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I would agree with the recommendation set forth by the Liberty Counsel as it pertains to all K-12 students everywhere. "The district should trust parents, respect teachers’ rights and protect the privacy rights of all students, he added in an interview. The solution, Mast suggested, is simple: Offer the transgender student a private space to change and use the restroom, and require parental consent for club participation".
I agree with the bolded. This is a small concession. Yes, it feels isolating sometimes. But this concession respects the dignity and privacy of all involved.
If I were a student in that school, I would refuse to take any class that mandated using the locker room. And if anyone squabbled about it, I'd do everything I could to bring up a lawsuit of some sort.
This very nonsense is why I ALWAYS use a stall in the men's bathroom, even if I'm only going there to pick my nose. Public restrooms need to be "nutjob-proofed": rather than having a men's and women's, have a dozen single bathroom stalls/rooms with a locking door on each, a toilet, sink, and mirror. Basically make a stall into a bathroom.
Also, no more locker rooms... single rooms with shower, seat, and mirror. Lockers are out in the main hall where nobody gets naked.
Not a single source cited, except the lawyer for the ultra-christian group pushing the lawsuit. - And you guys are the ones that don't trust the NYT, but the Federalist is A-OK.
Maybe it happened like it was described in the article, but I'd like to see a credible source, AND would like to hear the other side to this story. Until then, I don't think anyone can form a fact-based opinion.
I have been a substitute P/E/ teacher in numerous middle schools and I can tell you this is BS. It did not happen as described. Boys do not get undressed in P.E. class and take showers the way I had to 50 years ago. The most they might change is to a pair of gym shorts or to another T-shirt. Supervising a locker-room does not mean that the teacher had to, “knowingly place himself in a position to observe a minor female in the nude or otherwise in a state of undress.”
I've even subbed for middle school swimming classes where the boys had to change into swimming trunks and take a quick shower before they entered the pool. I noticed a line of boys waiting to change in the toilet stalls and a couple changing into their swim suit under a beach towel.
Quote:
Originally Posted by moneill
Here's the story from the local paper. Not exactly as reported by the Christian group trying to shut the policy down.
Thanks for posting a more accurate description of what actually happened.
Quote:
Originally Posted by middle-aged mom
The Florida School District is in a very conservative area.
Bruce Jenner/ Caitlyn is a life long Republican and voted for Trump.
Not everything can be viewed through a politician lens.
Exactly!
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisC
If I were a student in that school, I would refuse to take any class that mandated using the locker room. And if anyone squabbled about it, I'd do everything I could to bring up a lawsuit of some sort.
This very nonsense is why I ALWAYS use a stall in the men's bathroom, even if I'm only going there to pick my nose. Public restrooms need to be "nutjob-proofed": rather than having a men's and women's, have a dozen single bathroom stalls/rooms with a locking door on each, a toilet, sink, and mirror. Basically make a stall into a bathroom.
Also, no more locker rooms... single rooms with shower, seat, and mirror. Lockers are out in the main hall where nobody gets naked.
These are the males that I'm concerned about.
BTW, no school is mandating using a locker-room. When I'm teaching P.E., I take attendance in the gym. I don't care where you changed or came from. People like you want to turn a non-issue into a controversy.
Location: Free State of Florida, Support our police
5,859 posts, read 3,296,750 times
Reputation: 9146
Quote:
Originally Posted by Absolom
The teacher is obviously a bigot. And all who are supporting him are bigots!!! Why not just join those Nazi-boys throwing their Nazi salutes to your Orange Fuhrer!!!
Bigot? Are you kidding. Because an adult male does not want to watch a girl change? OMG! Give it up!!
I've always felt like, there is a very easy solution to all of this, that would in addition solve a bunch of other problems for other students at the same time.
Renovate all of the bathrooms and locker rooms so that there are no communal nudity areas. Make them a bit more private.
When I was an adolescent girl, I found it horrific that during the most awkward, ugly, anxious, difficult time of my life, I was expected to disrobe and expose myself in the company of other girls. These girls were not my little friends, they were my tormentors. I didn't need to see them naked and I didn't need them to see me naked. At that time of life in particular, none of these kids should have to be nude in front of each other.
And even if it's not about humans with different plumbing, what if the PE teacher "observing" the locker room is gay, maybe closeted, maybe no one knows? Well should it even matter, since NO ONE should be sexualizing children anyhow? What about other kids who are gay and/or bi or pansexual? But more importantly than sex, far more importantly in my opinion, is the sheer meanness of kids. Bullying and other cruelties, kids have always aimed at each other. Kids can be brutal! I think it would be kindest to give them some privacy to change and/or shower if needful. Then we wouldn't have to worry about it, since nobody is seeing anybody naked.
I have been a substitute P/E/ teacher in numerous middle schools and I can tell you this is BS. It did not happen as described. Boys do not get undressed in P.E. class and take showers the way I had to 50 years ago. The most they might change is to a pair of gym shorts or to another T-shirt. Supervising a locker-room does not mean that the teacher had to, “knowingly place himself in a position to observe a minor female in the nude or otherwise in a state of undress.”
I've even subbed for middle school swimming classes where the boys had to change into swimming trunks and take a quick shower before they entered the pool. I noticed a line of boys waiting to change in the toilet stalls and a couple changing into their swim suit under a beach towel.
Thanks for posting a more accurate description of what actually happened.
Exactly!
These are the males that I'm concerned about.
BTW, no school is mandating using a locker-room. When I'm teaching P.E., I take attendance in the gym. I don't care where you changed or came from. People like you want to turn a non-issue into a controversy.
Unless you teach in that district or that school, your experience means squat.
The Tampa Bay Times article doesn't conflict with the major point of the 'right wing religious' article. The student asked to use the boy's restroom and locker room and was granted permission. Under the school policy, the teacher could encounter a girl, probably aged 11-14, nude or partially clad while performing the responsibility of supervising or monitoring the locker room.
She's 5 years old. It shouldn't matter (to him) if she's a he or a she. Should be no difference. She's a child after-all. In Europe, kids that age can go naked to the beach and sometimes they do.
I'd understand if she was 15, not 5. He should have no sexual attraction to her whatsoever, just like he should have none to the boys. This was him politically grandstanding.
Parents took their young kids to a R rated, gory war movie, with tons of cursing, and violence, and then were put off by some boobs.
Also, they might have never seen boobs before?
Wow. Wow.
True.
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