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Old 04-01-2019, 09:39 AM
 
10,920 posts, read 6,905,438 times
Reputation: 4942

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
They are still only supplemental power. When we cannot control what drives wind and solar, then we do not control them, cannot demand they provide power on a given day, at a given hour, for a given length of time. What they do allow us to do, is scale back the amount of baseload power generation, while these renewable sources provide power.
And there are other technologies beyond wind and solar (and there has been for a long time).

And battery technology is catching up faster than many people realize.

 
Old 04-01-2019, 09:52 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,959 posts, read 22,134,270 times
Reputation: 13794
Quote:
Originally Posted by my54ford View Post
No one uses gasoline to make electricity....
But there are homes, some businesses, and hospitals that rely on a diesel generator as an emergency back up. I know a few small cities that have large diesel generators for peak load generation.

There are even some that use dual fuel combustion turbines (fuel oil and natural gas) for the same purpose.

Industrial Natural Gas Combustion Turbine Solutions

Last edited by Wapasha; 04-01-2019 at 10:10 AM..
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:02 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,959 posts, read 22,134,270 times
Reputation: 13794
Quote:
Originally Posted by Crazy-Cat-Lady View Post
As much as I dislike him, I think he says things as a form of humour or just to wind people up.

True. When the 24/7 news cycles have us all talking about some silly stuff, and Trump wants the media and the public to focus on his specific topic. All Trump needs to do is make a satirical reference to something. He knows his joke will fly right over the heads of the too tightly wound left-leaning, Trump-hating news media, that it will push their buttons, and... suddenly the entire country is talking about whatever topic it was that Trump wanted us all to talk about.
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:09 AM
 
8,377 posts, read 4,359,448 times
Reputation: 11880
Some people are just too thick headed to understand or they just do not want to.

Power can be generated from:
Fossil fuel
Nuclear
Water
Wind
Solar

They can all supplement each other.
None are guaranteed to supply demand 100% of the time.
Even nuclear plants undergo shutdowns for maintenance on an annual basis.
Fossil fuel is not unlimited. It will eventually run out.
Fossil fuel has supply chains that must be maintained and are subject to fail or slow down.
Every system has to be maintained and delivered.
Demand is part of the equation. LED lighting and TV's have helped reduce demand.
There are many other energy efficient ways to reduce demand.

It is a system and statements like 'the wind doesn't blow all the time' go beyond ignorant to pure stupidly.
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:09 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,959 posts, read 22,134,270 times
Reputation: 13794
Quote:
Originally Posted by HockeyMac18 View Post
You can't change the fact that oil is a finite thing. It will run out.
Not before lithium does.
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:10 AM
 
Location: Florida
23,795 posts, read 13,250,882 times
Reputation: 19952
And they call AOC dumb?
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:13 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,959 posts, read 22,134,270 times
Reputation: 13794
Quote:
Originally Posted by ditchoc View Post
Some people are just too thick headed to understand or they just do not want to.

Power can be generated from:
Fossil fuel
Nuclear
Water
Wind
Solar

They can all supplement each other.
None are guaranteed to supply demand 100% of the time.
Even nuclear plants undergo shutdowns for maintenance on an annual basis.
Fossil fuel is not unlimited. It will eventually run out.
Fossil fuel has supply chains that must be maintained and are subject to fail or slow down.
Every system has to be maintained and delivered.
Demand is part of the equation. LED lighting and TV's have helped reduce demand.
There are many other energy efficient ways to reduce demand.

It is a system and statements like 'the wind doesn't blow all the time' go beyond ignorant to pure stupidly.

And yet that is why wind can never be a baseload power, we cannot demand the wind to blow, when we need more energy, when the wind is calm. It's common sense, and it's not even arguable, so give your ridiculing for the legitimate criticism of wind and solar, a rest.
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:16 AM
 
17,273 posts, read 9,551,388 times
Reputation: 16468
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
And yet that is why wind can never be a baseload power, we cannot demand the wind to blow, when we need more energy and the wind is calm. It's common sense, and it's not even arguable, so give your ridiculing of the critics of wind and solar, a rest.
What are you not understanding that renewable resources can be used hand in hand?
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:20 AM
 
Location: Wisconsin
37,959 posts, read 22,134,270 times
Reputation: 13794
Quote:
Originally Posted by thefragile View Post
What are you not understanding that renewable resources can be used hand in hand?
Did I criticize that, or even intimate that? No. You are trying to create a straw man.


I live in Wisconsin, and during the cold winter months we usually go thru weeks of cloudy, windless, foggy days. There is no wind, there is no solar, well, none to speak of. Wind and solar can go hand in hand all they like, and we still have no control over the weather, or the day/night cycle.
 
Old 04-01-2019, 10:20 AM
 
46,943 posts, read 25,964,420 times
Reputation: 29434
Quote:
Originally Posted by Wapasha View Post
They are still only supplemental power. When we cannot control what drives wind and solar, then we do not control them, cannot demand they provide power on a given day, at a given hour, for a given length of time. What they do allow us to do, is scale back the amount of baseload power generation, while these renewable sources provide power.
And that is a worthwhile thing to do.

One off-shore 3 MW turbine in the North Sea will typically generate six million kWh in a year. According to the Kentucky Coal Organization, it takes "about a pound" of coal to generate 1 kWh.

So for the lifetime of that 3 MW turbine (typically 30 years), we can avoid mining, transporting and burning 180 million pounds of coal - 81,600 metric tons. Less black lung, less released radon, less CO2, less fly ash, more mountains with their tops still on. Of course, for those whose wealth is dependent on lots and lots of coal being burned, this is still a bad thing.

Trump's statement in its full glory, btw:

Quote:
You look at the fact that we would have been powered by wind, which wouldn’t have worked by the way because it only blows sometimes and lots of problems come about.
It's a stunning analysis.
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