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What does a "ban" mean? That I'm gonna have to turn in my 1944 M 1 to the authorities? Naw, I don't think I'm gonna do that, guess I'll be a lawbreaker.
Welcome to the party pal.
If you're going to be a felon might as well be the best you can be and make it an M2 and go full auto.
Unfortunately you and I have had it out before and you think your M1 is not open for debate but my ARs, AKs etc are.
This doesn't help either of our cause...
It's like the Fudd mentality. Oh they can have yours, longs I gets to keeps mine.
If you're going to be a felon might as well be the best you can be and make it an M2 and go full auto.
Unfortunately you and I have had it out before and you think your M1 is not open for debate but my ARs, AKs etc are.
This doesn't help either of our cause...
It's like the Fudd mentality. Oh they can have yours, longs I gets to keeps mine.
I'm not about confiscating anything legally purchased. Not for a second. What I am about is making it more difficult to purchase a semi automatic weapon. I think our fundamental difference of opinion lies in the fact that you think it is a right to own a semi-automatic weapon, and I do as well, but with the right comes the responsibility of being qualified to exercise that right.
Owning a weapon like an AR-15 and AK-47, to name only two, should carry responsibility in order to do so. It's not responsible gun owners like yourself that i'm worried about, it's gangs and mentally ill people who own these weapons and have no problem with black market or gun show purchases.
I'm not about confiscating anything legally purchased. Not for a second. What I am about is making it more difficult to purchase a semi automatic weapon. I think our fundamental difference of opinion lies in the fact that you think it is a right to own a semi-automatic weapon, and I do as well, but with the right comes the responsibility of being qualified to exercise that right.
Owning a weapon like an AR-15 and AK-47, to name only two, should carry responsibility in order to do so. It's not responsible gun owners like yourself that i'm worried about, it's gangs and mentally ill people who own these weapons and have no problem with black market or gun show purchases.
And how would you propose we stop the illegal possession of guns?
And would you lump my 22 semi auto rabbit rifle in with other semi-autos? The function is the same.
I know a few people that I think should not own a gun, but it is not my right to decide their rights.
I'm not about confiscating anything legally purchased. Not for a second. What I am about is making it more difficult to purchase a semi automatic weapon. I think our fundamental difference of opinion lies in the fact that you think it is a right to own a semi-automatic weapon, and I do as well, but with the right comes the responsibility of being qualified to exercise that right.
Owning a weapon like an AR-15 and AK-47, to name only two, should carry responsibility in order to do so. It's not responsible gun owners like yourself that i'm worried about, it's gangs and mentally ill people who own these weapons and have no problem with black market or gun show purchases.
I fundamentally believe we all have a right to own machine guns with no 200 dollar tax or registration.
I fundamentally believe in addressing the cause of the concern not the symptoms.
The weapons are not the cause.
Motive incentive intent are what needs addressing. Not the weapons. Remove the weapon, you've done nothing to stop violence the implement will merely change.
I fundamentally believe we all have a right to own machine guns with no 200 dollar tax or registration.
I fundamentally believe in addressing the cause of the concern not the symptoms.
The weapons are not the cause.
Motive incentive intent are what needs addressing. Not the weapons. Remove the weapon, you've done nothing to stop violence the implement will merely change.
The weapons are not the cause……..uh, in theory, that's wonderful, but I'm talking reality here. Some nutcase gets his hands on a M249 SAW and after he kills a couple hundred people, we can say "It wasn't the weapon that killed those people, it was the shooter!" and go on about our business.
Do you know how ridiculous that sounds? It sounds to me like what is your ideal state is some kind of Mad Max society, where the best armed will be the 'safest" in society. I think it's time for your wake up call.
And how would you propose we stop the illegal possession of guns?
And would you lump my 22 semi auto rabbit rifle in with other semi-autos? The function is the same.
I know a few people that I think should not own a gun, but it is not my right to decide their rights.
The graduated scale of lethality, which can be used in accordance with…………wait for it……………common sense.
The price for "freedom" in America is leading the world in senseless gun violence. I get that. But like many others, I believe we should institute something called "checks and balances" in regards to legal gun ownership. There weren't semi-automatic rifles when the Second Amendment was drafted into the Constitution.
I'm not here to discuss the specifics, however, as that minutiae can't be resolved on a discussion forum on the internet with gun owners who believe in no restrictions.
The weapons are not the cause……..uh, in theory, that's wonderful, but I'm talking reality here. Some nutcase gets his hands on a M249 SAW and after he kills a couple hundred people, we can say "It wasn't the weapon that killed those people, it was the shooter!" and go on about our business.
Do you know how ridiculous that sounds? It sounds to me like what is your ideal state is some kind of Mad Max society, where the best armed will be the 'safest" in society. I think it's time for your wake up call.
….RIIIIIINGGGGGG…….
Some nut case in 1990 got ahold of what was a dollars worth of gasoline at the time, a container, and a match. 87 people died in the Happyland Fire. We can indeed say "It wasn't the gasoline, container and match that killed those people, it was the person who lit the match!"
The weapons are not the cause……..uh, in theory, that's wonderful, but I'm talking reality here. Some nutcase gets his hands on a M249 SAW and after he kills a couple hundred people, we can say "It wasn't the weapon that killed those people, it was the shooter!" and go on about our business.
Do you know how ridiculous that sounds? It sounds to me like what is your ideal state is some kind of Mad Max society, where the best armed will be the 'safest" in society. I think it's time for your wake up call.
….RIIIIIINGGGGGG…….
Some nut case gets a 249.
Why didn't anyone take initiative to stop the shooter?
Take Parkland scumbag for example. He had postings on multiple social media avenues that were not edgy or trolling. He was down right rambling on about killing. Never mind the fact police had been to his residence more times than an ice cream truck in the year leading up to his heinous attack.
Did the shooter in your hypothetical go on about murdering on social media?
Did they have a history of police intervention?
Go to the other hypothetical vegas scumbag.
If I were in the business of providing a place to rest to multiples of people by the hundreds, you'd bet I'd have top notch security and armed at that.
What mgm did by suing the victims was disgraceful. No way in hell would I have pulled some stunt like that.
I'd have been more apologetic for not being prepared for that scenario.
My ideal state mad max? No. My ideal state is. F around and find out.
Do not commit violence or initiate force against another for any reason.
Everyone is responsible for their well being as they see fit.
Nobody should become a victim. At all.
Be it a college girl to the elderly guy in his recliner complaining about those dang kids and their long hair and rock and roll.
You want responsible gun owners? So do I. You don't get them by demonizing them or their selection in weaponry... you create a divide of an us vs them.
So now that I've addressed your hyperbole what say you?
The graduated scale of lethality, which can be used in accordance with…………wait for it……………common sense.
The price for "freedom" in America is leading the world in senseless gun violence. I get that. But like many others, I believe we should institute something called "checks and balances" in regards to legal gun ownership. There weren't semi-automatic rifles when the Second Amendment was drafted into the Constitution.
I'm not here to discuss the specifics, however, as that minutiae can't be resolved on a discussion forum on the internet with gun owners who believe in no restrictions.
There are already plenty of checks and balances. Federal Form 4473 lists all of the conditions that have to be met in order to be able to lawfully possess a firearm within the United States. Any violation of that is a felony and a federal crime punishable by a 5-10 year prison sentence and up to a $250,000 fine. In addition there are thousands of federal, state, and local firearms laws that address both the criminal and negligent mis-use of firearms. Along with thousands of laws that address every conceivable criminal act imaginable. Along with civil liability laws. WE DON'T NEED ANY MORE LAWS PERIOD!
The Supreme Court already ruled on what types of weapons that are protected under the 2nd Amendment. There weren't any computers, radio, TV or any other types of electronic communications available when the 1st Amendment was drafted into the Constitution either. Are you ready to give all that up too?
Quote:
"Obviously the amendment does not apply to arms that can not be hand carried--It's to keep and 'bear' so it doesn't apply to cannons. But I suppose there are hand held rocket launchers that can bring down airplanes, that will have to be decided."-- "The 2nd Amendment extends, prima facie, to all instruments that constitute bearable arms, even those that were not in existence at the time of the founding."--- Antonin Scalia (Heller vs DC) www.law.cornell.edu/suplt
The graduated scale of lethality, which can be used in accordance with…………wait for it……………common sense.
The price for "freedom" in America is leading the world in senseless gun violence.
Wrong.
There exists incentive, motive, and intent that causes violence committed with a firearm. Address those you've solved it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by odanny
I get that. But like many others, I believe we should institute something called "checks and balances" in regards to legal gun ownership.
Wait a minute. The government can have machine guns only? I can't unless they were made before 1986 and registered to the NFA? Only the government can dispatch agents armed with machine guns onto your property to kill your dog's or burn your church to the ground? But we shouldn't have machine guns?
So much for those checks and balances because government has never done wrong to its people... not an anarchist but if you believe in checks and balances there is no what's good for me not for thee.
Ruby Ridge and Waco. Both cases were significant abuse of power. Down right tyrannical. If they wanted david koresch if they wanted randy weaver they'd have got em without having to go to that extreme.
Quote:
Originally Posted by odanny
There weren't semi-automatic rifles when the Second Amendment was drafted into the Constitution.
Wrong. There were multiple repeating arms at the time of the constitution. Stop with the myth.
1777 Washington commissioned 100 Belton repeating muskets the deal fell through for the designer Jospeh Belton wanting alot of money.
There was the Puckle gun. 1718 version of a mini gun.
I can go on and on with semi automatics.
I can also post a cartoon of a British soldier asking a pilgrim what their use of an assault flint lock rifle would be...
Quote:
Originally Posted by odanny
I'm not here to discuss the specifics, however, as that minutiae can't be resolved on a discussion forum on the internet with gun owners who believe in no restrictions.
Waving the white flag so soon?
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