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For someone who believe in the whole Russian collusion fairy tale for over two years, still grasping at fairy tales I see...
The bottom line is, you don't know if it is a fairy tale, and we don't know if it will bury Trump. The only people who really know are not on this forum, they are on Mueller's team.
That being said, there is no question that Mueller and team did a very thorough, professional job and left no stone unturned. Your side may not like those rocks being upset, but it is essential to our democracy that we know the truth. The last thing this country needs is a corrupt person making decisions that affect all of us...…...even you.
I think most of us on the left are going to accept the truth when it comes out, regardless of how it goes. Will you say the same thing ?
Mitch and the boys are going to have to make a risky bet whether to dump Trump or back him all the way.
The smart play was to dump trump 30 seconds after the midterms, the sucker move is to continue to wait for Mueller , but Mitch is too much of a coward to try to topple Trump before Mueller's report.
Mitch is likely Hoping for a stunning scary report from Mueller, one so strong he can sell dumping Trump for the sake of the Union and the sake of the party...
...
Mitch and Republicans have a tiger by the tail.
If they dump Trump, they lose their/now his base.
The evangelicals believe Trump was anointed by God and won't think kindly of disbelievers. Even those Republicans who aren't primaried out of the running, will be hard pressed to get enough votes to actually win.
If they continue to cover for Trump, they become known as the party of "racists, liars, and cheats."
Depending on how the various investigations turn out, they could also become the party of criminals and traitors.
Muller and his goons will find nothing on Mr. Trump...........then the America hating left will continue jumping up and down that Muller was paid off.
Everything the America hating left does is a lie or failure......or both.
The bottom line is, you don't know if it is a fairy tale, and we don't know if it will bury Trump. The only people who really know are not on this forum, they are on Mueller's team.
That being said, there is no question that Mueller and team did a very thorough, professional job and left no stone unturned. Your side may not like those rocks being upset, but it is essential to our democracy that we know the truth. The last thing this country needs is a corrupt person making decisions that affect all of us...…...even you.
I think most of us on the left are going to accept the truth when it comes out, regardless of how it goes. Will you say the same thing ?
An attempted coup is not "essential to our democracy."
I suspect a lot of responses will be extremes of total innocence, or colluding with Russia, etc. This is my guess though:
First, lets remember Muellers job:
Keep in mind all of this is extremely speculative since so much of this is not public
There is no collusion between Trump and Russia nor was he directly involved in any of it. But there is evidence sufficient to warrant indictment when out of office via impeachment or end of term for Obstruction of justice. I just haven't seen enough indications of evidence so far to indicate that he colluded directly.
Manafort however colluded. The 75 pages of private polling data that we know about indicates this.
Roger Stone mildly colluded. But perhaps not knowingly. Stone is a awful human being that I wish jail time on. But so far I haven't seen indications that he knew he was dealing with Russian agents. Again....we don't have all the info yet though, so maybe he is a bigger deal.
And a couple other people on Trumps team did so. Possibly a close relative, but possibly not.
As for other things that arise?
OH boy. This is whats causing Trump himself to sweat. And he should. Mueller tore apart everyones finances and money looking for things relevant, and im sure his team had a ton of "what the heck" moments. I suspect a ton of shady financial dealings,etc. I suspect a ton of criminal activity. BUT...I don't expect to see non-financial crimes much. Fraud, tax evasion, maybe some money laundering. I have said for years now that Trump should have never tried to win because everyone I know who works in Real Estate at that level like Trump does has ZERO respect for laws. Seriously, I know this type. They don't use email because they're constantly finding every advantage to get ahead-many illegal.
Trumps family (With the exception of Baron, Tiffany, and Melania): See above, although at a much smaller level.
Kushner may stand out. He may in fact get indicted for something worse then others. Some news articles suggest he gave the Saudis lists of people who the US knew were opposed to the Saudi leadership, which was followed by the Saudis doing mass arrests, and seizures of wealth. If true he needs a pardon from Trump, or some indication that he did this on Trumps direction. Otherwise I suspect he will spend decades in club fed. I find the idea that he handed the list believable. Both from how well the Saudi government targeted people, the reports about Kushners interactions, and reports about statements by people involved. If Mueller investigated any of this Kushner is toast. But he may not have-its not in his purview unless it got linked in via some connection I don't yet see. On the other hand there are indications that Saudi and others are being looked at. This may also be why Trump is refusing to hand over Kushners Security clearance information.
Now there are tons of other companies, and people who could get pulled in. Including politicians on the left and right. We could even see big names like Clinton get pulled in, but more likely we're going to see more about the people behind the big names.
Everyone who focuses on that though might miss the more important parts-Mueller will layout the Russian involvement in extreme detail.
What will happen? Well.......also insanely speculative:
Trump is impeached, but fails to get removed from office by the Senate who claims that he was just doing what he believed to be the best choices at the time. I believe this because honestly none of his criminal activity has phased them in the slightest, and their statements at hearings have all been about denying or investigating anything. Its.....insane. They should do their job instead of just toeing the party line no matter what.
Trump either pardons his family. And himself on his last day of office. Probably already has blanket pardons written. Or for real fun he could just issue pardons for every single person in federal prison for everything except murder, or that committed any crimes not involving murder before this date. 175,000 Federal inmates get released, and tens of thousands of criminal cases get closed. I would be sort of amused by this.
(not very speculative) everyone accused lies about things. Some of them poorly.
Some folks go to jail.
It damages the Republican party horrifically-unless some left wing folks are pulled in. Then its more of a wash, even if its only 25% left and 75% right. Their only chance near term is to impeach and convict Trump, but they don't because someone had enough pressure to put on them to avoid being removed from office. It takes a long time for them to recover. If on the other hand they dump Trump.....they still take a lot of damage, but can recover far faster.
Russia is put on notice. No matter who is in charge-including Trump, the report will make their actions incredibly clear.
(possibly less speculative then the above) The politics board manages to break CD due to the posting volume that spikes. At least one CD hard drive fails, but no data is lost because of good redundant data storage procedures. Twitter servers end up needing so many cloud data servers that they suddenly become intelligent, and decide that based on their data humanity should be exterminated.
So whats everyone elses thoughts on what will occur?
I think there will be proven links to Russia, some obstruction of justice, but no impeachment. Trump's followers will not be deterred from following him.
I suspect a lot of responses will be extremes of total innocence, or colluding with Russia, etc. This is my guess though:
First, lets remember Muellers job:
Keep in mind all of this is extremely speculative since so much of this is not public
There is no collusion between Trump and Russia nor was he directly involved in any of it. But there is evidence sufficient to warrant indictment when out of office via impeachment or end of term for Obstruction of justice. I just haven't seen enough indications of evidence so far to indicate that he colluded directly.
Manafort however colluded. The 75 pages of private polling data that we know about indicates this.
Roger Stone mildly colluded. But perhaps not knowingly. Stone is a awful human being that I wish jail time on. But so far I haven't seen indications that he knew he was dealing with Russian agents. Again....we don't have all the info yet though, so maybe he is a bigger deal.
And a couple other people on Trumps team did so. Possibly a close relative, but possibly not.
As for other things that arise?
OH boy. This is whats causing Trump himself to sweat. And he should. Mueller tore apart everyones finances and money looking for things relevant, and im sure his team had a ton of "what the heck" moments. I suspect a ton of shady financial dealings,etc. I suspect a ton of criminal activity. BUT...I don't expect to see non-financial crimes much. Fraud, tax evasion, maybe some money laundering. I have said for years now that Trump should have never tried to win because everyone I know who works in Real Estate at that level like Trump does has ZERO respect for laws. Seriously, I know this type. They don't use email because they're constantly finding every advantage to get ahead-many illegal.
Trumps family (With the exception of Baron, Tiffany, and Melania): See above, although at a much smaller level.
Kushner may stand out. He may in fact get indicted for something worse then others. Some news articles suggest he gave the Saudis lists of people who the US knew were opposed to the Saudi leadership, which was followed by the Saudis doing mass arrests, and seizures of wealth. If true he needs a pardon from Trump, or some indication that he did this on Trumps direction. Otherwise I suspect he will spend decades in club fed. I find the idea that he handed the list believable. Both from how well the Saudi government targeted people, the reports about Kushners interactions, and reports about statements by people involved. If Mueller investigated any of this Kushner is toast. But he may not have-its not in his purview unless it got linked in via some connection I don't yet see. On the other hand there are indications that Saudi and others are being looked at. This may also be why Trump is refusing to hand over Kushners Security clearance information.
Now there are tons of other companies, and people who could get pulled in. Including politicians on the left and right. We could even see big names like Clinton get pulled in, but more likely we're going to see more about the people behind the big names.
Everyone who focuses on that though might miss the more important parts-Mueller will layout the Russian involvement in extreme detail.
What will happen? Well.......also insanely speculative:
Trump is impeached, but fails to get removed from office by the Senate who claims that he was just doing what he believed to be the best choices at the time. I believe this because honestly none of his criminal activity has phased them in the slightest, and their statements at hearings have all been about denying or investigating anything. Its.....insane. They should do their job instead of just toeing the party line no matter what.
Trump either pardons his family. And himself on his last day of office. Probably already has blanket pardons written. Or for real fun he could just issue pardons for every single person in federal prison for everything except murder, or that committed any crimes not involving murder before this date. 175,000 Federal inmates get released, and tens of thousands of criminal cases get closed. I would be sort of amused by this.
(not very speculative) everyone accused lies about things. Some of them poorly.
Some folks go to jail.
It damages the Republican party horrifically-unless some left wing folks are pulled in. Then its more of a wash, even if its only 25% left and 75% right. Their only chance near term is to impeach and convict Trump, but they don't because someone had enough pressure to put on them to avoid being removed from office. It takes a long time for them to recover. If on the other hand they dump Trump.....they still take a lot of damage, but can recover far faster.
Russia is put on notice. No matter who is in charge-including Trump, the report will make their actions incredibly clear.
(possibly less speculative then the above) The politics board manages to break CD due to the posting volume that spikes. At least one CD hard drive fails, but no data is lost because of good redundant data storage procedures. Twitter servers end up needing so many cloud data servers that they suddenly become intelligent, and decide that based on their data humanity should be exterminated.
So whats everyone elses thoughts on what will occur?
Pictures of Trump with a turdswirl for hair, a Trump dartboard, and pictures of Naked Trump, with Adam Schiff and Robert Mueller stains on them, ewe.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bawac34618
I wonder if that would have even been possible if Fox News would have existed in the Nixon days. Trump's base is already indoctrinated to automatically reject anything he is accused of regardless of the evidence...
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