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As others have noted, politicians can’t help – even if they were dedicated, sincere and resourceful – which is… unlikely. Politics won’t turn a harsh inland climate into a pleasant coastal one. Politics won’t reverse 200 years of culture. No kind of politics, short of totalitarian top-down control, can compel companies to build their research centers and engineering development centers in any particular place.
And to address the question in this thread, as to how a well-degreed STEM professional might find himself or herself unemployable, here are some examples:
1. Professional malpractice. A famous engineer designs a marquee bridge, and then that bridge collapses, killing people. Professional liability insurance may cover the lawsuits, but will this engineer ever again find professional employment?
2. Criminal conviction. A successful scientist decides to run an illegal side-business, selling on E-bay used equipment that his employer is about to surplus. Because the employer is a federal contractor, and the equipment is sold on the internet across state lines, using the scientist’s work-computer, the scientist is indicted for a string of federal felonies… wire fraud, destruction of federal property, etc. The conviction gets plead down to only a brief jail sentence, or perhaps just probation. But how will this scientist ever work in a university, or a defense contractor again?
3. Large gaps. A computer programmer, who was involved in seminal development activities that went on to build the internet, wrote important code in the 1980s and early 1990s. He then took early retirement during the dot-com boom. Having done poorly in the stock market, he now needs to reenter the work-force. But at age 55, despite a PhD from Stanford, he has a 15-year-gap in his employment history. He doesn’t know the modern computer codes, or how a modern software company is structured. He is willing to do an entry-level job, but can’t get hired, because hiring managers won’t take him seriously, being so flagrantly overqualified.
4. Professional scandal. An engineering executive is accused of sexual harassment. There’s not enough evidence to build a criminal case, but the hearsay is sufficient to ruin a career. The executive resigns under pressure, and finds himself blacklisted from all further such opportunities.
5. Professional scandal, take 2. A cryptography officer in the Navy is accused of mishandling classified information. There may be a criminal case, or there may not. Regardless, the officer is dishonorably discharged, and loses her security clearance. It’s hard to work in cryptography without clearance-eligibility, and having been a manager for some years, this person is a bit too far beyond the bench-level, where one has narrow but topical computer skills. She can’t get a junior position on the strength of her skills alone, and having been dishonorably discharged, she can’t use veterans’ benefits, or leverage her reputation from 17 years of military service.
None of these issues are addressable by politics. But they definitely are real.
Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007
...I live in OH and I know that they have problems finding people for this field in Ohio (I know people who work in our energy sector here who are directors/managers). You will probably have better opportunities for employment in not so hot states and especially a better rate of pay. When I moved back to OH from GA (which also has quite a few energy sector positions) I got a nearly $20k raise to do the same job I did there and the cost of living in OH is lower than metro Atlanta. They are hardpressed to find qualified people because of "brain drain" in certain cities and towns in OH...
In my part of Ohio, the “brain drain” is, to put it bluntly, balanced by lack of worthy engagement for the existing brains. In a perverse way, the system is stable.
Quote:
Originally Posted by residinghere2007
... I interviewed a guy within the past year who had a doctorate degree but worked at Target currently and walked around the subject during the interview about why they went from a very well known organization, in our particular field, with a doctorate degree to Target. IMO it showed they must have had some horrible workplace interaction occur. They'd not been able to get out of retail for 2 years. I told the person who asked my view on this person that I wouldn't even have invited them for an interview. They had been out of work for a year then worked at a few different retail establishments even though they had a doctorate degree in a field where they could have gotten a job relatively easy that would have been better than Target. I felt it was more than likely a personality issue (from the resume and from the interview and the way the person answered questions). ...
But isn't this a Catch-22? If the person in question is having difficulty finding a professional-level job, they're going to end up at a place like Target. And by the above reasoning, if they've been for a protracted period at a place like Target, they won't be able to find a professional-level job.
Having impressive STEM credentials is neither necessary nor sufficient. When I was a graduate student, we had a particularly disheveled fellow attend our various research-seminars. He must have been in his 60s, very thin and frail, and dressed like a ballerina (no, really). He lived in a 70s station wagon, parked somewhere adjacent to campus. It turns out that he was a co-inventor of the strain gauge... somehow got cheated out of royalties, and essentially went insane. Must have been a very clever fellow... but how would he get a job?
If you have solid credentials, references and a solid STEM resume and are working dead end pedestrian jobs scouring the internet for open positions for almost a year and are tired of it which political part is the best to vote for. I dont expect either one to "solve" my issues but since I am a voter I might as well vote in my own best interests.
Why vote? In only encourages them, especially when the incumbents win once again.
OK for the original question. Neither of the parties will help directly. PERIOD. However....take a look at the platform that your local guy is running on. Look for things where they talk about this topic, and if this is your sole concern.....show up at town halls and ask. No seriously. ASK them.
Pick the person who responds to you in a way that you think will help.
If you have solid credentials, references and a solid STEM resume and are working dead end pedestrian jobs scouring the internet for open positions for almost a year and are tired of it which political part is the best to vote for. I dont expect either one to "solve" my issues but since I am a voter I might as well vote in my own best interests.
It seems you're not alone: STEM Education Is the Key to the U.S.'s Economic Future(2012)
"A close look at American unemployment statistics reveals a contradiction: Even with unemployment at historically high levels, large numbers of jobs are going unfilled. Many of these jobs have one thing in common–the need for an educational background in science, technology, engineering, and mathematics."
However, you may be the only one in your field to actually get out and vote:
"An analysis that we conducted shows that college students studying STEM disciplines — that is, science, technology, engineering and mathematics — were among the least likely to vote."
As others have noted, politicians can’t help – even if they were dedicated, sincere and resourceful – which is… unlikely. Politics won’t turn a harsh inland climate into a pleasant coastal one. Politics won’t reverse 200 years of culture. No kind of politics, short of totalitarian top-down control, can compel companies to build their research centers and engineering development centers in any particular place.
And to address the question in this thread, as to how a well-degreed STEM professional might find himself or herself unemployable, here are some examples:
1. Professional malpractice. A famous engineer designs a marquee bridge, and then that bridge collapses, killing people. Professional liability insurance may cover the lawsuits, but will this engineer ever again find professional employment?
2. Criminal conviction. A successful scientist decides to run an illegal side-business, selling on E-bay used equipment that his employer is about to surplus. Because the employer is a federal contractor, and the equipment is sold on the internet across state lines, using the scientist’s work-computer, the scientist is indicted for a string of federal felonies… wire fraud, destruction of federal property, etc. The conviction gets plead down to only a brief jail sentence, or perhaps just probation. But how will this scientist ever work in a university, or a defense contractor again?
3. Large gaps. A computer programmer, who was involved in seminal development activities that went on to build the internet, wrote important code in the 1980s and early 1990s. He then took early retirement during the dot-com boom. Having done poorly in the stock market, he now needs to reenter the work-force. But at age 55, despite a PhD from Stanford, he has a 15-year-gap in his employment history. He doesn’t know the modern computer codes, or how a modern software company is structured. He is willing to do an entry-level job, but can’t get hired, because hiring managers won’t take him seriously, being so flagrantly overqualified.
4. Professional scandal. An engineering executive is accused of sexual harassment. There’s not enough evidence to build a criminal case, but the hearsay is sufficient to ruin a career. The executive resigns under pressure, and finds himself blacklisted from all further such opportunities.
5. Professional scandal, take 2. A cryptography officer in the Navy is accused of mishandling classified information. There may be a criminal case, or there may not. Regardless, the officer is dishonorably discharged, and loses her security clearance. It’s hard to work in cryptography without clearance-eligibility, and having been a manager for some years, this person is a bit too far beyond the bench-level, where one has narrow but topical computer skills. She can’t get a junior position on the strength of her skills alone, and having been dishonorably discharged, she can’t use veterans’ benefits, or leverage her reputation from 17 years of military service.
None of these issues are addressable by politics. But they definitely are real.
In my part of Ohio, the “brain drain” is, to put it bluntly, balanced by lack of worthy engagement for the existing brains. In a perverse way, the system is stable.
But isn't this a Catch-22? If the person in question is having difficulty finding a professional-level job, they're going to end up at a place like Target. And by the above reasoning, if they've been for a protracted period at a place like Target, they won't be able to find a professional-level job.
Having impressive STEM credentials is neither necessary nor sufficient. When I was a graduate student, we had a particularly disheveled fellow attend our various research-seminars. He must have been in his 60s, very thin and frail, and dressed like a ballerina (no, really). He lived in a 70s station wagon, parked somewhere adjacent to campus. It turns out that he was a co-inventor of the strain gauge... somehow got cheated out of royalties, and essentially went insane. Must have been a very clever fellow... but how would he get a job?
No - in our field t here is a plethora of jobs available usually at all times. There are very few people who have more than 2-3 years of experience, plus an education to match. So in my view there was something "there" there. I actually did check into it after the interview - called that job as I know people who work there and that person had some....I'll say bad behavior occur at that job, which caused that person to have a poor reference from that employer.
It also is a technology issue as well. As you mentioned above, if you are out of work in the most up to date technology it would take more effort on our part to train you to be up to snuff. That interviewee had not used the ERP system we utilize in over 2 years. There had been 3 upgrades since they'd used the system and we would have had to train them to use it again because it has been fully revamped. The other candidate interviewed had current experience in the ERP. That gave them the edge over that candidate. I was the main one who brought up the issue with the gap and reason for the gap. The interviewee just basically said that that job wouldn't let them complete their education, so they chose to complete the education. IMO when you have a good position, you'd prioritize financially taking care of your family over your educational goals. This person had 2 kids as well. I'm a mom and have 2 kids. I've gone back to school. I didn't and wouldn't let it jeopardize the financial well being of my household due to scheduling conflicts. The person said the job wouldn't let them revise their work schedule and that is a silly reason IMO so I looked into it when we were checking references.
Employment gaps are generally outside of the applicants control. I am going on one year, I have had some promising interviews but nothing has translated into an offer yet so it could easily go past a year.
I agree it is outside of your control, but there are ways to get more interviews and get more out there. I've personally never been out of work for more than 6 months unless I chose to be out of work (was a SAHM for a few years and even then, I did some PT work from home). You have to be VERY aggressive and be willing to leave the area you are in if there are not a lot of opportunities in your field. Engage with a recruiter and do an international search.
I agree it is outside of your control, but there are ways to get more interviews and get more out there. I've personally never been out of work for more than 6 months unless I chose to be out of work (was a SAHM for a few years and even then, I did some PT work from home). You have to be VERY aggressive and be willing to leave the area you are in if there are not a lot of opportunities in your field. Engage with a recruiter and do an international search.
I have a couple of recruiters I am working with and have had some out of state interviews and the interviewers have added me on LinkedIn. I would not mind leaving the country but my wife can’t work remote from that many time zones away. It would not make sense for her to loose her job unless I was making BIG money and had an employment contract that favored me, which are almost non existent.
For her to quit her job I would have be netting almost 200k a year and would have to have a contract that ensured I continued making that for at least 4 years with a healthy severance at the end if let go.
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