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Old 12-14-2018, 03:27 PM
 
Location: in my imagination
13,601 posts, read 21,384,844 times
Reputation: 10100

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https://www.foxnews.com/world/venezu...nded-ourselves

quote: "Under the direction of then-President Hugo Chavez, the Venezuelan National Assembly in 2012 enacted the “Control of Arms, Munitions and Disarmament Law,” with the explicit aim to “disarm all citizens.”

quote:"Chavez initially ran a months-long amnesty program encouraging Venezuelans to trade their arms for electrical goods. That year, there were only 37 recorded voluntary gun surrenders, while the majority of seizures - more than 12,500 – were by force

quote:"Prior to the 2012 reform, there were only around eight gun stores in the entire country. And the process of obtaining a legal permit to own and carry was plagued by long wait lines, high costs and bribery “to make the process swifter” at the one department allowed to issue licenses, which operated under the umbrella of the Ministry of Defense.

quote:"“Venezuelans didn’t care enough about it. The idea of having the means to protect your home was seen as only needed out in the fields. People never would have believed they needed to defend themselves against the government,” Vanegas explained. “Venezuelans evolved to always hope that our government would be non-tyrannical, non-violator of human rights, and would always have a good enough control of criminality.”
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Old 12-14-2018, 03:35 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,663,106 times
Reputation: 14050
Plenty of guns were in Columbia and the killing went on for many decades there - from all ends.

Nope, guns won't solve the problems there. I had a Uber driver here in Florida for a long ride last week who came from there. What a mess.

There is no one to blame it on. It's typical super-corruption. Not just Hugo, but the current guy.

Sorry, guns won't help a bit. Honest government would.
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Old 12-14-2018, 03:49 PM
 
Location: in my imagination
13,601 posts, read 21,384,844 times
Reputation: 10100
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Plenty of guns were in Columbia and the killing went on for many decades there - from all ends.

Nope, guns won't solve the problems there. I had a Uber driver here in Florida for a long ride last week who came from there. What a mess.

There is no one to blame it on. It's typical super-corruption. Not just Hugo, but the current guy.

Sorry, guns won't help a bit. Honest government would.
Killing may go on for decades, but at least when thugs or government thugs are the ones terrorizing people if people can fight back they can exact change.

No one is to blame?, need I even go on about that? What?

Honest government? So how do you get rid of a dishonest government when the government is the only one with guns, only supplies loyalists with guns and ignores or corrupts elections? Well I guess we could call on Trump to invade Venezuela and liberate them?
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Old 12-14-2018, 04:00 PM
 
Location: Santa Monica
36,856 posts, read 17,347,969 times
Reputation: 14459
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Sorry, guns won't help a bit. Honest government would.


https://media.giphy.com/media/I4Jmrcjnr8Zfq/giphy.gif
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Old 12-14-2018, 04:20 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,663,106 times
Reputation: 14050
The guy I spoke with for an hour - his dad and family were in the military. They had PLENTY of guns.

They moved to Columbia and this guy moved to the USA.

Believe it or not, guns aren't the salvation for the universe. In Africa they are causing millions of rapes...and being used to enforce slavery, etc.

Didn't seem to "free" those people. Same with the BILLION in India. They chased the Brits out with zero guns.

But, I know - to a hammer everything looks like a nail. If only everyone in Venezuela had a gun things would be fine, right?
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Old 12-14-2018, 04:26 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,663,106 times
Reputation: 14050
Quote:
Originally Posted by lionking View Post

Honest government? So how do you get rid of a dishonest government when the government is the only one with guns, only supplies loyalists with guns and ignores or corrupts elections?
Uh...every government I know of in the WORLD has firepower 100's of times that of the citizenry. An inconvenient factoid that may go against some video game plots.

Fighting back....isn't that what ISIS is doing? Mexican Revolutionaries? Lots of people "fighting back" - most not getting anywhere due to governments.

What is- is. I accept that. No Fox News Fantasies are going to change it.

It's the lack of morals and ethics (corruption) and selfishness....guns cannot cure that. It's also money - the Uber dude lived in the town where ALL the Oil biz is done. Plenty of americans, europeans and chinese there....no guns needed, just bank accounts and oil tankers.
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Old 12-14-2018, 04:27 PM
 
9,897 posts, read 3,426,246 times
Reputation: 7737
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Plenty of guns were in Columbia and the killing went on for many decades there - from all ends.

Nope, guns won't solve the problems there. I had a Uber driver here in Florida for a long ride last week who came from there. What a mess.

There is no one to blame it on. It's typical super-corruption. Not just Hugo, but the current guy.

Sorry, guns won't help a bit. Honest government would.
Unbridled socialism.
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Old 12-14-2018, 04:52 PM
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
6,061 posts, read 2,008,045 times
Reputation: 2167
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Uh...every government I know of in the WORLD has firepower 100's of times that of the citizenry. An inconvenient factoid that may go against some video game plots.

Fighting back....isn't that what ISIS is doing? Mexican Revolutionaries? Lots of people "fighting back" - most not getting anywhere due to governments.

What is- is. I accept that. No Fox News Fantasies are going to change it.

It's the lack of morals and ethics (corruption) and selfishness....guns cannot cure that. It's also money - the Uber dude lived in the town where ALL the Oil biz is done. Plenty of americans, europeans and chinese there....no guns needed, just bank accounts and oil tankers.
Venezuela always had massive corruption, but until Chavez took power in 1998, it was the most prosperous nation in South America. It was only with Chavez's policies of 'democratic socialism' that things started to go downhill, and it happened quite quickly. By 2012 the Venezuelan diaspora was well under way, with millions fleeing the nation due to intolerable living conditions.

It wasn't corruption that did in Venezuela; it was Hugo Chavez's policies.

I'm as anti-gun as they come, but it is a historical fact that every socialist regime through history, from the USSR to China to Cuba to Venezuela has prioritized the elimination of guns from private hands. Why would they all do that if having guns wouldn't make any difference?
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Old 12-14-2018, 05:02 PM
 
5,978 posts, read 2,231,948 times
Reputation: 4612
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Uh...every government I know of in the WORLD has firepower 100's of times that of the citizenry. An inconvenient factoid that may go against some video game plots.

Fighting back....isn't that what ISIS is doing? Mexican Revolutionaries? Lots of people "fighting back" - most not getting anywhere due to governments.

What is- is. I accept that. No Fox News Fantasies are going to change it.

It's the lack of morals and ethics (corruption) and selfishness....guns cannot cure that. It's also money - the Uber dude lived in the town where ALL the Oil biz is done. Plenty of americans, europeans and chinese there....no guns needed, just bank accounts and oil tankers.
For some reason there is a segment of the American population that believes their hand gun and semi assault play toy is a match against drones, air strikes, tanks, remote missiles, ect. The United states military can wipe out half of the US population remotely without a single soldier using his real automatic assault rifle.
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Old 12-14-2018, 05:06 PM
 
4,120 posts, read 6,604,833 times
Reputation: 2289
Oil...

Outside of Norway, find me one petro economy which isn't run either by a 3rd world dictator or run like a 3rd world **** hole.

Norway is the only country who has invested the oil money & used it for their people. The Norway fund now has over a trillion $$'s or $188k per person & boasts the highest standard of living in the world.
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