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Old 05-20-2019, 05:39 PM
 
5,705 posts, read 3,671,669 times
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Two words. Willful ignorance.
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Old 05-20-2019, 06:10 PM
 
4,195 posts, read 1,600,665 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobNJ1960 View Post
Wal Mart will employ mainly robots IMO, as will almost all retail and fast food, in just a few years.

Their associates either can train for 21st century jobs, or become fully unemployable, to be taken care of by functional people in their lives.

the problem then is that there are quite a number of people lacking in the ability to retrain for much of anything...then i can see a sort of 21st century CCC which got some mention during the 2008 crash
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Old 05-30-2019, 11:16 AM
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
6,061 posts, read 2,010,801 times
Reputation: 2167
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Travis! You are very wrong. I hope I can prove it to you.

First, let me mention a couple names...

John Ensign - US Senator from NV.
Mark Sanford - Rep and former Gov. SC
Sam Brownback
Chuck Grassley
Jim DeMint
Tom Coburn
Jim Inhofe
Mike Enzi

I think we can agree that this represents a cross-section of "elected GOP Officials". There are many more i an list, but that's a good sample.

They, and 100's of other (mostly GOP but some Blue Dog Fundies) are members of a Christian organization. Many of them even live (and pray) together in the same houses in DC (a good financial deal can be had also).

https://www.npr.org/templates/story/...ryId=120746516

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fe...n_organization)

In addition to American power, this organization also includes MANY powerful Christians the world over, some known as despots or other fountains of corruption and authoritarianism.

"During the 1960s, the Family forged relationships between the U.S. government and some of the most oppressive regimes in the world, arranging prayer networks in the U.S. Congress for the likes of General Costa e Silva, dictator of Brazil; General Suharto, dictator of Indonesia; and General Park Chung Hee, dictator of South Korea. "The Fellowship's reach into governments around the world," observes David Kuo, a former special assistant to the president in Bush's first term, "is almost impossible to overstate or even grasp."

The stated goal of The Family is to install Jesus Christ - personally - at the head of government of the world. They are anti-Democracy and they will tell you so...not in campaign commercials, of course, but these are the people behind things like the AL abortion law. They don't care about law or the people. It's Jesus only.

"the Family declared that democracy is inadequate to the fight against godlessness"

This is the group that started and runs the "National Prayer Breakfast" FYI.

"Coe himself boasted of what the press couldn’t see, declaring that the single public event, the Prayer Breakfast, “is only one-tenth of one percent of the iceberg ... [and] doesn’t give the true picture of what is going on.”

" “God appoints specific leaders to fulfill a mission; He doesn’t hold a popular vote,” writes John C. Maxwell, a management guru on C Street’s Prayer Breakfast circuit, in a Bible study titled Leadership: Deliberate Selection vs. Democratic Election."

Long story short, not only do one or two or ten GOP leader support doing away with Democracy, but virtually the entire power base...and they want to do this all over the world. AND, they have appointed themselves to do so...

You should read up on it because it is no sideline of no joke. These people are vastly more dangerous than foreign terrorists as they actually change our laws and bribe our officials and other depots all over the world.

The end game is installing THEM in total power...and THEY, in turn, know what Jesus would do and that will become the law. It is already so in some laws.
There are many strange beliefs spouted behind closed doors. I recall as a young student attending a seminar at a Christian college where a prof (and successful businessman) spewed about the Warburgs, Rothchilds, etc.

Only rarely are these strange beliefs actually transformed into action. They tend not to pencil out, and cooler heads prevail. When they do transform, it is usually a result of mental illness and/or drugs, as with the case of Jonestown.

We've had a peaceful transition of power every four years since 1800, and no attempts yet to install "THEM in total power."

You give a bunch of names but no quotes from any advocating the overthrow of religious freedom.
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Old 05-30-2019, 02:06 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,674,856 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BobNJ1960 View Post
Wrong. I have spent decades analyzing and often approving or rejecting capital requests. Cost per human matters.

Most corps will veto any where the investment is not paid off fast (2-3 years max).

Fight for 15 is the fight to make low skilled Americans unemployable..permanently.
Well, we agree and disagree.

I'm a futurist. Anything we do today must take into account what exists now and what will exist later. This statement, in itself, argues against your "decades" of making decisions, all of which were in the past.

We could change that statement to mean "cost per human mattered MORE in the past, and less as we go forward"......

Also, if you have done work like that you are aware that productivity has tripled since about 1960 and wages (real wages) are hardly up at all. So let's take a simple example of that.

Joe six-pack is making $5 an hour on the line in 1960. He is producing total value of $20 an hour for Faceless Corporate Rut Incorporated.

Now, let's move to today - 2018 or so (stats are never exactly up to date).

Joe six-pack, with the 10% real wage increase here has gotten (and inflation) is making $47 an hour and producing $500+ per hour worth of value (triple the $20 plus inflation).

Labor, therefore, is now less than 10% of the equation as opposed to 25%. So, where did the money go? Well, that has been clearly answered a lot of times. It's called inequality. It's why tax rates have gone from 90% in 1959 to way less than 1/2 that today (at the top) and the rest is made from debt and deficit.

Yet you tell us that even 1/3rd the wage Joe is making...that's too much. That's fantastic. It's as if....you were somehow transported back to 1960 and were Joe making $5, you'd say "Hey, I should only be making $1.50"......

When events prove you wrong you sometimes have to throw away preconceived ideas and look at modern realities. Examples:

1. Costco pays sales associates and cashiers WELL OVER $20 per hour. They have for a decade or more. According to you, that would ruin them. But it doesn't. Why??

2. I paid even my lowest retail employees that much or more in the 1990's....yet all it did was make ME do better. Why?

3. Wages in China have gone up by 400% or more in some areas. Yet, the Tariff King Aside, none of us can say that manufactured products from China are not a good value. The workers now making $4 an hour there (quite typical) could be raised to $5 or $6 and the price of your USB cable would not be noticeably higher.
Why?

I will answer most of that....it's productivity and the fact that labor is a very small part, and getting smaller, of most manufactured products these days.

It's a different mindset than perhaps the one you went through your career with. But think about it - what is the labor cost in a $800 iPhone? Less than $8. If you doubled the wages of the workers (and they already have doubled or tripled), your phone might be $$829

The only thing I haven't mentioned here is the "poor people need cheap stuff" angle. This is what will kill us in these trade wars. Since Joe hasn't has a raise in 40 years he is falling further and further behind the eight ball. The only thing that can keep his family in the basics are dirt-cheap goods. So there is a bit of a vicious cycle there.

When I talk economics I am speaking "within the existing system". If I had my way we'd change the entire premise of it and in some ways we are. People keep cars for up to 15 years now and love to show off their old iPhone 4S.

Terrible for "the economy", but a great thing for Mother Earth. There was a short period when European goods were highly valued here for that reason - people bought a Mercedes or a Volvo due to quality and longevity and paid more. But things have changed now and a Kia or Honda or Toyota is as good or better.

The USA doesn't have any plan(s), which to me is our biggest problem. The lack of a plan or a course means the sailor is going to end up on the rocks somewhere.
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Old 05-30-2019, 04:14 PM
 
Location: Just over the horizon
18,461 posts, read 7,089,783 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bluefox View Post
The Bible Belt gets a disproportionate share of electoral votes that they certainly don’t deserve. At the end of the day, a presidential vote in California is worth far less than a presidential vote in Mississippi. Those backwater southern states have been a thorn in the side of American progress, and leeches on the American economy, for decades.



So they should be serfs, without a say in government and subject to the whims of Liberal left and right Coast voters?
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Old 05-30-2019, 07:56 PM
 
5,527 posts, read 3,253,078 times
Reputation: 7764
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
I'm a futurist.
Futurists don't have a good track record predicting the future. That "job" is kind of a joke. They are almost always biased in favor of more change than actually happens.
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Old 05-30-2019, 08:04 PM
 
Location: SE Asia
16,236 posts, read 5,880,554 times
Reputation: 9117
Quote:
Originally Posted by Adhom View Post
I have a simpler answer for you. It's called the electoral college, which is baked in gerrymandering from the Constitution. Republicans cannot win the popular vote anymore in Presidential elections and only the electoral college is keeping them in contention. If we were under a parliamentary system where seats in Congress were awarded based on percentage of votes, the Republicans would be out of power already.

And before someone comes in to say how the Constitution is the like the gospel and cannot be wrong, please explain why the choice of where I live should have an impact on the weight of my vote.
Yeah the left has hated it since Abraham Lincoln was made President due to the electoral college. He was so meddlesome.

Maybe the durability of the right stems from the fact that many people don't have faith that the Fed is the answer to all life's problems? Let's face it. They can't add 2+2 and get the same number twice. There is a very good reason why neither party can balance the budget. There is simply too much money in it for our elected reps from both sides and their cronies.

The people who believe in the right, stubbornly clings to the hope or myth that the GOP still cares about fiscal responsibility and fair taxation. LOL I know right?
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Old 05-30-2019, 08:42 PM
 
20,955 posts, read 8,674,856 times
Reputation: 14050
Quote:
Originally Posted by travis t View Post
There are many strange beliefs spouted behind closed doors. I recall as a young student attending a seminar at a Christian college where a prof (and successful businessman) spewed about the Warburgs, Rothchilds, etc.

Only rarely are these strange beliefs actually transformed into action. They tend not to pencil out, and cooler heads prevail. When they do transform, it is usually a result of mental illness and/or drugs, as with the case of Jonestown.

We've had a peaceful transition of power every four years since 1800, and no attempts yet to install "THEM in total power."

You give a bunch of names but no quotes from any advocating the overthrow of religious freedom.
Maybe you didn't read the links or about the Founder and the head of the Family.

The names I have given are sworn members...many for decades. Some have been involved in, for example, actually helping other countries to enact the death penalty for gay folks. Many have been directly involved and prayed with Despots....who are members. Since the Lord appoints Leaders, a Despot is not a Despot and Mark Sanford did not cheat on his wife and Sen. Ensign didn't get involved in funny with (and sex too!) his best friends.....

None of this matters at all to the Family. By definition, those selected are about the Laws of Men. In other words, they can be fine Christians worthy of top government leadership whist involved in any form of either "sin" of God or sin of Man....doesn't matter which.

Here are some Direct Quotes from the head of the Family......this is not "junk" - this is the vision:
“You know Jesus said ‘You got to put Him before mother-father-brother sister’? Hitler, Lenin, Mao, that’s what they taught the kids. Mao even had the kids killing their own mother and father. But it wasn’t murder. It was for building the new nation. The new kingdom.”

“Jesus says, ‘You have to put Me before other people, and you have to put Me before yourself.’ Hitler, that was the demand of the Nazi Party. You have to put the Nazi Party and its objectives in front of your own life and ahead of other people!”

“I’ve seen pictures of young men in the Red Guard of China, a table laid out like a butcher table, they would bring in this young man’s mother and father, lay her on the table with a basket on the end, he would take an axe and cut her head off.
“They have to put the purposes of the Red Guard ahead of the mother-father-brother-sister—their own life!

“That was a covenant. A pledge. That was what Jesus said.”"

THIS is the covenant the Pol Members of the Family bring to politics.

"David Coe, Doug’s son and heir apparent, [b]proclaimed to Family members that they “‘are here to learn how to rule the world’”. This rhetoric reflects Christian dominionism, a wing of fundamentalist Christianity that insists that Old Testament law should rule all areas of life. It’s a biblical version of Sharia law, something that Jesus, as revealed in the Gospels, never advocated.

These are not some Alex Jones fringe whatadoodle come-and-go lightweight pols. They are many of the most influential politicians in our country....AND, some have been in power for decades.

You can fool yourself about "every found years" but that is not the way it works. The SCOTUS is already packed. When any regular pol gets elected to office they are quickly marched into a room and told exactly what they CANNOT do. My wife won a seat on the local council and that was the FIRST thing they did.

The moment she tried to do something decent "for the people", she received and threatening call from the Country District Attorney warning her not to disclose what she knew (multi-million dollar land deals the state was buying off the local pols and connected people) "or else" he was going to come after her hard.

It's all good and well to assume innocence but the system does not work that way. These people are well on the way toward many parts of their agenda and they will not be stopped by an election.
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Old 06-01-2019, 12:18 PM
 
Location: Clyde Hill, WA
6,061 posts, read 2,010,801 times
Reputation: 2167
Quote:
Originally Posted by craigiri View Post
Maybe you didn't read the links or about the Founder and the head of the Family.

The names I have given are sworn members...many for decades. Some have been involved in, for example, actually helping other countries to enact the death penalty for gay folks. Many have been directly involved and prayed with Despots....who are members. Since the Lord appoints Leaders, a Despot is not a Despot and Mark Sanford did not cheat on his wife and Sen. Ensign didn't get involved in funny with (and sex too!) his best friends.....

None of this matters at all to the Family. By definition, those selected are about the Laws of Men. In other words, they can be fine Christians worthy of top government leadership whist involved in any form of either "sin" of God or sin of Man....doesn't matter which.

Here are some Direct Quotes from the head of the Family......this is not "junk" - this is the vision:
“You know Jesus said ‘You got to put Him before mother-father-brother sister’? Hitler, Lenin, Mao, that’s what they taught the kids. Mao even had the kids killing their own mother and father. But it wasn’t murder. It was for building the new nation. The new kingdom.”

“Jesus says, ‘You have to put Me before other people, and you have to put Me before yourself.’ Hitler, that was the demand of the Nazi Party. You have to put the Nazi Party and its objectives in front of your own life and ahead of other people!”

“I’ve seen pictures of young men in the Red Guard of China, a table laid out like a butcher table, they would bring in this young man’s mother and father, lay her on the table with a basket on the end, he would take an axe and cut her head off.
“They have to put the purposes of the Red Guard ahead of the mother-father-brother-sister—their own life!

“That was a covenant. A pledge. That was what Jesus said.”"

THIS is the covenant the Pol Members of the Family bring to politics.

"David Coe, Doug’s son and heir apparent, [b]proclaimed to Family members that they “‘are here to learn how to rule the world’”. This rhetoric reflects Christian dominionism, a wing of fundamentalist Christianity that insists that Old Testament law should rule all areas of life. It’s a biblical version of Sharia law, something that Jesus, as revealed in the Gospels, never advocated.

These are not some Alex Jones fringe whatadoodle come-and-go lightweight pols. They are many of the most influential politicians in our country....AND, some have been in power for decades.

You can fool yourself about "every found years" but that is not the way it works. The SCOTUS is already packed. When any regular pol gets elected to office they are quickly marched into a room and told exactly what they CANNOT do. My wife won a seat on the local council and that was the FIRST thing they did.

The moment she tried to do something decent "for the people", she received and threatening call from the Country District Attorney warning her not to disclose what she knew (multi-million dollar land deals the state was buying off the local pols and connected people) "or else" he was going to come after her hard.

It's all good and well to assume innocence but the system does not work that way. These people are well on the way toward many parts of their agenda and they will not be stopped by an election.
OK, thanks for the reply. I'm not worried about "The Family" taking over any more than I'm worried about the Masons or Moonies. I will worry when a repeal of the 1st Amendment appears imminent, but I don't expect that any time soon, nor would very many conservatives support it.
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