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View Poll Results: should so-called 'ballot harvesting' be legal?
liberal: no, it should be entirely illegal. 8 18.60%
liberal: allow it, but with restrictions such as 'chain of custody' paperwork, and no paid gathering. 2 4.65%
liberal: yes, it should be generally allowed. 0 0%
conservative: no, it should be entirely illegal. 13 30.23%
conservative: allow it, but with restrictions such as 'chain of custody' paperwork, and no paid gathering. 2 4.65%
conservative: yes, it should be generally allowed. 0 0%
independent: no, it should be entirely illegal. 13 30.23%
independent: allow it, but with restrictions such as 'chain of custody' paperwork, and no paid gathering. 2 4.65%
independent: yes, it should be generally allowed. 2 4.65%
other (please explain below). 1 2.33%
Voters: 43. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-10-2018, 12:31 PM
 
Location: Salisbury,NC
16,759 posts, read 8,212,614 times
Reputation: 8537

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The GOP tried it in NC. They went around in Bladen County. They screwed the pooch. They collected unmarked ballots or partially filled out.

The GOP employee forgot to hand those in by Democrat voters.

Not harvesting, just stealing ballots.
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Old 12-10-2018, 12:34 PM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
18,461 posts, read 7,087,596 times
Reputation: 11700
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
Alleged election fraud in North Carolina is directly a consequence of 'ballot harvesting.'
https://www.apnews.com/e30f0334da7d4186bed7079f4188ac3b

Ballot harvesting doubtless helped Democrats in California this cycle, but be careful what you wish for. When the floodgates are opened, both parties will try to swim. The party that doesn't will eventually go extinct anyway.

Any practice that enables 'mass production' efforts of vote collection should be looked at with a jaundiced eye.


When what's considered election fraud in North Carolina is completely legal in California.....


You know it needs to go.
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Old 12-10-2018, 12:41 PM
 
Location: Salisbury,NC
16,759 posts, read 8,212,614 times
Reputation: 8537
Quote:
Originally Posted by FatBob96 View Post
When what's considered election fraud in North Carolina is completely legal in California.....


You know it needs to go.
If done correctly it is a great way to get people involved. If the party (employee) is paying to destroy ballots, then it can't work and the party should be brought up on charges.
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Old 12-10-2018, 02:15 PM
 
78,406 posts, read 60,579,949 times
Reputation: 49687
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
I've always thought that one of the biggest obstacles to vote fraud is just the sheer difficulty of organizing groups of people to show up at the polling place. It can be done, but would require a lot of legwork and a lot of people.

'All mail' voting reduces the difficulty, and ballot harvesting even more so. That's why I oppose both.
Most election cheating goes on at grass roots levels where hundreds of votes can be a big deal when running for alderman etc. sure, these can pile up to be occasionally meaningful in statewide or even national contests but that would be pretty rare.

I do not support ballot harvesting. So often it's nothing more than going through the nursing home and picking whom they vote for and then turning it all in.
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Old 12-10-2018, 02:20 PM
 
Location: Chicago
937 posts, read 927,348 times
Reputation: 531
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss View Post
The GOP tried it in NC. They went around in Bladen County. They screwed the pooch. They collected unmarked ballots or partially filled out.

The GOP employee forgot to hand those in by Democrat voters.

Not harvesting, just stealing ballots.
This American Life covered that a bit.

In definition, it sounds like a reasonable approach to enfranchise voters.

In execution, it's pretty clear the collectors haven't had a history of being reputable.
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Old 12-10-2018, 02:56 PM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
18,461 posts, read 7,087,596 times
Reputation: 11700
Quote:
Originally Posted by Boss View Post
If done correctly it is a great way to get people involved. If the party (employee) is paying to destroy ballots, then it can't work and the party should be brought up on charges.



The potential benefits don't outweigh the potential risks.
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Old 12-10-2018, 03:15 PM
 
Location: Lone Mountain Las Vegas NV
18,058 posts, read 10,347,290 times
Reputation: 8828
Classical "whose ox gets gored" question.

Like mail ballots it offers an opportunity for abuse. Perhaps easier to abuse on a small scale but harder to abuse than mail on a large scale.

And both mail and harvesting are much more abuse-able than ID.

So if concerned it would seem ID would be the last to go after you have figured out how to deal with harvesting and mail. And certainly way off of things like early voting.

I wonder if that is how it will come out? Don't think so.
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Old 12-17-2018, 06:06 PM
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
6,061 posts, read 2,010,275 times
Reputation: 2167
Excellent article from The Hill, from the other day, on ballot harvesting.
https://thehill.com/homenews/campaig...l-ballot-flaws

This comment from an academic, presumably non-partisan, or at less so than most observers:

Quote:
“I think that it’s fair-minded to say that the fraud that we do see is associated with absentee ballots, because there are these points where an actor with ill intent can try to manipulate things,” said Paul Gronke, the director of the Early Voting Information Center at Reed College in Portland, Ore.
To be sure, fraud, either in mail-in or in-person voting, is rare. But Gronke expressed concern that the current allegations in North Carolina’s 9th District might prompt an overly aggressive response from lawmakers seeking to shore up the state’s voting procedures.
“I’m concerned that, with all the attention this has gotten, there could be a lot of overreaction,” Gronke said.
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Old 12-17-2018, 06:28 PM
 
6,835 posts, read 2,399,995 times
Reputation: 2727
If a guy finds out that his mother-in-law is a candidate on the opposing party candidate, only then should destroying that ballot that is voting for her be legal.
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