god forbid I use it because then I'd have to spend $25000 before insurance pays a dime. THINK ABOUT THIS. it's a racket. Now, think, what if I did not have to spend that much, but only spent say $600 a month with no deductible, this is 12k a year, that's 12k that I can use to buy something, a new car every 2 years a house every 10 years, my kids college, hell even an ivy league college at that rate. Heck, I can start a business or invest in someone else's, etc. etc. But the reality is most of our savings from healthcare would go right back into the economy that would directly benefit from a single payers system. There is a lot of money going into a very broke system and only a few companies are getting it. The healthcare/pharma lobby is HUGE. No, I don't believe for a moment that the system could be worse. How could it be any worse than it is now?
When you're on Medicare, you pay a heck of a lot less than $1600 a month for it.
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Old 11-01-2018, 08:10 PM
 
Location: East Coast of the United States
27,603 posts, read 28,706,672 times
Reputation: 25187
I believe that healthcare is a right and there should be some form of universal healthcare for all American citizens.

Sounds like a worthy goal to me.
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Old 11-01-2018, 08:11 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,662,160 times
Reputation: 9676
Quote:
Originally Posted by cachibatches View Post
"Medicare for all" would bankrupt the system that seniors have paid into and deserve to have.

America was the leader of the health industry, which is why rich Canadians and Europeans would come here for treatment when they got cancer and the like. That is now all going to change.

The simple answer is that it costs too much and is not fair to the people who are paying into the system. My health care dollars are for me and my family, not for bankrolling chronically unemplyed alchoholics, illegal aliens, etc.
Then to you, people who don't have the money to get their illnesses treated need to learn to accept being sick as an every day way of life.
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Old 11-01-2018, 08:14 PM
 
Location: Stillwater, Oklahoma
30,976 posts, read 21,662,160 times
Reputation: 9676
Quote:
Originally Posted by t206 View Post
Because government isn't the answer to things that private business can and should do.

Look what government did to the housing market. Look what government did to the higher education market.

Good intentions don't always equal good results.
So to you, it's best to go with health care through bankruptcy. To make up for it, the people who can afford to pay for their medical care will cover the losses by paying higher prices. And best of all the government stays the hell out of it.
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Old 11-01-2018, 08:15 PM
 
2,068 posts, read 1,000,896 times
Reputation: 3641
Quote:
Originally Posted by StillwaterTownie View Post
Then to you, people who don't have the money to get their illnesses treated need to learn to accept being sick as an every day way of life.

People who don't have the money to get their illnesses treated are on Medicaid. They also go to the emergency room where they cannot be turned away from treatment for inability to pay.
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